U.S. Air power: WW II to present - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

ASaltyDog · #1 05-23-2007, 05:44 PM

Very cool pics. Note the F15 is flying right at it's MCAS and is about to fall out of the sky. The guy in the P38 is about to poop in his pants as he's the only guy in the world that's survived a P38 for more than 200 hours and he figures his time is near. The Mustang used to be owned by Frank Borman sold to Alan Alders, now I hear a gun importer bought it. F15 guy is screaming at the Mustang to pour it on, who refuses because he can't afford a new motor

R Leo · #2 05-23-2007, 06:02 PM

I've always wondered how many aircraft and what percentage of the total production were lost on ferry flights to the European theatre.

Jim B. · #3 05-23-2007, 06:28 PM

Those are really cool pictures, to see history in the air like that. It's thrilling to hear, too.

The P38 tailfins were the direct inspiration for the 1948 and up Cadillac tailfins.

BENZ-LGB · #4 05-23-2007, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim B.

The P38 tailfins were the direct inspiration for the 1948 and up Cadillac tailfins.

Yep...

The tailfin era of automobile styling encompassed the 1950s and 1960s, peaking between 1958 and 1960. It was a style developed in the United States but spread its influence worldwide, as cars designed in all parts of the world picked up styling trends from the American automobile industry.

General Motors design chief Harley Earl is generally credited for the automobile tailfin, introducing small fins on the 1948 Cadillac. Harley credited the look of World War II fighter aircraft for his inspiration, particularly the twin-tailed P-38 Lightning.

click here for the full article. (Check out the pic of the fintail Benz

)

Cadillac tail fins

t walgamuth · #5 05-23-2007, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R Leo

I've always wondered how many aircraft and what percentage of the total production were lost on ferry flights to the European theatre.

you may know that the alcan highway was originally built for the planes being flown to europe to follow. the idea was if there was a problem they could land on the highway. this way they could fly to europe pretty much all over land.

i suppose some were also shipped knocked down on boats.

tom w

kramlavud · #6 05-23-2007, 09:04 PM

Maybe, but my guess is that these 3 have practiced this earlier, and know exactly where they are in relation to each other. It is the camera's telephoto lens that makes them seem too close to each other.
regards,
Mark

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASaltyDog

Very cool pics. Note the F15 is flying right at it's MCAS and is about to fall out of the sky. The guy in the P38 is about to poop in his pants as he's the only guy in the world that's survived a P38 for more than 200 hours and he figures his time is near. The Mustang used to be owned by Frank Borman sold to Alan Alders, now I hear a gun importer bought it. F15 guy is screaming at the Mustang to pour it on, who refuses because he can't afford a new motor

BENZ-LGB · #7 05-23-2007, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kramlavud

Maybe, but my guess is that these 3 have practiced this earlier, and know exactly where they are in relation to each other. It is the camera's telephoto lens that makes them seem too close to each other.
regards,
Mark

Yes, they do practice.

Steve Hinton, who was piloting the Glacier Girl, has flown these kinds of formations many times before.

I did not use a long telephoto, to avoid the flattening effect of a long tele lens.

I pushed the "film" speed (it is a digital SLR, but you can change the ISO) and closed the lens down as far as I could. Both of these actions tend to further diminish the telephote effect. If you notice, all three planes are in fairly sharp focus (that's the result of a narrow lens opening).

The planes were in very close formation.

WVOtoGO · #8 05-23-2007, 11:09 PM

The F-15E is 63 feet long. The P-51 is 32 feet long.

They are not as close as they look in the picture.

BENZ-LGB · #9 05-23-2007, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WVOtoGO

The F-15E is 63 feet long. The P-51 is 32 feet long.

They are not as close as they look in the picture.

Well, then how close were they?

I was there, and while they were not flying wing tip to wing tip, they nevertheless flew in a very tight formation.

These guys are no Blue Angels, or Thunderbirds, but they did fly in very close formation.

The F-15 is twice as long as the P-51. At 37 (or 38 feet) the P-38 and the P-51 are pretty close in size. The proportions ar ento that far off in the pic.

WVOtoGO · #10 05-24-2007, 12:10 AM

You’re right. Because the Mustang and the Lightening are quite a bit closer to you than the 15 is. The 15 is a good 200'+ behind them.

It's very hard to judge the distance between aircraft when you’re looking at them from the side and from the ground. Unless you happen to be looking straight up as they fly directly overhead, depth perception is near impossible.

When Mustangs get anywhere near modern jet fighter aircraft, they get tiny, fast.

Care to guess which aircraft in this picture is actually closest to the camera?

One thing you will notice in most every air show where slower aircraft are grouped with faster aircraft. The faster aircraft will pass blind to the slower. In other words, the slower aircraft can see the faster aircraft passing. But the faster aircraft will often loose sight of the slower aircraft being passed.

Like in this photo (see the link). The 15 and the 22 are actually about 75+ feet over the Mustang.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/7259625@N07/443007074/

Another thing to note: When the newer jet aircraft do pose in “tight” formation with vintage war birds, they usually are not running clean. They have gear/flaps/brakes/slats/etc. extended.

You’ll also notice the faster aircraft being further out in the fly-by arc as they pass. They really are not flying what looks like a straight shot down the runway in front of the crowd. They are flying an arc, with the faster aircraft further out. This give the allusion of a straight line being flown in front of the crowd and thus gives the crowd more time to see the aircraft appearing together. (for photo ops).

You've taken a great photo there. Just go with that.

Mistress · #11 05-26-2007, 06:48 PM

What a great article, it gave me goose bumps. It also helps to live on the flight path to Reagan National with planes flying over all day and night....

WVOtoGO · #12 05-23-2007, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASaltyDog

Very cool pics. Note the F15 is flying right at it's MCAS and is about to fall out of the sky. The guy in the P38 is about to poop in his pants as he's the only guy in the world that's survived a P38 for more than 200 hours and he figures his time is near. The Mustang used to be owned by Frank Borman sold to Alan Alders, now I hear a gun importer bought it. F15 guy is screaming at the Mustang to pour it on, who refuses because he can't afford a new motor

Don’t you mean VMC or maybe VS1??
And ,yes. Mark is correct. The telephoto lens used in the shot makes them appear much closer to each other than they really are.

And Charles Hall (and his wife Evelyne) is the owner of Six-Shooter (N2580). Before that it belonged to Aero Classics in Daytona from 92 to 95. Prior to that it was Dick Korff‘s 82-92, and before that, Neil McClain’s in Alberta.

BTW - Frank Borman’s P-51 was Su Su II. Named after his wife Susan.
Now 50FS, is with Lewis Aeronautical in San Antonio. When it’s not with
David's Vintage Wings based at Lafayette, LA.

It’s a mad world of P-51s out there. Hard to keep up with who owns what and/or who flys who’s P-51 when.

Here’s a shot of Charles “Chuck” on the wing.

t walgamuth · #13 05-23-2007, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASaltyDog

Very cool pics. Note the F15 is flying right at it's MCAS and is about to fall out of the sky. The guy in the P38 is about to poop in his pants as he's the only guy in the world that's survived a P38 for more than 200 hours and he figures his time is near. The Mustang used to be owned by Frank Borman sold to Alan Alders, now I hear a gun importer bought it. F15 guy is screaming at the Mustang to pour it on, who refuses because he can't afford a new motor

LOL

tom w