US "War on terror"... has failed - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

yal · #16 07-19-2007, 09:48 AM

War on terror has not failed, war in Iraq has. There is no such thing as victory in an insurgent war. I wish he would get it through his thick skull

Medmech · #17 07-19-2007, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yal

War on terror has not failed, war in Iraq has. There is no such thing as victory in an insurgent war. I wish he would get it through his thick skull

Download The Art of War audiobook which is better than the text IMo because it includes quotes about the book from Generals and Leaders that correlates it to modern times, Colon Powell was a Art of War student.

Sun Tzu's philosphy was not to destroy an Army because of the insurgency risk.

Google Art of War mp3 its everywhere I will try and find the 4 part link that is the best version IMO and its a legal download.

tankdriver · #18 07-19-2007, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emmerich

In that one respect, it is like Vietnam: a local population that is caught in the middle of missionary democracy no one asked if they wanted.

Fixed your post.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Howitzer

As much as I whole heartedly disagree with almost all of the tactics used by the Bush admin after Afghanistan I also disagree that the war on terror is lost. We have not had an attack on US soil since 9-11 and many plots and attempted attacks have been foiled due the the excellent job the Border Patrol, Customs and Coast Guard have been doing to prevent the flow of explosives into the US. The gas pipeline attack was delayed because of the lack of heavy explosives, the Brooklyn bridge bomber was arrested because the FBI was on its toes, there are many more and many unreported incidents.

Blanket statements are irrational on a complex subject like terrorism.

OBL doesn't mean didly squat if he were to die or be found tomorrow the only thing that would be diffrent is the headlines.

A while back, on the Sunday morning ABC show, George Will said something like, 'I never thought these words would come out of my mouth, but I agree with John Kerry. Law enforcement is the best way to combat terrorism.' I couldn't agree more, and I think the article is more about policy, if you can call it that.

GermanStar · #19 07-19-2007, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmac2012

Talk $h!t.

It's been well documented that OBL hated Saddam, who was a secularist. Saddam's ties to Al Qaeda were not large, a few Al Qaedians were in Iraq, I imagine Saddam met with a few -- keep your friends close and your enemies closer . . . .

Bush and Cheney have poured, at great expense, an enormous amount of fuel of the fire and have given OBL the propaganda coup of his dreams.

Who would'a thought: arrogant pompous ass OBL outwits the Dubya-meister.

That's right. With very few exceptions, the "Al Qaeda" in Iraq were not Al Qaeda before we invaded Iraq. Thus the perception that we're "fighting Al Qaeda in Iraq" is flawed and self-serving.

Medmech · #20 07-19-2007, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GermanStar

That's right. With very few exceptions, the "Al Qaeda" in Iraq were not Al Qaeda before we invaded Iraq. Thus the perception that we're "fighting Al Qaeda in Iraq" is flawed and self-serving.

Al Qaeda is a blanket term used by the media and the government to put a name something so us mindless drones have something to think about.

OTOH there is a constant flow of militants coming from Iran, Syria, Sudan, Turkey, Afghanistan and even the USofA, if that is not "fighting Al Qeuda in Iraq" I don't know what is.

Medmech · #21 07-19-2007, 10:21 AM

Al-Qaeda (also al-Qaida or al-Qa'ida or al-Qa'idah) (Arabic: القاعدة‎ al-qāʕida, translation: The Base) is an international alliance of militant Sunni jihadist organizations. Its roots can be traced back to Osama bin Laden and others around the time of the Soviet withdrawal from Afghanistan in 1989.[1] Al-Qaeda's objectives include the end of foreign influence in Muslim countries and the creation of a new Islamic caliphate. Al-Qaeda was supported, trained and funded with billions of dollars by the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) of the US government to fight against the invading Soviet armies in the Soviet war in Afghanistan [citation needed].

raymr · #22 07-19-2007, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Howitzer

Al-Qaeda (also al-Qaida or al-Qa'ida or al-Qa'idah) (Arabic: القاعدة‎ al-qāʕida, translation: The Base) is an international alliance of militant Sunni jihadist organizations. Its roots can be traced back to Osama bin Laden and others around the time of the Soviet withdrawal from Afghanistan in 1989.[1] Al-Qaeda's objectives include the end of foreign influence in Muslim countries and the creation of a new Islamic caliphate. Al-Qaeda was supported, trained and funded with billions of dollars by the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) of the US government to fight against the invading Soviet armies in the Soviet war in Afghanistan [citation needed].

In other words, a creature of our own making.

A264172 · #23 07-19-2007, 10:34 AM

Sorry about the Yellow title, just trying to sell papers.

Though it is tempting to talk about the Bush admin's policys in Iraq, this thread was ment to point out the policy situation in western Pakistan.

It is akin to Hitler retreting to Hungury after WWII and the 'allies' being unwilling/unable to persue him.

“We have to change policy,” said Representative Mike Rogers of Michigan, a Republican member of the House Intelligence Committee who has long advocated a more aggressive American intelligence campaign in Pakistan.

In an interview on Tuesday, the New York Police commissioner, Raymond W. Kelly, called the report a “realistic and sobering assessment,” but said it had not caused officials in New York to take any specific steps to tighten security in the city.

“There is no surprise here for us,” he said. “Would we rather it be another way? Yes. But this is the world, as it is, and this is what we are guarding against.”

Aside from police work and 'home' security efforts, is Bush policy here significantly different from Clintons policy toward this group?

Perhaps more importantly, is there a better policy and what is it?

GermanStar · #24 07-19-2007, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Howitzer

Al Qaeda is a blanket term used by the media and the government to put a name something so us mindless drones have something to think about.

OTOH there is a constant flow of militants coming from Iran, Syria, Sudan, Turkey, Afghanistan and even the USofA, if that is not "fighting Al Qeuda in Iraq" I don't know what is.

Allow me to clarify. Yes, it is fighting Al Qaeda, but it is not fighting the terrorists who attacked us on 9-11, which is the perception that the Bush administration favors.

Medmech · #25 07-19-2007, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GermanStar

Allow me to clarify. Yes, it is fighting Al Qaeda, but it is not fighting the terrorists who attacked us on 9-11, which is the perception that the Bush administration favors.

The terrorist that attacked up on 9-11 are died when the planes crashed; we are now killing thier friends and allies with similar wishes.

Medmech · #26 07-19-2007, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raymr

In other words, a creature of our own making.

Not really because it was already a group that a change of heart.

GermanStar · #27 07-19-2007, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Howitzer

The terrorist that attacked up on 9-11 are died when the planes crashed; we are now killing thier friends and allies with similar wishes.

If you don't want to get the point I'm making, you never will. Their friends are not in Iraq. They are still safe in Afghanistan and Pakistan.

GermanStar · #28 07-19-2007, 10:42 AM

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Originally Posted by raymr

In other words, a creature of our own making.

The creature in Iraq certainly is.

Medmech · #29 07-19-2007, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GermanStar

If you don't want to get the point I'm making, you never will.

I know what point you are trying to make but I am pointing out that it's a shallow one. With your logic the bad guys are a small group that wanted to kill Americans but the fact of the matter is it's a large group in many countries that want to continue killing Americans that is why we are killing them over there instead of letting them kill themselves with suicide bombs on American soil.

Medmech · #30 07-19-2007, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GermanStar

The creature in Iraq certainly is.

Are these creatures Iraqi? What is the demographic of most of the insurgents.

Pie charts and real numbers would be nice.