I don't know any other way to explain it. I had a friend dig a pool once. We hit a water main. Once capped, he sunk a pump, cleared the hole and kept digging. Different situation, I just can't wrap my head around making such a massive trench to drain a basement--not criticizing--just don't get it.

In another example, I have some duck holes that I flood from time to time. Instead of installing culverts/trucks/gates, we pump them. Cheaper, less time consuming and no additional big holes in the ground.

The excavated trench is for a hallway to a door on a ledge of the cliff. Drains will be laid in this prior to the floor pour.

The plan is to be 'somewhat off the grid'. The structure is designed and will be positioned to take advantage of passive heating and cooling.
Temp of the sub soil at the basemnt floor depth remains a constant 72f.
The open end of the tunnel that I trenched will take advantage of a cool breeze that comes from the valley below.
There will be a tremendous thermal mass within the living space to stabilize temp swings.

I could have pumped the hole dry. But, I didn't have a pump, did have a backhoe and, needed the trench there anyway.

This afternoon I dug and moved two more loads of rock. One huge boulder that must have been 4 feet around. Almost never got it loaded on the truck.

That would be one heavy rock.

The urbanite wall looks pretty good but I am still wondering how it could be denser than limestone.

Tom W

__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

Tom, I've noticed the limestone that I've dug and leave on the surface for a few weeks has cracked. I'm thinking there must be some shinkage as it drys from the exposure. The deeper stuff coming out looks much harder and I don't see a problem with it (yet). Still, I just don't trust it long term.

I got news late yesterday that the 700 cf of urbanite deal fell thru. I was directed to the source by the county. Now it seems the county wants it and is taking it all. There's no integrity anymore. Oh well...
The stuff is all over the place and I can offer a free place to dump if needed.
What I don't use for walls will go towards fill in low areas. I've plenty of good topsoil in a dry pond in the valley I can place on top.

The limestone could be crush tested for strength.

The urbanite will slowly deteriorate and (good) limestone will deteriorate much slower and will simply weather on the surface a bit while the concrete will eventually crumble away.

The cracks might be layers of weaker stone between good hard layers (now that is just pure specualtion on my part).

I just can't bear to see a lot of limestone go unused! It would have to be pretty bad to be weaker than concrete. The cracking idea is a new one for me, but if you have a conversation with a stone expert they may be able to tell you all about it.

I am with you on the gravity drain. It will only leak with a pump if the power goes out.....and the power WILL go out sooner or later, and if you are out in the boonies it will probably go out sooner.

Tom W

__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

Dude that cleared it up, crystal Sounds very cool.

I have used and prefer the PWF, permanent wood foundation, and have used the Superior Walls product. If you can't get your arms around putting wood into the ground, go with the S/W. You can also get the S/W in 10' height. I know this, I have talked and tried to reason with people why the wood was equal if not better and now realize that some people still belong to the flat earth society. Ultimately, go with what makes you comfortable. BTW, no poured conrete basement walls for me, ever! PM me if you want more info on the PWF.

After considering all that could go wrong with the foundation I think I'll go with poured concrete.

Maybe with a little planning the form material can be used for framing/walls recouping some of the inital expense.

Concrete is currently running around $100/cu yd. If I pour an 8 foot tall wall, 8 inches thick I figure around 37 cu yards. Add in the cost of rebar and I still think I'll be within the budget if I can re-use the form material.

There may just happen to be a NTX MB GTG the day of the pour.

I'm nearly half way done with the excavation. More really big rocks coming out of the hole.

Many setbacks on the excavation lately. The new TD is somewhat of a distraction plus digging in rock is really hard on the old backhoe. Sat I repaired a busted pin that mounts the hoe to the tractor. Later that day a hyd cylinder developes a leak.

Last week I had a guy come out and give me an estimate for finishing the hole out with his Cat trackhoe. He never called back. As soon as they hear or see "rock" their gone, never to be heard of again.

Oh well... too hot to pour cement anyway.

I guess your heart attack scare turned out OK?

Tom W

__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

It seems so... I go back for a followup tomorrow. No one seems to know what the heck it was. I've had very little faith in health care. Even more so now.

Stress can cause tightness in the chest.

Although I have never had any heart issues when being examined at the docs office, when I was on the school board once after a stressful meeting I had tightness in my chest.

I thought WTF? This is so not worth it. I determined not to let things bother me so much.

Tom W

__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.