Shop around for prices and look at the product. Replacing the entire window can get expensive if you hire someone like me to do it. However this is the most "correct" way to do it and maintains the window size. Replacement windows (read inserts) are great but they do reduce the size of the window due to the new frame going into the old frame. Vinyl replacements can be chunky/bulky and look heavy, etc. Andersen is making a new replacement window that is actually inexpensive at about $220 each for a lowE tilt wash double hung setup. Pella makes a nice unit too, an old customer of mine opted for a complete Pella refit for about $10K on a raised ranch. A dedicated window company will have better prices than a general contractor.

I can attest to the value of upgrading from old single panes and storms. My house had that setup and then it was fitting with vinyl replacements, by the previous owner, my father-in-law. The house has electric heat and the KWH dropped by 25% after the upgrade. More than worth it, less drafty too. RT

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When all else fails, vote from the rooftops!
84' Mercedes Benz 300D Anthracite/black, 171K
03' Volkswagen Jetta TDI blue/black, 93K
93' Chevrolet C2500HD ExCab 6.5TD, Two-tone blue, 252K

2 neighbors had Pella windows installed several years ago and have had nothing buy trouble with leaks and rotting of the stiles, sills, etc.

Pella's response is to refuse to honor the warranty and refer them to a local Pella contractor who demands 50% above the going rate in advance and then installs the same stuff that rotted out previously.

Pella evidently has been taken over by a conglomerate that has reduced quality to a minimum and refuses to honor the warranty given by Pella for windows manufactured and installed by previous owners/management.

Consider yourself lucky that you were dealing with the young gal and weren't in one of the six facade programs that this old guy is currently administering. We don't allow any replacements unless the existing are so far gone that rehabilitation is impossible, and then we typically replace only the sash, with replica sash (single glazed) from one of our local window shops.

I fully realize that we live in a plastic, throw away society but that doesn't mean that I have to follow suit. Vinyl windows, for the most part, have a design life of 12-15 years and the Lifetime warranties they come with aren't worth the paper they are written on.

I recently had to replace 38 ten year old junk vinyl windows that had been installed in one of my rental buildings just prior to my buying the building. I told the seller at the closing that I would have paid 20K more for the building if he had not done the "window replacement" that he touted as a major selling point. Fortunately he didn't damage the original jambs and sills beyond repair and I was able to make the repairs and have replica sash made. With the installation of decent quality storm/screens the fenestration now looks as it should, and is now more energy efficient than the vinyl crap we took out.

A large part of my business is administering housing rehabilitation programs. We oversee rehab of 150+ single family homes a year and find that we are having to replace more and more vinyl windows that are only 10-15 years old.

One last point; unless older wood windows are literally falling apart, replacing them has the poorest ROI of almost any energy conservation measure.

Jim

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2005 C240 4matic wagon (daily driver)
87 190D - 225K (on loan)
85 190D - 312K (on loan)
2011 Subaru Legacy AWD (Wife's)

For us, replacing old wood windows with vinyl, was a no-brainer - and energy conservation was just a minor selling point. Did ours about 8 years ago, and I'd do it again in a second.

In addition to saving $30-50/month on heating and A/C, we gained two benefits that were worth the change, even were there no monthly savings.

Our home is now quiet - we can't hear a thing from the outside world. No more road noise, and the screaming rugrats that fill our family friendly neighborhood, no longer make me think of solutions I can't discuss here.

Second - they function just like the day they were installed. They are near impervious to heat/cold/humidity, and just plain work.

I don't doubt for a second, the experiences you've mentioned. But, there are tons of manufacturers, tons of installers, and geographic and weather concerns that don't apply to everyone. "All vinyl is bad", is simply too general a statement.

Very true, but there are big differences between manufacturers in this regard.

Last home we had, we replaced all the aluminum windows with Vinyl inserts by Simonton. The frames were left in place, but the vinyl inserts had an extremely low profile - we lost less than 1" around the perimeter. Other insert manufacturers we looked at, were far more obtrusive. I'm sure there are many more options today.

We've kept in touch with the folks we sold to, and those windows are now about 12 years old - still working great for them, albeit in a relatively temperate CA climate.

When you compare the cost saving in utility bills between unrepaired wood windows with no storms and new vinyl windows that is not the same as comparing it to refurbished wood windows with properly installed storm windows.

That would be the fair comparison but there is no practical way to do it.

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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

Single hung windows suck IMHO. The house I have that were trying to sell has a set of original 1927 single hung, with a nice storm window setup put on probably 15 years ago. They are lose as can be, you can actualy rattle them when they are latched, weather stripping? Whats that. Sure they lasted 90 years but they are lose as can be and leak a lot of heat. Plus you have to strip and repaint them, I don't want to do that or pay for it.

If I was keeping it I would replace them with some vinyle double hungs.

If you want a good wood window and don't mind spending some money, Marvin's are pretty nice:
http://www.marvin.com/?page=double_hung

Thats like something we would use if we were building a million and a half dollar house.

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2016 Corvette Stingray 2LT
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200

What is the comparison with wood windows and storms versus a decent new window.......say Anderson double hung.......with regard to energy efficiency?

I'd presume that the storm does the majority of the work with regard to limiting airflow and the three inch space between the two windows is superior to the 1/2" space on the double glazed Andersens.

Be interesting to see a side by side comparison, although it's difficult due to the lack of any data on the wood window/storm window combo.

And, why would that be?

How many folks actually use the upper sash?

I hardly ever open the windows to start with, in order to keep the humidity out. My single hungs, can tilt in, so if I ever am tempted to wash the outside of the top window, I can do it from the inside.

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It is a truism that almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so. Robert A. Heinlein


09 Jetta TDI
1985 300D

I ment single pane; I actualy like single hung with half screens I think the bottoms open better, and they are tighter.

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2016 Corvette Stingray 2LT
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200

I say that ANY double glazed modern window is superior in every possible way to an old single pane with triple tracks. There is no way the 3" airspace is better than the 1/2" in the double glazed. Two reasons: The storms/triple tracks are not completely sealed at their perimeter, they have moisture drains, etc. The single pane double hungs also do not have particularly good sash seals, etc. so drafts are common complaints. When you do tighten up old windows they then are usually too tight to operate if the wood swells a bit. So in winter they are loose in the dry air and summer they swell and don't open or close. A modern double glazed window is completely sealed with either a vacuum or an inert gas between the panels. I have toured a Guardian Glass plant and seen them being made. Its really pretty impressive. Well all know how well a vacuum thermos works, its the same principle. The modern materials in the seals on the sashes is also light years ahead of any old window.

I've installed more new windows than I care to mention. In each and every case the result is less drafts, better insulation, less noise, etc. all leading to more comfort. Unless you are restricted by the local hysterical (historical) nazis you would be insane not to upgrade if possible.

Never done a Pella but haven't heard any negative things about them around here yet. Time will tell though if they have cheapened the product.

RT

__________________
When all else fails, vote from the rooftops!
84' Mercedes Benz 300D Anthracite/black, 171K
03' Volkswagen Jetta TDI blue/black, 93K
93' Chevrolet C2500HD ExCab 6.5TD, Two-tone blue, 252K

The last 6-plex we built, we used Pella. The last personal home remodel, we used Andersen windowalls. If I were building another personal residence, I would probably go with Jeld-Wen.

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'06 E320 CDI
'17 Corvette Stingray Vert

Infiltration is the primary energy loss with double hung windows, it is the nature of the beast. I have seen blower door tests performed on housing units with both new insert vinyl windows, and rehabilitated weather-stripped 100 year old double hung windows, with equal results. Add a decent quality storm and the old window becomes more energy efficient.

When performing energy audits we find the ROI (return on investment) in energy savings when replacing even poor wood double hung windows with vinyl replacements stretches out to years, very often beyond the design life of the replacement units.

Jim

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2005 C240 4matic wagon (daily driver)
87 190D - 225K (on loan)
85 190D - 312K (on loan)
2011 Subaru Legacy AWD (Wife's)

Well, I have not done any infiltration tests. In my experience though, the wood window with a good storm will not match the new quality window on infiltration. In my personal experience though, the windows on my old home and on my old office building were huge by modern standards. over three feet wide and over seven feet tall. Most window manufacturers will not even make a dh window that big and any other style even less so.

The cost of a new quality custom made window that big is just staggering, and you have to get very very precise measurements because ordering the wrong size is a big big hassle.

If you assume that the windows in an old structure are all the same size you will meet with disaster as in many cases they made the opening and then made the windows to fit. They look like the same size but don't try to swap sashes from one to another.

And while the old window properly refurbished and equipped with a good storm may not match a new window for thermal performance, they are pretty good, and that is only one part of the equation in making a selection. Longivity and historical correctness is also a factor. Historic houses that were scorned thirty or forty years ago are now prized.

You really have to look at everything to make an informed decision.

__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.