I agree with most of your perspectives. I am all for a more unified globe and I am not a "flagman" to begin with. Frankly I wouldn't have the boldness to do what this woman did and hang up the flag in given fashion. But I respect her for doing what she did and I wouldn't selfhandedly take it down as it was done. That's where the mis behavior comes into play.

Personally, I rather wear a flag pin on my personal apparel.

The most prominent mistake I encounter in association with the Stars and Stripes is the ideological parallell to military, war, bombs etc. De facto the flag stands for a lot more than just that.

However, it may not have been proper to put it up in the firs place, but it was more inappropriate to take it down in the absence of its owner and without her consent. That's a property violation right there, esp. in the corporate environment.

Take your Oath, DA and you will know what it means. Natural born citizens don't take oaths, they pledge or better they are tought to pledge. If you do take the oath, you will know what it means. There might be hundreds more in the room, but it is between you and the flag only.

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Well I suppose that's a reasonable response. If it were my car I wouldn't even ask you to take it down, I'd take it down myself because it's on my property. As to the original story, it would help to see some pictures of what actually happened. Perhaps the story has been a little exaggerated to elicit the kind of emotional responses that we've seen here. If I were the boss in that office, I'd probably be OK with the flag if the employee first asked for my permission and it wasn't in anyone's way or view. I have nothing against the flag and have one or two at home for special occasions, but I still find it rather inappropriate to place a big flag at your workplace without even consulting anyone. Makes me wonder what that woman was trying to prove or compensate for. Just because it's the flag doesn't mean you can just place it anywhere you want, like my wrapped car example demonstrates.

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2004 VW Jetta TDI (manual)

Past MB's: '96 E300D, '83 240D, '82 300D, '87 300D, '87 420SEL

I agree and that's the problem with flags sometimes. People often use them to put others in difficult spots, like support the war or you're anti-American. That's partly why I'm not a huge flagman myself.

I did take the oath, and I'm aware the flag represents much more than support for some stupid war. Unfortunately it seems not everyone thinks that way.

__________________
2004 VW Jetta TDI (manual)

Past MB's: '96 E300D, '83 240D, '82 300D, '87 300D, '87 420SEL

All businesses should have an Employee Handbook, handed out to each new hire as they "come on board" - and at the end of each handbook, there usually is a page that asks the new hire to sign and turn it in to the HR Dept. attesting to the fact that they (the new hire) actually read the handbook and understood what the handbook said.

One of three things happened...

#1.) Said hire didn't really read the handbook, signed the paper, handed it in and became another "company clam" - causing no problems and pretended they were a little mushroom...locked away in their dark little cubicle, higher-ups shoveling more 5hit on them and they, not complaining...

#2.) Said hire didn't really read the handbook, brought in the flag, hung it on a pole in their area, another non-reader of the handbook took matters into their own hands, removed said flag and then...the fight was on...

#3.) Said hire read the handbook and found NOTHING in the handbook that addressed personal decorations (limits and the like) in their work-spaces. Offended co-worker crossed the line by taking said flag and pole down and disrespectfully laying the flag on the ground...hospital reacted in a totally unprofessional manner and now has egg sprayed all over everyone 'cause someone forgot to turn off the "PR Fan" that was left on "Hot and Heavy" ...

The way this SHOULD have been handled was both parties should have been brought into the HR office, sat down and required to write out their grievance against one another...then HR should have had a few meetings to reach the compromise to keep civility within the work area and issued any Disciplinary Actions, where required and backed up by company WRITTEN policy...

IMMEDIATELY, HR should have then gone back, researched and lawyer-proofed the addendum that would have then gone out outlining in distinct and exacting language as to what's appropriate for decorations in the employees' immediate and personal work area, including limitations regarding excess BO and perfume and related minutia...

Hospital - 51% responsible for not having all the bases covered and reacting too late and inappropriately...
Flag H8r - 25% responsible for reacting inappropriately to the situation...
Flag Lover - 24% responsible for not going to HR to resolve the issue...

Unless it can be demonstrated that the flag and pole constituted a health and/or safety issue in the immediate area, the Flag H8R and HR reacted way out of line...

MO!

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M. G. Burg
'10 - Dakota SXT - Daily Ride / ≈ 172.5K
.'76 - 450SLC - 107.024.12 / < .89.20 K
..'77 - 280E - 123.033.12 / > 128.20 K
...'67 - El Camino - 283ci / > 207.00 K
....'75 - Yamaha - 650XS / < 21.00 K
.....'87 - G20 Sportvan / > 206.00 K
......'85 - 4WINNS 160 I.O. / 140hp
.......'74 - Honda CT70 / Real 125
.
“I didn’t really say everything I said.”
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ~ Yogi Berra ~

That's true. Or are the following ok?

1. Everyone who works here must only wear black and white suits or will be fired (IBM 1956)

2. For hygiene purposes, everyone here will wear clean cotton underwear and inspections may take place at any time.

3. I'm sorry, Stella, you can't eat any of your birthday cake, your body mass index is too high, you must keep to low fat food during the work day...

__________________
Strelnik
Invest in America: Buy a Congressman!

1950 170SD
1951 Citroen 11BN
1953 Citroen 11BNF limo
1953 220a project
1959 180D
1960 190D
1960 Borgward Isabella TS 2dr
1983 240D daily driver
1983 380SL
1990 350SDL daily driver alt
3 x Citroen DS21M, down from 5
3 x Citroen 2CV, down from 6

[QUOTE=mgburg;2212497]All businesses should have an Employee Handbook, handed out to each new hire as they "come on board" - and at the end of each handbook, there usually is a page that asks the new hire to sign and turn it in to the HR Dept. attesting to the fact that they (the new hire) actually read the handbook and understood what the handbook said.


Who says they have a handbook?

If they take away the handbook after you read it once, because of the signature page, how will you check on items in the future, when a question arises?

__________________
Strelnik
Invest in America: Buy a Congressman!

1950 170SD
1951 Citroen 11BN
1953 Citroen 11BNF limo
1953 220a project
1959 180D
1960 190D
1960 Borgward Isabella TS 2dr
1983 240D daily driver
1983 380SL
1990 350SDL daily driver alt
3 x Citroen DS21M, down from 5
3 x Citroen 2CV, down from 6

Has that ever happened? At least in my experience, the signature page is separate from the book and everyone keeps a copy of the book.

__________________
2004 VW Jetta TDI (manual)

Past MB's: '96 E300D, '83 240D, '82 300D, '87 300D, '87 420SEL

Treat you neighbor like a brother.

Wish we could have more of that.

?

I dont think you understand what I was saying.

Re read the story and replace the words "American Flag" with "Colored Material"

The story would not have made the papers if it was about anything else.

I don't regard our media too greatly overall, but I doubt the story would have made with just some colored material.

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I am not anti flag.

I am anti bigotry.

That's great! I don't see the bigotry in this case. On the other hand, I am sure there was a lot of "foreplay" among the persons involved and putting up the flag with Memorial Day weekend approaching, just blew the lids ....

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[QUOTE=strelnik;2212508]If you're working at a place that doesn't have a handbook for each employee, I'd be very careful about what's going on around there...particularly if you want to keep getting those bi-weekly insults called paychecks!

The point is: Most businesses have a handbook of company policies that they give to each new hire...it's theirs to keep and to do with what they want...eat it, use it for TP, worship it, quote it, whatever...and in the back of the handbook, there's USUALLY a signature page that the employee signs and gives back to the employer's HR Dept. Head or associate. Some places will even give the employee a copy of their signature page and will even sign their handbook to verifiy (pardon the pun) that everyone's on the "same page" with the company's policies.

And apparently, the hospital, the Flag H8r and the Flagster all didn't read their handbooks, didn't have their handbooks or one, or more, read the thing and the other(s) ignored it.

Also, it was a sloooooow news days in Duckburg...go figure...

__________________

M. G. Burg
'10 - Dakota SXT - Daily Ride / ≈ 172.5K
.'76 - 450SLC - 107.024.12 / < .89.20 K
..'77 - 280E - 123.033.12 / > 128.20 K
...'67 - El Camino - 283ci / > 207.00 K
....'75 - Yamaha - 650XS / < 21.00 K
.....'87 - G20 Sportvan / > 206.00 K
......'85 - 4WINNS 160 I.O. / 140hp
.......'74 - Honda CT70 / Real 125
.
“I didn’t really say everything I said.”
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ~ Yogi Berra ~