Khadafi gone in Libya - Page 4 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Botnst · #46 08-22-2011, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chas H

The Constitution allows for treaties.
Are you suggesting we ignore our treaties?

I am suggesting that no treaty agreement trumps the constitution of the United States. This is what it means to be an independent nation. For if a treaty trumps the constitution then the will of another country can be legally imposed on the United States.

pj67coll · #47 08-22-2011, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst

The current political parties decry it when the opposition president does it and sanctify it when their own boy does it.

Doesn't make it a good thing. Quite the opposite, IMO.

It's how those twin dim bulbs got us into Korea and Vietnam and a number of presidents before them got us into Panama, Philippines, Nicaragua, Costa Rica and goodness knows where else.

It's called Imperialism Bot. It's what empires do.

- Peter.

Hatterasguy · #48 08-22-2011, 10:04 PM

Well they seem to like us now, so when is a US oil company going to get a sweet heart contract?

I like to think of that $900 mill as an investment and expect a nice return on it, plus some good live fire training for the Navy!

It could be some of the cheapest and best money we ever spent, well compared to the other two wars.

Botnst · #49 08-22-2011, 10:05 PM

In terms of governance, is the bottom line, the bottom line?

sjh · #50 08-22-2011, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst

I am suggesting that no treaty agreement trumps the constitution of the United States. This is what it means to be an independent nation. For if a treaty trumps the constitution then the will of another country can be legally imposed on the United States.

I'm not sure that is true. We need an expert.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pj67coll

It's called Imperialism Bot. It's what empires do.

- Peter.

And there are times that it is the optimal approach.

We like to pretend everything follows the rules but during times of exceptional needs extra-ordinary actions are done.

I believe it has always and will always be so.

spdrun · #51 08-22-2011, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Well they seem to like us now, so when is a US oil company going to get a sweet heart contract?

You speak as if cheap oil continuing to poison the planet is a good thing. Oh yeah, and screw the oil companies with a sharp stick. Frankly, I hope radical Islamists take over Libya after foreign oil companies install themselves, and that their employees get taught a hard lesson (if they survive).

aklim · #52 08-22-2011, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Well they seem to like us now, so when is a US oil company going to get a sweet heart contract?

I like to think of that $900 mill as an investment and expect a nice return on it, plus some good live fire training for the Navy!

It could be some of the cheapest and best money we ever spent, well compared to the other two wars.

Will "they" be in power and if so, will "they" remember us and return the favor. That is the main question. "I love you, you love me", works well in the Barney world. Today, you are my BFF, tomorrow, you might just be scum of the earth.

Chas H · #53 08-22-2011, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst

I am suggesting that no treaty agreement trumps the constitution of the United States. This is what it means to be an independent nation. For if a treaty trumps the constitution then the will of another country can be legally imposed on the United States.

Which treaty trumps the constitution?

aklim · #54 08-22-2011, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spdrun

You speak as if cheap oil continuing to poison the planet is a good thing. Oh yeah, and screw the oil companies with a sharp stick.

Frankly, I hope radical Islamists take over Libya after foreign oil companies install themselves, and that their employees get taught a hard lesson (if they survive).

Such bitterness. Probably because you aren't one of the top few CEOs but you will continue to benefit from the cheap oil, won't you?

And with that new found wealth, they might just decide they can do things better than you and who knows? Maybe you bet find out which direction mecca is.

spdrun · #55 08-22-2011, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

Such bitterness. Probably because you aren't one of the top few CEOs but you will continue to benefit from the cheap oil, won't you?

I have no enmity for the CEOs of alternative energy companies, just for those who profit from the destructive oil economy.

Funny how the US has 5% of the world's population and uses 25+% of the world's oil. Conservation and alternative energy (yep, including nuclear) rather than continuous war should be the answers. Kudos to the European "enviro-whackos" (as someone on another thread here described them) for trying to change this situation by experimenting with alternative energies. While the situation in the US is coal, oil, coal, oil, ethanol which requires oil to produce, with a bit of alternative thrown in for window dressing.

Botnst · #56 08-22-2011, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sjh

I'm not sure that is true. We need an expert.

And there are times that it is the optimal approach.

We like to pretend everything follows the rules but during times of exceptional needs extra-ordinary actions are done.

I believe it has always and will always be so.

It is most certainly true. A treaty can never impose unconstitional effects. It can be rescinded by act of Congress and if so empowered by law, by the president. A treaty is a legal convenience. Thus, there is no, "international law." Instead we have a list of international conveniences which we may or may not wish to obey as the fancy strikes us.

In the final analysis, so-called "international law" requires that the subject nations either willingly acquiesce or that the nation is sufficiently weak that it can be militarily or economically compelled.

This is why an elected official in the United States federal government will never stand in the dock at the Hague unless the federal government agrees to allow it.

Botnst · #57 08-22-2011, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chas H

Which treaty trumps the constitution?

Read what i wrote.

aklim · #58 08-22-2011, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spdrun

just for those who profit from the destructive oil economy.

Funny how the US has 5% of the world's population and uses 25+% of the world's oil. Conservation and alternative energy (yep, including nuclear) rather than continuous war should be the answers. Kudos to the European "enviro-whackos" (as someone on another thread here described them) for trying to change this situation by experimenting with alternative energies. While the situation in the US is coal, oil, coal, oil, ethanol which requires oil to produce, with a bit of alternative thrown in for window dressing.

So who would that be? Pretty much everyone including you. Know of many industries that are not oil tainted? Even your clothes are oil tainted unless you are living in a shack in the middle of nowhere and in stone age fashion.

IF they are right, it is an EXPENSIVE proposition at 22X the price.

spdrun · #59 08-22-2011, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

So who would that be? Pretty much everyone including you. Know of many industries that are not oil tainted? Even your clothes are oil tainted unless you are living in a shack in the middle of nowhere and in stone age fashion.

IF they are right, it is an EXPENSIVE proposition at 22X the price.

All immature technologies are initially expensive. Price comes down as they're perfected -- that whole "economy of scale" thang...

aklim · #60 08-22-2011, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spdrun

All immature technologies are initially expensive. Price comes down as they're perfected -- that whole "economy of scale" thang...

No kidding. It will take a long time to bring it down to an affordable cost. Till then, keep it in an SMALL experimental area. 22X is way up there for implementation.

Besides. I'll let you spend YOUR money on perfecting it and buy it later when it is less expensive. In the meantime, you can go shoot yourself as part of the profiting party of the cheap oil. No need for firing squad.