Link for Hatt - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Botnst · #1 08-25-2011, 02:35 PM

I read this essay/analysis and thought you'd find it interesting:
http://www.hoover.org/publications/policy-review/article/87236

Perhaps others as well.

panZZer · #2 08-25-2011, 03:04 PM

Arrrgh.

Are U a Bot?

Hatterasguy · #3 08-25-2011, 04:44 PM

Awesome Bot! Thanks for the link!

Botnst · #4 08-25-2011, 07:04 PM

I am not Mr. Bot. I'm the Bot or you can call me Botster.

The Clk Man · #5 08-25-2011, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Botnst

I am not Mr. Bot. I'm the Bot or you can call me Botster.

How about "The Botness".

Hatterasguy · #6 08-25-2011, 08:19 PM

How about Botfly?!

andersbenz · #7 08-25-2011, 09:11 PM

Very interesting article

Beware the hardworking incompetent

Botnst · #8 08-25-2011, 09:15 PM

^^^ A useful comment and warning for any organization, not just the military.

t walgamuth · #9 08-25-2011, 10:39 PM

Good stuff!

Thanks for posting it!

Hatterasguy · #10 08-25-2011, 11:01 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoyArnuYjjs

For Bot, wasn't your dad or grandfather on an AA mount?

Now imagine 12 quad 40 turrets going, plus a bunch of 5in, and about two dozen 20mm, made a bit of noise. Blow those Japanese planes out of the sky!

I was just reading during one night engagement which wasn't worth reporting they shot down 6 bombers and lost 5 sailors with another 50 wounded to friendly fire.

Today the media would eat that up with anti US story's, back than it was accepted for the greater good.

Having seen how they were set up on the Battleship MA, I beleive being a loader was a pretty hard job, you were exposed to the shrapnel and had to hump those heavy 5 round clips around. I think having a bunch of planes trying very hard to kill you was one heck of a good motivation to keep those guns loaded and shooting. Took some guts to do that.

No imagine being on the gun for 8 hours, its getting dark, than wave after wave comes in, and your loading none stop for another hour. You get 30 minutes off, than the next wave comes in.

One hell of a job.

Hatterasguy · #11 08-25-2011, 11:16 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=puK-8e_d27Q&feature=related

Unlike today with computers and such, back than you and 7 other guys were on the deck per mount. You had to make these guns fire, if you wanted to have any chance of making it, they had to fire.

Remember these are steel ships, when rounds and shrapnel land it makes a racket and bounces around with a vengeance. It wasn't uncommon to have not only enemy but friendly rounds bouncing around as the Japanese aircraft would fly low between the ships, and the excited gunners would follow them, often with friendly ships in the background.

Having been in one of these turrets its surrounded by a steel ring, lined with holders for these clips. The spent shells were mostly captured by this ring so after awhile walking would become quite challenging, 40mm spent shells are somewhat large, more so if the spent shell casings were mixed with blood. Remember steel ring, 7.7mm Japanese rounds would bounce around in a horrible manner.

But you had no choice but to keep the guns firing, the Japanese if there aircraft were damaged would try to fly into the ship. You had to knock both wings off to prevent this. So no matter the cost you had to keep loading. The enemy aircraft would often use the tracers you sent up to get the position of the ship, and would follow them right in with an attack or suicide run. Either way you had to keep the gun firing.

Brave souls these guys were.

Botnst · #12 08-25-2011, 11:17 PM

On the Hornet my Dad's battle station was in a gun director on the ship's island. He had a 5" AAA battery. Lost comm with it and rec'd permission to check on it during a lull in action. Almost everybody was dead, mashed into inseparable heaps of smoky bloody organs and meat -- eviscerated piles entangled with twisted pieces of the ship. he collected as many dogtags as he could find while slipping across the blood-slicked deck. His memories of that horror were quite vivid when told and retold.

Hatterasguy · #13 08-25-2011, 11:22 PM

I was inside a few of those double 5in mounts on the Massachusetts, pretty small confined places, smelled of salt and grease. Cannot imagine the horror of going into one after being struck.

Its a spam can, anyone inside would be just gone.

When I was little I had a model airplane building class. One of the old timers who taught it served in the Pacific on a PBY. He said one time they were coming back from a patrol an a couple Zero's found them and started chewing them up. The gunner next to him was green it was his first flight and instead of manning his .50 decided to hide behind a bulkhead. He yelled at the guy, "you *&^*(%* idiot its only 3/4 plywood you think its going to stop anything get on your ^%^&* gun!" He did and they made it.

t walgamuth · #14 08-26-2011, 06:48 AM

Clearly it was do or die.

Most fellows did.

Botnst · #15 08-26-2011, 07:24 AM

Many did both.