A while back iwrock leaked the news that I was interestind in a Hyuandi Veloster. He was right, I don't drive new cars as a rule, and the idea of a new car with a warrenty is very very very interesting to me.

In the last 2 years I've spent on average 200 a month on car projects. thats more then half a car payment! if I buy a car that gets better milage, I can almost justify buying a new car. Just having car that had only been owned by me is an intersting thought, and thinking of the free time I would have just giving that money to the bank and not to the parts house sounds relaxing.

So I've been for the first time in my life I've been looking into new cars. I would use this car as a commuter car, but I want somethign thats not going to put me to sleep, that brings me to theVeloster. I like that it has Gasoline Direct Injection, which means the engine is pretty much a Diesel with a spark plug, adding the trubo to that, you get 201HP, 195FT/LB torque, and 40mpg. Very impressive numbers.

The other car that intrests me is the Scion FR-S. The FR-S is more money, but its also a true sports car, but no trubo. It also has a form of Direct Injection, they call it D-4S, it has Direct and Port injection. This make the engine have an even wider power band, using the port injection for acceloration and the direct injection for high speed. The engine in the FR-S makes 200HP, 151FT/LB torque, and 30mpg. while this car is much more impressive, the numbers shown are not as impressive as the Veloster. sure the veloster is a supped up econo-box and the FR-S is a sports car, but remember I'm only going to commute in it.

I've been reading about, and thinking about direct injection. It seems to have one large problem. EGR gasses + Cranck case gasses = Tar in the intake, as well all know being diesel owners. simple solution for us is to just disable the ERG. not so simple on a new computer controlled engine, plus warrenty issues. The port injection on the FR-S claims to eleminate this problems bcause the gas injection on top of the intake valve cleans it. Hmmm

OK so say the D-4S (direct and port injection) is the better system, but at 30 mpg, why is it that its not going to get me any better milage then my old benz? are all the computers only buying me more power?

So when I try to sum it all up, this is what I've come up with. If I get the Veloster with the GDI I'm getting better milage that will make the cost of owning the car about the same as repairing and driving my current cars. But it will require more matinance in the long run. In the short term it buys me more free time.

If I get the FR-S I get a car that will have less probmes in the long run, but cost me more... Likely the FR-S will be more collectable in the long run. But the cost of owning the FR-S will be higher then putting miles on my current cars.

Please note, I'm not getting rid of my SD or my old Toyota Tercel. The whole reason to buy a new car is just to have dependable transportation that will making working on the SD and Tercel fun again. This is also why I'm talking about NEW cars with warrentys. I want a turn key problem free driving.

What to y'all think? pretend you could afford a 24k new car, what would you get? would you get anything at all?

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I wouldnt. New cars come out with nice technology, Tech that will be obsolete almost as soon as you drive it off the lot, when the new models come out. not to mention a few years past that when things start to break and not work which could lead to thousands of dollars in repairs to keep them working or the potential to loose money on the resale if they dont work and should.... I'd stick with an older car for now.

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hum.....
1987 300TD 311,000M Stolen. Presumed destroyed

buy a good used Civic, it will be boring to drive but your fun will be the SD and Tercel.

Don't expect balanced answers, I've noticed that the folks on here are extremely reluctant to embrace new cars, often noting the expense. I was/am in a similar situation to you Nik, my time and space (and peace of mind) became much more valuable to me--until someone is put into the situation they will not see the value of a new vehicle.

For $24k I had similar criteria...fun to drive, practical, comfortable, etc. I ended up in a GTI. Its an absolutely fantastic car, I recommend (especially after reading your post) that you test drive one...base models can be had for $22k range if you are a smooth talker, and depending on your area. Its an extremely fun car but also quite grown up, not much boy-racerism in it. I get about 34-35mpg on the highway. I thought about waiting for the Veloster as well but it just isn't as practical as a Golf and IMO its overstyled. Also, performance wise the GTI is much better than the Veloster (whose turbo engine suffers from notorious rev hang as well as less power to the wheels)

Also, depending on the situation and dealer and such, CPO can be a very good compromising option with competitive finance rates and a decent warantee.

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TC
Current stable:
- 2004 Mazda RALLYWANKEL
- 2007 Saturn sky redline
- 2004 Explorer...under surgery.

Past: 135i, GTI, 300E, 300SD, 300SD, Stealth

While it is a fundamentally bad idea*, EGR isn't as horrible on gas engines as it is on a diesel. A new car also has the advantage having 30 less years of wear and tear on it. I'm not telling you to run out and buy a new car, but these are things to think about.

*I know it reduces peak combustion temperatures in order to reduce NOx emissions and save the environment. My position on that is a quote from the Right Honourable Sir Jeremy Clarkson, "I'm very aware of the environment, and I'm still not interested in it."

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Whoever said there's nothing more expensive than a cheap Mercedes never had a cheap Jaguar.

83 300D Turbo with manual conversion, early W126 vented front rotors and H4 headlights 400,xxx miles
08 Suzuki GSX-R600 M4 Slip-on 22,xxx miles
88 Jaguar XJS V12 94,xxx miles. Work in progress.

New cars = , in my humble opinion.

If I wanted reliable, comfortable transportation, I would opt for something newish, but not new.

This Subaru/Toyota project is the first interesting new car I have seen in a while: Subaru BRZ | The New 2013 BRZ Sports Car

As I understand it, it will be a proper, rear-wheel-drive sports car without a bunch of the technological baloney that other new cars have these days. I'm thinking I will be ready for one of those in a few years.

Last year I bought a 12 ford fiesta. It was 20 thousand dollars out the door. Tax included.

For the first time in my life i forgot where the hood release lever was. What a great feeling. Another first was COLD a/c. Yes, there is a difference between 1989 a/c and 2012 a/c. The list continues:

Heated seats
voice recognition stuff
My cell phone auto- blutooths to the car as soon as I get in.
The only guage I have to look at is the gas guage.
Its a 5 speed.

I still drive my 300e most of the time, but its relieving to know I have a reliable piece of transportation to get me to work.

And yes, it does make working on your cars a true hobby again.

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Eugene

10 E63 AMG
93 300te 4matic
07 BMW X3
14 Ford F-150 Fx2

Actually, new car technology really impresses me. I am still coming to grips with how many have exceeded the old 1 litre =100 hp benchmark. But why can't they use all that technology to produce a small simple car with lowish horsepower that gets great fuel economy? We had that in the 80s- where is it now? Why don't we see 1.0 litre cars with 100 HP that get 60 mpg?

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80 300SD (129k mi) 82 240D stick (193k mi)77 240D auto - stick to be (153k mi) 85 380SL (145k mi) 89 BMW 535i 82 Diesel Rabbit Pickup (374k mi) 91 Jetta IDI Diesel (155k mi) 81 VW Rabbit Convertible Diesel 70 Triumph Spitfire Mk III (63kmi)66 Triumph TR4a IRS (90k mi)67 Ford F-100 (??)

The FR-S is the same car as the BR-Z.

Well, not entirely the same, little different body and badge, but its all the same underneath!

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-Justin

91 560 SEC AMG - other dogs dd
01 Honda S2000 - dogs dd
07 MB ML320 CDI - dd
16 Lexus IS250 - wifes dd

it's automatic.

Two reasons:

1. EPA, NHTSA, etc mandate a whole bunch of unnecessary garbage in cars that weighs them down and hurts fuel economy.

2. More importantly, the OEM's don't think such a car would sell in large numbers, so they don't bother trying to sell one here.

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Whoever said there's nothing more expensive than a cheap Mercedes never had a cheap Jaguar.

83 300D Turbo with manual conversion, early W126 vented front rotors and H4 headlights 400,xxx miles
08 Suzuki GSX-R600 M4 Slip-on 22,xxx miles
88 Jaguar XJS V12 94,xxx miles. Work in progress.

Ford comes pretty damn close to those numbers... in Europe... With the souped up from factory Ford Focus RS...

2.5 liter 5 cylinder turbo - making 305hp/325ft-lbs of torque, while getting 32 US MPG! Good for a 0-60 of 5.9 seconds!

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-Justin

91 560 SEC AMG - other dogs dd
01 Honda S2000 - dogs dd
07 MB ML320 CDI - dd
16 Lexus IS250 - wifes dd

it's automatic.

That horse-puckey! I would sell my E55 in a heartbeat to get a Ford Focus RS if they brought them to the US!

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-Justin

91 560 SEC AMG - other dogs dd
01 Honda S2000 - dogs dd
07 MB ML320 CDI - dd
16 Lexus IS250 - wifes dd

it's automatic.

Nik, my 2011 Outback has the identical technology as the 2012's.

A nicely equipped Outback 2.5i Premium, the mid level one at factory invoice should be about 25.5k I would guess.

10% extra for any new car anywhere for tax licence and doc fee, normally too at the CA new car dealers.

An "ad special" in this weekend's paper is the base model for under $23k, big dealers like Maita in Sacramento and Autowest Mazda/Subaru in Roseville (where I got mine) have plenty of them right near you to check out right now

tuhey were totally restyled in 2010 and you can get htem with the non turbo 2.5i engine with the amazing one speed CVT (continuously variable) automatic and the mileage estimates are 21/29 mpg on cheap regular which is BETTER than their manual transmissions. They have paddle shifters that make it very easy and fast to shift manually (great on the mountains and hills - and have AWD on all of them, so the worse the weather the better.)

This year Consumer Reports has just rated them as "1 in their class for reliability in their class, above EVERYTHING else.

They are quiet, except when ou floor them, have a 170 hp engine that moves them pretty well, and highest rated by the IIHS for safety in crashes.

After a year and 20k this month on mine I can tell yoiu that it has been ANVIL reliable, not ONE warranty claim or issue and also,

I know you are a big guy so the seats would probably be very comfortable for you to fit in.

Resale is HUGE on them bcazuser used ones are scarce and most owners keep them for a long time and don't trade but pass them to family members....


As a true cost to own it is NOT mpg alone, but rather things in ADDITION to mpg, like frequency of repair, costs of parts, depreciation, and things like that which all figure in the "dollar to run one per mile" that is the true cost of ownership of ANY automobile.

It is also like a small-ish SUV with a commanding view, and with the seats down in the back can haul lots of things, like a neighbor's cello, office furniture and Mercedes wheel sets with no problem at all.

Though in my case personally what ultimately drove the purchase was the snowfalls that were heavy and constant up here. These cars are incredible off the road and in snow. (provided of course, you drie sensibly)

Last month coming back from Cabela's in Reno we got caught in a surprise snowstor in Boomtown, NV and made it effortlessly in the Outback over the summit, while we saw other cars and pickups spin out and go off the road into the snow.

The Outback motored serenely through it all and never missed a beat.

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1991 560 SEC AMG, 199k <---- 300 hp 10:1 ECE euro HV ...

1995 E 420, 170k "The Red Plum" (sold)

2015 BMW 535i xdrive awd Stage 1 DINAN, 6k, <----364 hp

1967 Mercury Cougar, 49k

2013 Jaguar XF, 20k <----340 hp Supercharged, All Wheel Drive (sold)

The new RWD Subaru/Scion looks like a great car, basically a Miata coupe without the cutesy look. It's a nice small sports car which is good IMO. It'd be way more fun to drive than the FWD Hyundai.

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1985 CA 300D Turbo , 213K mi

Nik if you would like an extended test of my Outback, for a few days at no cost, to see what it would be really like to live with one, then I can drop it off to you for a few days in exchange for your 300SD.

I believe we talked briefly about this last year.

Let me know if you want to try it on for size and I can call you to arrange to drop it off.. It is washed, serviced and ready to go.

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1991 560 SEC AMG, 199k <---- 300 hp 10:1 ECE euro HV ...

1995 E 420, 170k "The Red Plum" (sold)

2015 BMW 535i xdrive awd Stage 1 DINAN, 6k, <----364 hp

1967 Mercury Cougar, 49k

2013 Jaguar XF, 20k <----340 hp Supercharged, All Wheel Drive (sold)