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#1
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Timeline that will make your hair turn white- US national debt, 233 years
The United States National Debt -- 233 years in the making
this is an interesting timeline that details the national debt from the beginning of the nation, to now. From a fiscal perspective, it tells a chilling story. the founding fathers had it right- “But with respect to future debt; would it not be wise and just for that nation to declare in the constitution they are forming that neither the legislature, nor the nation itself can validly contract more debt, than they may pay within their own age, or within the term of 19 years.” – Thomas Jefferson “No pecuniary consideration is more urgent, than the regular redemption and discharge of the public debt: on none can delay be more injurious, or an economy of time more valuable.” - George Washington We as a nation are heading for bankruptcy. Read through the whole thing, its very interesting
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This post brought to you by Carl's Jr. Last edited by JB3; 10-19-2012 at 02:47 PM. |
#2
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I couldn't agree more. The thought that my kids and their kids will be paying for this mess, because no one in Washington is willing to get their hands dirty, is an unpleasant one.
BTW, I haven't completely read the timeline yet but will be doing so this evening. It's a very interesting read!
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#3
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though I never saw the research, a friend of mine said he documented twenty-two separate bankruptcy filings by the United States. I'm trying to figure out how an entity goes bankrupt multiple times.....perhaps that is a question for a lawyer......
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#4
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It looks like Bill Clinton is the only champion of debt reduction or at least deficit reduction in recent years, and recent is defined as the last 75 years. That view is based upon what I read in the attachment. Kind of scarey ...I wonder what the debt load is for each American right now and could this amount ever be paid back? I wonder why Bill was not hired as a "Debt Czar" He seems to be the only one to tackle this issue in recent history.
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#5
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my opinion is that the answer is no. I believe that sooner or later, we are facing a massive default on government debts and the worst economic disaster in recorded history. For me the tough decision has been one where when do I decide that money I might have in a municipal bond for an airport or something similar will now become money that I probably won't get back? I have a few bonds like this, and unloading them early (some are 30 year bonds) will have me taking a loss, but not unloading them means I stand to risk losing all of the money invested eventually. Then at that point, the money will become worthless anyway, so how do I preserve any wealth or comfort ive managed to accumulate If I know eventually the dollar will become a good source of toilet paper? This is all super negative thinking, but regardless of political affiliation, neither party has shown the slightest desire to actually tackle the massive debt of this nation. And every hour, the US government spends millions it doesn't have. People say that a massive default is never going to happen and that things are improving, but in 1970 when the US was the largest creditor in the world, the same people would have balked at the notion that in 2013 the US would be the largest debtor in the world. Alarming thoughts
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This post brought to you by Carl's Jr. |
#6
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#7
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Ive had airport construction and other municipal project bonds for quite a while, traditionally a US state municipal bond with a triple A rating has been the most safe and conservative way to invest money. The downside is long term bonds and low profits comparatively, but to date, there is nothing but my growing default fear that disagrees with the safety and consistent return on investment of a US bond. They always pay back, and always do so on schedule. Many of them ive purchased over the years have been bought back early at a decent profit by the state that started them, so I have not experienced or heard of what you describe happening. Sounds very much like conspiracy theory honestly unless you can substantiate it. My feeling is despite the guaranteed return on investment and rock solid reliability of these types of bonds, that meanwhile the national debt spirals out of control in an ever expanding fashion. Looking at it like the US was an individual that makes decent money, spends more than they make, borrows against it, and has always paid their bills, when it comes time to pay the piper, no one gets paid, even the bills that were always paid on time and in full.
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This post brought to you by Carl's Jr. |
#8
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#9
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My feeling right or wrong is that the future actual purchasing power of money held in many ways by many of us might be low. Even with the accured earnings. This in comparison to the times of investment. For example general taxation may be much higher when we want to use the funds than now.
A serious financial collapse may restore the purchasing power but like a two edged sword those investments may be hit hard then as well. My second point is money in my opinion was not developed to use as many of us do including myself. I think times have changed but general attitudes including my own may not have changed fast enough to compensate. Currently I see us as a consumer driven society. If and when that changes if ever there may be serious issues. There is little doubt in my mind that society in general is living beyond their sensible means currently. Or too many of them percentagewise to ignore as a factor. There is enough wrong for example that raising interest rates to historical levels might bring the house of cards down. Or at least create fairly serious damage.. Based on this I feel that low interest rates historically are going to basically remain. What if I am wrong though? Faith in the system to a certain point is fine. We may have reached or gone past the point where that should be looked at by the individual. Until something happens the cost of living continuously increasing at a pretty rapid rate has to be almost a given in my mind. Attempts to keep minumin wages at a semi liveable level for example are reciently one cause of many smaller business closures locally. Five restaurants for example this month. There is not a lot of stimulus to increase wages with so high an unemployment and welfare rate in todays society either. There are solid indicators this year that money or at least the disposable part of it is tight and may be getting more so. I am not taking the view that the sky is falling either. Just that there are possible changes occurring that may not be for the general benefit of conservative people. |
#10
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Don't forget Ron Paul so fast now...
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"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes 1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod 2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die." |
#11
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As a credit underwriter for a large bank I can assure you that the answer is many times. The record I personally have seen is 4 for one person. I dont know how they kept getting loans.
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