Mobil-1 changed their ATF formula... - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

myanoch · #1 10-05-2007, 08:22 AM

Is part # z8001-107773 full synthetic ?
why is this one $14 a liter

gsxr · #2 10-05-2007, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by myanoch

Is part # z8001-107773 full synthetic ?
why is this one $14 a liter

Mike, that's what I've been trying to find out. Based on the price, it might be synthetic... but it also might just be a Dexron-VI synthetic blend fluid. Nobody seems to know for sure. For those wondering, Z8001-107773 is the WorldPac part number for one of the OE Mercedes fluids (photo below), Mercedes # 001-989-21-03-10. This was originally for the 722.6 tranny, and not approved for use in our older 722.3/.4/.5 gearboxes. MB Doc says that the correct number for our cars should be 001-989-45-03-10, which is WorldPac # Z8001-286630, ~$12.50/liter.

gsxr · #3 11-06-2007, 11:46 AM

I finally called Mobil - sorry it took so long, but I've been way too busy lately. Anyway, they said that it is not possible to certify a fluid Dexron-III any longer, because it's an obsolete specification. It has been superceded by Dexron-VI. That's all old news, we knew that. So, then I asked why the new M-1 MVF ATF is not certified Dexron-VI, and the basic answer is that Mobil-1 MVF ATF does not meet the requirements for Dexron-VI. Period. That's why it doesn't say "Dexron" anywhere on the label. They still want you to buy their non-synthetic Dexron-VI fluid for Dexron-VI applications, but make the nebulous claim that the M1 MVF should work in pre-2005 vehicles, they just can't formally put the Dexron-III approval on there. And, he didn't state if it did actually meet Dexron-III specs or not - I didn't specifically ask, but I bet he couldn't say, even if he did know the answer.

Another update: Amsoil's ATF appears similar to the Mobil-1 formula, but in a thinner viscosity to meet Dexron-VI specs. I'm not sure if Amsoil is officially licensed by Dexron, but Amsoil isn't shy about putting the Dexron name all over their spec sheets. However it still reeks like M-1 does. I tried this stuff in my '93, but I won't use it again.

Bottom line - Only Red Line Synthetic ATF has official approvals for Dexron-II, as well as official Mercedes approval (and it clearly states this on the label). I'd much rather use a fluid that has the official Dexron approvals, certification, and licensing. I added a new post later in this thread with more details on the Red Line ATF - skip ahead to post #51.

I sure miss the old Mobil... first they mess up their M-1 oil formulas, now they hosed up the ATF as well. If they ever screw up the Delvac-1 formula, I'll be switching to Red Line engine oil too...!

300B · #4 11-06-2007, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsxr

I finally called Mobil - sorry it took so long, but I've been way too busy lately. Anyway, they said that it is not possible to certify a fluid Dexron-III any longer, because it's an obsolete specification. It has been superceded by Dexron-VI. That's all old news, we knew that. So, then I asked why the new M-1 MVF ATF is not certified Dexron-VI, and the basic answer is that Mobil-1 MVF ATF does not meet the requirements for Dexron-VI. Period. That's why it doesn't say "Dexron" anywhere on the label. They still want you to buy their non-synthetic Dexron-VI fluid for Dexron-VI applications, but make the nebulous claim that the M1 MVF should work in pre-2005 vehicles, they just can't formally put the Dexron-III approval on there. And, he didn't state if it did actually meet Dexron-III specs or not - I didn't specifically ask, but I bet he couldn't say, even if he did know the answer.

Bottom line - Amsoil ATF has official approvals for Dexron-II, III, and IV as well as Mercon & Mercon V. I'd much rather use a fluid that has the official Dexron approvals, certification, and licensing. Here's a link:

http://www.amsoil.com/StoreFront/atf.aspx

You can get a case of 4 gallon jugs for $144 (!) list price direct from Amsoil (that's enough for 2 Mercedes trans fluid changes). Yeah, that price is crazy, However, if you add the "preferred customer" option for $10, you get 'dealer' pricing, which drops the cost to $104, plus the aforementioned $10, plus shipping & tax. For me, it was $14 shipping, $6 tax, for a grand total of $134.27 shipped to my door. That's $8.39 per quart. I'm officially switched to Amsoil for my ATF now. I sure miss the old Mobil... first they mess up their M-1 oil formulas, now they hosed up the ATF as well. If they ever screw up the Delvac-1 formula, I'll be switching to Amsoil engine oil too...!

GM no longer issues the license for Dexron III thus no more labeling.

gsxr · #5 11-06-2007, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 300B

GM no longer issues the license for Dexron III thus no more labeling.

Did you even read what I said? Or any of this thread? Here, let me trim it down:

"I asked why the new M-1 MVF ATF is not certified Dexron-VI, and the basic answer is that Mobil-1 MVF ATF does not meet the requirements for Dexron-VI."

And to refresh your memory further, Dexron-VI is backwards compatible with Dex-III. So Mobil could have made their product Dex-VI compatible, which would by default make it approved for Dex-III. But they chose not to. The new fluid is only Mercon approved. Dex-III licensing is irrelevant.

OzC36 · #6 11-07-2007, 09:39 AM

gsxr,

Some great posts from you that I found very educational and useful.

Thank you for sharing!

michakaveli · #7 11-07-2007, 01:24 PM

Just caught on to this thread. The '05 Taurus I recently acquired per one of the Taurus forums appears to run well on the M1 ATF as it meets the Mercon V specs.... found a bunch of it @ AutoZone for $41/case (6 quarts).

Now for my E300. I don't like to mess around with fluids from the aftermarket as the transmission is a delicate animal. My intents when I change the fluid in my E w/ the 722.6 tranny are to purchase the MB fluid, but, this thread got me thinking. Since my car is an older model, I'm sure the aftermarket has come up with a comparable fluid to the OEM MB fluid for my tranny. I liked using M1 Turbo Diesel 5w-40 but switched to the Amsoil Heavy-Duty Diesel & Marine 15w-40 since I live in a warmer climate and like the 15w protection. Would the Amsoil ATF work w/ the 722.6 w/o issues? Also what gear oil is recommended for the rear-end? I'd like to replace that as well.

Other E300 owners chime in as well.

300B · #8 11-07-2007, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsxr

Did you even read what I said? Or any of this thread? Here, let me trim it down:

"I asked why the new M-1 MVF ATF is not certified Dexron-VI, and the basic answer is that Mobil-1 MVF ATF does not meet the requirements for Dexron-VI."

And to refresh your memory further, Dexron-VI is backwards compatible with Dex-III. So Mobil could have made their product Dex-VI compatible, which would by default make it approved for Dex-III. But they chose not to. The new fluid is only Mercon approved. Dex-III licensing is irrelevant.

Regardless the Dex III license is null.

BTW,have you read your Amsoil link?

Look at the viscosity requirement at 100 c for Dex VI vs Dex III's.