Vifa Scan Spek of Denmark?

[ATLD]

Has anyone ever heard of this speaker company before because I have been told they are quite good high-end speakers? I have not yet seen them available in normal audio stores and am curious (as they are available at a major discount to me). Please let me know before I buy/install them. THis if from a catalogue and I therefore havent heard them.

TIA
Dr. Adam T. L. Delecki

[rainmaker]

Vifa Scan Speak speakers are very good, high end speakers. I understand that they supply other manufacturers with drivers much like how Dynaudio did for home audio speaker manufacturers prior to them producing their own line. I have not had personal experience with them (other than they were probably the drivers in some of the home speakers I have) but the dealers who I purchase my high end equipment from and whose recommendations I hold in high regard, do speak highly of them. It's their tweeters that I normally hear about though.

Prior to plunging ahead with this purchase though, you might want to consider the following:

- make sure you are getting the right speakers for the applications you intend. You didn't specify what you were going to use them for and whether it was a complete set or just individual drivers. If it's an 8 ohm version which doesn't match the impedance of your other drivers, you would need a fairly complex and expensive custom made passive crossovers, etc.

- would these drivers be in the mounting size that you require?

- would they mate well with the other drivers (assuming it's not a complete set) and would your crossovers be appropriate?

Several other similar questions along the same lines come to mind and I'm not sure as to your level of comfort with car/home audio so there's not much that I can comment on at this point.

Also, do remember that when it comes to high end equipment, more often than not, the way to really take advantage of their abilities is to match similarly high end components in the entire signal chain. After all, your system is only as good as its weakest link.

[ATLD]

I am replacing the front and rear speaker in my 300D. The sizes are correct to the micron. I have ordered a set of woofers and the appripriate neodenium tweeter that mounts on the dash (unfortunately 4'' is the larges I can do in the front without major surgery. Also got ADS (analog/digital systems) crossovers for front and back. Basically the same system for the rear, but use 8" drivers and (will be) powered by a seperate amplifier. As for a sub, I plan to use a Dayto Loudspeaker's 12" low frequency driver (as they work quite well in home theater applications, are built like tanks, and I can get them relatively cheep). The enclosure I plan to build muself (did it many times before) and will use a standad ported box. 4th order bandpass, as I used in my other cars, wouldn't seem to fit this situation as well as it did the others. The trunk is relatively small and I don't want to fill it all up (as I do travel). Also the car is smaller and I don't think I will need as high a decibel output as the others.
By the way, haven't got an amp yet buy would appreciate advice. I would prefer to use a single amplifier, four channels that I can bridge one pair to make a three channel amp. That way I can use the stereo side for my rear set, and the brigged side for the sub. Oh, yeah, got a Blaupunkt "Munchen" head for the system, as their tuner and CD tech is impressive to me. I will use it to power the front set as it will require a lot less wiring and won't need that much power.

Any Ideas before I get my hands greassy?

TIA
Dr. A T L D

[rainmaker]

Are the a/d/s/ crossovers that you purchased active or passive crossovers? I'm a bit worried about using passives as the a/d/s/ passive crossovers weren't built with the vifas in mind. But then again, it the crossover points work well, then that's great. It's a bit of a gamble though...

I'm not familiar with the head unit or the subs so I can't comment on them.

The only thing I'd probably change would be I'd use the amp to power the front speakers and use the deck to power the rear. Otherwise, better and louder sound would be coming from the rear and that just wouldn't sound right. But that's just me. I feel that since you seem to have a potentially great system based on component choice (the install will determine how much of its potential you can extract), it would be worth your time and effort to get the sound stage right. If there's anyway you can get the 8s up front and the smaller driver in the rear, I say that'd be awesome.

As for amp recommendations, I would have normally recommend to you the amps that I got. They're called Genesis. They're hand made in the UK and simply sound awesome. The guy I buy my stuff from has warned me that the build quality has suffered in the sense that warranty claims have risen by a lot lately. In lieu of that, I'd recommend the following, depending on your budget:

1. Brax X2400 (100x4), MSRP is around $1500
2. Brax Helix HXA400 (60x4), MSRP around $600
3. Brax Helix HXA40 (60x4), MSRP around $400
4. a/d/s/ PQ40 (100x4) msrp around $1000
5. a/d/s/ P450 (50x4), MSRP of $500

Another brand that comes to mind that delivers a lot of bang for the buck is DEI.

1. DEI Model 650 (50x4 + 250x1) $439 shipped
2. DEI Model 500 (75x4), $369 shipped.

You can get the DEIs from www.mmxpress.com. John Spagnolo, the owner, is a great stand up guy!

Feel free to email me if you want to discuss any of the above further...

Good luck!

[ATLD]

The A/D/S crossovers are passive but are adjustable (to different frequency crossover points/ranges) so I don't think they will be a problem. They are high end a/d/s and have some decent literature to help me set them up. Anyway, I have all the equipment that I would need to get a decent flat-frequency response (or as close as possible) from them.
I would like to use bigger speakers in the front, but I don't see how I could (do you know the W123s). The speaker cut-outs in the dash is tiny and the grill will just fit. I couldn't fit anything bigger than a 4''. I have considered cutting into my footwell or doors to install more speakers, but I think it will be more trouble than it's worth. The interior is so small that my head (I tall) will still be less than 2ft from the rear speakers even in the drivers seat; about the same dist as from the front speakers +- a few in. Also, if I do it this way, the front speakers will not require that much power and my head is rated 40w rms x 4ch @ 4ohm. More than enough power for 4"ers and a tweeter. The backs though will need more umph, as they will carry some bass.
I will look into the amplifiers that you recogmend though they are relatively pricy compared to the rest of my system, which I noe have in my possession (everything so far about $500, versus over $1500 value msrp). I'm frugal and shop discount, but am not cheap (or atleast thats what I think). I also have minimum standards and will not buy junk, even if it's almost free. I have great part suppliers. I have already checked the sights and recogmendations for the DEIs. Thanks for your advice, anything else I should know before I get going?

Ok yeah; how is the best way to run the wires in MBs? Obviousely I want to run power as far away as possible from my signals. Under the rugs, or with the vacuum lines etc.?

TIA;
Adam
P.S. I don't want to have to do it twice, but I also don't want to have to dissassemble my entire interior of my car, as it is my daily.

[Silver Boat]

So how did the install go? I was looking at some vifa 4" and neodymium tweeter for my W126. Sounds like you are shopping Parts Express. I went to one of the show rooms over the summer. I was like a kid in a candy shop. Wish I had a bigger budget! (and a bigger trunk as I was in my Miata) I got some parts for my Miata and cabriolet. I just got my Silver Boat (euro 1980 W126 280SE) so i was not shopping for it. Did they fit? I think it sounds like a good solution.

[ATLD]

Believe it or not, I did not install them yet. These last few weeks have been very hectic around here. I plan to do it over my Christmas break. I'll let you know the specifics.

Yes, they are Parts Express, and they do fit into my 300D without any modifications (the tweeters will be outboard) in the front, but I am replacing the rear speakers with 8''ers so I will have to do some cutting in the back. I do not have an amplifier yet but am looking at some interesting Rockford Fosgate amps. I have a Hafler home theater amp and it is truly amazing. Rockford Fosgate was/owned Hafler while Hafler were still in business. Their plant burnt down so they closed that line. Their mosfet outputs are quite interesting, as well as the trans-nova discrete circutry. I think it is better than having just a mosfet power supply. Will probably use a four-channel that will be made into a three-channel. Or I will use one stereo amp and another bridged; haven't decided yet. Either way, I can get some more juice to the sub. The Dayton Low frequency driver is a great piece. It has a 3'' voicecoil, a cast frame, and a monsterous magnet. Have used them in lots of home audio environments (also self-fabricated enclosures) and are very impressive, especially in the subharmonic frequencies. They are amazingly sensitivity and are extreemely efficient, especially in a bandpass enclosure (though I haven't decided this either). I also engineer my own enclosures for my speakers (in this case the sub) and build them in my shop to exacting standards. This requires a great amt. of man-hrs. I will cut a hole into my rear-deck (the first aid box) to allow porting to the cabbin, though the Dayton may not need it. Only time will tell. As for the Vifa's, I have tested them in prototype boxes in my shop and they sound fantastic with my crossovers, but haven't wired them or installed them in my car yet. Have considered buying another set to use as satelites for a mini-system I'll make. My car's acustics are about as good as a telephone booth's so it may be different there. As the 300D is my primary, I will wait till I get some time off, as I will have to pull alot of my interior apart including the removal of the seats. I have about two weeks before my vacation so get ready. I am about ready to order my amp(s).

Adam

[Silver Boat]

Any updates for us?

[ATLD]

Found some great deals for rockford fosgate amps at Sound City. Ordered them over break but still have not received them. Have ordered many things there before (home theater) and I'm sure they will arrive in a timely manner. As for the car, I have been amassing all the wires, connectors, adaptors etc. for the installation, but am still deciding on where I can fit certain things. Also have not determined what type of box I want to use for my sub or how I will affix it to my trunk floor while keeping access to my spare. Am considering quick releasing mounts and wires with locking connectors (actually ordered them {Parts Express & MCM Electronics} already and have them). I have done cars before, but I want to do this-one right, so I'm taking my good old time. I'll keep you posted.

ATLD

[Silver Boat]

so have you finished the install yet? I know how these things can drag on and on some times.

[ATLD]

Yes, finally I have. Did it over Easter Break. I used 2 Rockford Fosgate Power 1100a2's (great amps). One for the rear speakers and the other bridged for the sub. My head is the Blaupunkt Munchen, powers the fronts fine, used a/d/s crossovers allround (they have variable crosover pts). Fronts are vifa 4'' and 1" tweeters/ rear are 6" vifa's and the same tweeter as the fronts. Sub is a 12" Dayton Low Frequency driver with a specialy built folded horn design, that just fits under the boot. Luckily still enough room for luggage.

I have the amps and crossovers (for the rear) built onto the sub's structure, but shock-mounted. unfortunately, I had to use disconnectable xlr and other connectors on all the lines going to the sub and amps because if I ever get a flat, I have to get to the spare easily. I have releasable levers that secure the sub to the trunk floor.

Wiring was slow and a pain. Amps are tapped right off the battery, and ran the lines under the carpets witht he vacuum. Also cut out a 6" hole in the First aid kit to allow sub venting (huge difference).

Now my stereo can actually overpower the engine and road noise at hw speeds, and do a good job too!

I'm quite pleased.

If you have any other questions, please ask.

ATLD
Adam T. L. Delecki

Originally posted by ATLD
Has anyone ever heard of this speaker company before because I have been told they are quite good high-end speakers?

Vifa and ScanSpeak (along with Peerless: all three of them are brands of a Danish company called d-s-t) do indeed make some excellent drive-units used in a huge number of "high end" speakers. (Some US$3000 speakers use the Vifa P17WJ and D27 tweeter, a pair costing maybe US$120 full retail per speaker pair!, and the US$20k+ Krell reference speaker uses Vifa's XT tweeter, a US$60-80 part, along with ScanSpeak woofers.)

The differences between them are as follows:

ScanSpeak is generally considered "top of the line". Their drivers have the most sophisticated cone materials and low-distortion motors. Frankly, in a moving car these advantages are pretty much moot.

Vifa's drivers are similar to ScanSpeak's in many ways, except they don't have some of the tricks in the motor (Faraday rings, etc.), and the cones are often paper or poly instead of the more exotic blends. Vifa also offers a range of car-specific drivers, which are lower impedance and designed to handle a wider range of operating temperatures.

Peerless was an independent company until very recently, so they sometimes don't quite fit in. Peerless cones tend to be poly or poly-blends of various stiffnesses, and their line has more stamped steel framed drivers than Vifa's. Peerless is the groups' leader in subwoofers, with their XLS units being perhaps Europe's best subs.

Other companies that make and sell tons of great drivers to the High End include the Norwegian firm Seas, the German firm Eton, and the French firms Audax and Focal.

However, DO NOT expect any raw drive units to sound good together without a professionally-designed crossover. Modern computer software has made prototyping crossovers MUCH easier than ever before, so don't settle for a second rate textbook equation xo.