"Bad Motor" - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

javven · #1 01-01-2005, 02:52 PM

I'm considering buying a car with a known 'bad motor'. It's on the cheap of course. It's a 240D (1985). New paint, interior's good and the body's overall in outstanding shape. Trans has 180K on it (total milage on car).

First question - have any of you had your auto trans. rebuilt? I'm considering doing that while the motor's out of the car. What was your experience, and what did it end up costing you (assuming it's just wear parts - not a blown trans as well)?

Second - is the 616 a Parent Block Bored motor or is it sleeved? I figure PBB but not sure.

Third - what would the best way to get a working motor into the car be? I suppose if the 'bad motor' (which I haven't seen) is repairable it might not be that bad - but usually when a used car dealer tells you bad motor you can figure on replacing it or being sorry you didn't. Prob. some fool ran it outta oil.

Suggestions?

engatwork · #2 01-01-2005, 03:02 PM

Replace the tranny with a rebuilt one from the dealer if you are trying to restore the car and want to make it as perfect as you can.

See if the guy will let you put it on a rack and look at the engine from underneath. If you see a hole in the block with a rod sticking out then you will need to find another complete engine. If you do not see a hole then the rebuild is pretty straight forward. I'm assuming you are going to do it yourself short of the machine shop work? These engines are sleeved.

welcome aboard too

Palangi · #3 01-01-2005, 05:31 PM

No such thing as an 85 240D.

What part of Texas are you in?

whunter · #4 01-01-2005, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by javven

I'm considering buying a car with a known 'bad motor'. It's on the cheap of course. It's a 240D (1985).
Suggestions?

This would be a grey market car = no parts here.
Do you mean the Engine is bad?
I would plan on $2,000.00 - $2,500.00 for the transmission, and $5,000.00 to $7,000.00 for the engine.

Roughly your base cost = $7,000.00 too $12,000.00 USD…

Palangi · #5 01-01-2005, 07:10 PM

Lookee here: http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=175644275&dealer_id=&car_year=1985&make=MB&distance=50&max_price=&model=240D&advcd_on=n&end_year=2006&min_price=&certified=n&address=76117&search_type=used&advanced=n&start_year=1981&color=&cardist=36

It's not a Euro, it looks like about an 81~83 US car. If they're calling it an 85, something is fishy.

javven · #6 01-01-2005, 07:44 PM

$12000? AFAIK the problem could be a slight knock in the motor. I've seen the motors at the prices you mention, though those were always rebuilt, etc.

The listing service doesn't go back to but about 85 - maybe that's the problem. Still I'd think in the text it'd say 82 etc.

I saw something similar advertised locally - a 300D with a factory stick shift. While this might be someone's mod if it was they were a friggin artist with it.

R Leo · #7 01-01-2005, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whunter

This would be a grey market car = no parts here.
Do you mean the Engine is bad?
I would plan on $2,000.00 - $2,500.00 for the transmission, and $5,000.00 to $7,000.00 for the engine.

Roughly your base cost = $7,000.00 too $12,000.00 USD…

Or, buy a running parts car (wrecked, or totaled but still running) and swap the engine. In the last year, I've bought two parts cars (one running, one sorta running) for $400 each. The running parts car had a sweet-sounding 616 in it.

I'd do an engine swap long before throwing $7000 at an engine in one of these vehicles.

lietuviai · #8 01-01-2005, 09:10 PM

I'm really surprised that anyone would pay those prices for a rebuilt engine for one of these cars considering they're rarely worth even half the price of a new engine. But I guess there are a few people out there that do. I saw a wrecked '79 300SD a few months back that had a factory rebuilt engine in it. The seller showed me the reciept from about 10 years back for it and it was around $6000.

I understand that these engines are built to high tolerances and I've looked through my FSM for the 617.952 engine and it reads almost like an engineering manual in regards to rebuilding the engine. I still would not pay that kind of money under any circumstance unless the car was worth at least twice what the engine would cost.

MTUpower · #9 01-01-2005, 09:17 PM

C'mon WHunter- how many people here would buy a motor from the dealer? Yes you can, but this forum is here to help people, unless I'm wrong. Even performance products will sell you a complete motor for less than $5K, and most of the time you can buy another whole car for that half that. You can get one at the junk yard for less than $500 and it includes a tranny. If the guy is trying to have a perfect car he is not going to buy one with bad motor and go from there!

whunter · #10 01-01-2005, 10:19 PM

I have no idea if "javven" can DIY.
Better he is prepared for the worst, rather than a rose and wine outlook.

These cars can be cheap or cost more than your house.

Anyone looking to buy one should be given dealer repair cost, it gives us all more reason to DIY...

Carleton Hughes · #11 01-01-2005, 10:48 PM

I dunno, been rebuilding engines and dealing with machine shops for years so you can keep your 5-7,000 bucks.

New sleeves, $30.00 each..Pistons and rings,$350.00to$500.00 for a set...
Con-rod small ends rebushed or semi sized for new pins included with pistons, $25.00 each.
Crank cut and polished $200.00, new main and rod bearing set $65.00..

Competently rebuilt head $350.00..or less depending upon condition

Gaskets, seals and ancillary components $150.00..

You get my point.
IF you are familiar with motors and have some aptitude most of this is simply final assembly after the major work{if any is warranted}has been done by a machine shop.

I've had Benzes burnt dry by lack of oil which required ALL of the above.But the simplest and greatest bargain was one 300 that turned out to be hydrolocked in one cylinder,I simply removed the bent con-rod and installed a new one.

This hydrolock phenomenon is common in some Benz diesels since the engine air intake begins it's route in a flat,stupidly wide plastic scoop located above the headlights directly behind {and at times perilously close to} the front of the engine hood.

Jimmy Joe · #12 01-03-2005, 03:38 AM

I am curious after reading this as to just how difficult it would be for a hobby wrencher like me to pull a motor with trans...and get a different one back in there.....

#13 01-03-2005, 03:45 AM

I have a 240D engine and trans setup sitting in my dad's shop :-D
We are gonna do a compression test here soon and then offer it up for sale.
Came out of a running working car...just wanted gas instead I guess.

TonyFromWestOz · #14 01-03-2005, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimmy Joe

I am curious after reading this as to just how difficult it would be for a hobby wrencher like me to pull a motor with trans...and get a different one back in there.....

Swapping identically equipped engines between 2 cars of the same type is easy, as long as you have access to the tools needed. The big one is an engine crane.
I swaped engines between an '80 and an '82 300D last year. It took a week to do it on my own. I managed to borrow the crane, but it didn't have an engine tilt facility so I needed to tilt the engines using chains and turnbuckles.

rwthomas1 · #15 01-03-2005, 11:27 AM

I would be madness to buy a "new" engine from the dealer. There are too many old wrecks and rusted out parts cars around to mess with even a DIY rebuild unless the car is pristine and you have time/money on your hands. Even if you have an indy do the swap it should be less than $1K. Swapping identical engines and/or transmissions is fairly easy. It seems like a lot but just tackle one issue at a time and its no big deal. Having an identical parts car will make life easier but even if you just got a good running engine from a local source or Ebay, etc. rent the engine hoist, call some buddies that have a clue and swap the new engine in. I would consider regasketing the new engine and maybe do the timing chain, etc. if needed as working on it out of the car and on a stand is easier for most things. If you can change a waterpump, alternator, do suspension work, etc. then swapping an engine is within your abilities. Just pay attention, take pictues, label wires and parts and be careful. This isn't rocket science. RT