617 IP Full Load Stop Adjustment Procedure - Page 7 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

gsxr · #91 06-23-2005, 01:14 PM

Ooooo, I'm jealous.

Looks like it sticks down more than I'd like but it might work. Do you have any photos of the IC plumbing connections? Might be hard to take pictures without pulling the tire though. Awesome job. Any black smoke at any RPM?

mdisav · #92 06-23-2005, 02:07 PM

The plumbing is not easy to photograph without taking it apart and photographing it upon assembly. Basically it goes out of the turbo and swoops by the airfilter, then in front of the headlight and down through where a plastic guard use to be and into the intercooler. It comes out the other side and up through a drilled hole in the inner fender, then across and above the other piping behind the headlight and into the intake. I used all 2" aluminum or auto safe plastic piping along with the elbows all from a saab turbo and older toyota supra turbo.

There is no noticeable smoke at full throttle. Only the little poof when the pedal is initially hit on take off from a bit rich alda adjustment.

I know 2 turns does not let the idle return normally and 1 does. So I may experiment in between to see if I am able to go more.

I am excited to see how it feels with straight truck stop diesel. 100% Bio always gives a noticeable power decrease that I can feel. Slower 0-60 times by .5-.75sec.

boneheaddoctor · #93 06-23-2005, 02:24 PM

I'm wondering it the little idle volume screw on the bottom left corner under the cover would help it idle when turned up...basicly turning that out a corisponding ammount to what you turn in the full load.

mdisav · #94 06-23-2005, 05:36 PM

Well I now have the full load adjusted 1.5 turns. It increased the idle slightly but it returns to idle as normal. I was able to adjust the idle on the top back in front of the ELR to bring things to normal. 0-60 times are just under 9secs. A slight improvement over one turn. I feel more power past 4k rpm.

EGTs were climbing faster than before and were just over 1200F. Someone (I forget who - thanks!!) mentioned a rich mixture really increases EGTs. So I increased boost to 15psi and the EGTs rose slower and only made it to 1200F if I was into the pedal for a while.

I guess leaning out the mixture with more boost made a difference. I was under the impression that increased boost would increase EGTs but I guess a richer mixtures increased EGTs more than the hotter air of increased boost. I sure do get boost quicker in the lower rpms now!

Casey, were you able to get your idle to return normally? On cold starts, are your glow plugs good?
Nice job on your mods! I just looked at the pics. It seems like your ic is doing a very good job at keeping EGTs low.
And by the way, where did you relocate your washer bottle to?

H2O2 · #95 06-23-2005, 06:06 PM

I still haven't turned screw 2f back in a quarter turn yet, so it does idle a bit high when warm. All plugs are within normal resistance, and receive the correct amount of voltage as well. Still need to perform a compression test to rule out variance between cyls, and I do have the dreaded 603 head cracks to contend with at some point. I haven't put the washer reservoir back in since beginning this project, but it sits in the stock location.

#96 06-23-2005, 08:23 PM

I believe my wastegate may be more weak that I first predicted.
I figured if I was only running 10psi boost I could get away without running my boost controller but it seems that it'll only make 7 without it. 280k miles..I guess I can put the boost controller back on

Until I can find another intake manifold and modify it so that I can port into it differently, I may take my IC off.

I don't like the idea of not using my stock air cleaner...it works real well.

gsxr · #97 06-23-2005, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdisav

EGTs were climbing faster than before and were just over 1200F. Someone (I forget who - thanks!!) mentioned a rich mixture really increases EGTs. So I increased boost to 15psi and the EGTs rose slower and only made it to 1200F if I was into the pedal for a while.

I guess leaning out the mixture with more boost made a difference. I was under the impression that increased boost would increase EGTs but I guess a richer mixtures increased EGTs more than the hotter air of increased boost. I sure do get boost quicker in the lower rpms now!

I think you are correct. You want to run just enough boost to eliminate smoke and keep EGT's low... but if you keep adding boost, at some point EGT's will start to increase again. And, there won't be any more power, since that's more a function of fuel than air (IMO). On my car, in STOCK tune, my EGT's dropped noticeably when I reduced boost from approx 15psi down to 12psi with no loss in power (verified by dragstrip runs).

The latest data on my 1987 300D dragstrip testing, and 0-90mph testing, is posted in this Excel spreadsheet:

http://www.w124performance.com/docs/dragstrip/300D_Dragstrip.xls

I hope to turn up the fuel 1/2 turn this weekend and do some more testing at the dragstrip on July-1. I have no IC and no intercooler so I will be watching EGT's pretty closely. I have 21 runs in at the dragstrip, I think that's pretty decent 'baseline' data to work with. I need to figure out the best, worst, and average times. A quick glance shows best of 17.3 and worst of 18.0 on ET, for trap speed it's 80.3mph best and 77.2mph worst.

mdisav · #98 06-23-2005, 09:21 PM

My car idles so quietly now. When I went from dino to bio there was quite less clatter. But now after adjusting the full load and driving it around it is even quieter still. I had to get out of the drivers seat and open the hood in amazement. A while ago I leaned out the alda to see if it changed my mpg. After a couple of days I began to hear some nailing. I adjusted back to where I had it and in another couple of days the nailing disappeared.

I wonder if nailing has to do with too lean a mixture at idle? Most nailing symptoms do go away with just a bit of pedal right?

And maybe now that I have plenty of fuel it purrs like a kitten because it is not the slightest bit starving for fuel?

By the way what is the danger zone for EGTs? I have not gone over 1250F yet.

I was unable to look at your times Dave. Our mac needs to get updated.

gsxr · #99 06-23-2005, 09:33 PM

No clue about the noise/nailing thing - that's weird. Hmmm.

Anyway, with the catalyst in place and 15psi of boost on a stock engine, I did a torture test (WOT up a mountain at 110mph for 60 seconds) and saw - gulp - 1425F for probably 30 seconds. That's with the probe mounted in the #1 exhaust port. Since deleting the cat and reducing boost (each of which lowered EGT's), I haven't seen it over 1150F, I think... but I haven't been back to a long high-speed grade to torture test it. My dragstrip EGT's didn't change much... still hitting 1000F at the end of the 1/4 mile, and 1100F (approx) by 90mph from a standing start. It just seems to level out now around 1150F where before I could get it over 1300F on flat freeway if I wanted to.

Full details on the bone-stock EGT testing is here:
http://***************/forum/showthread.php?t=395

Sorry about the spreadsheet... you can download it and find some PC with Office to open it, if you don't have Office for Mac (which should work fine). For the 0-90mph data, here's a text file instead:
http://www.w124performance.com/docs/dragstrip/300D_0-90_testing.txt

#**100** 06-24-2005, 01:12 AM

I was dicussing this with a friend of dad's as well...how sure are we about the 1200F limit?
Is there anything in the text about this? (I don't have a service manual)

jbaj007 · #**101** 06-24-2005, 01:21 AM

From this site; talking about Ford, Cummins and Dodge, but piston alloy is piston alloy (to a certain extent). http://www.bankspower.com/Tech_whyegt.cfm

"So the big question is, what constitutes excessive EGT? If everything is working properly, 1250º to 1300º F. is a safe turbine inlet temperature, even for sustained running, mile after mile. Above 1300º F. things can start to get edgy. Remember, excessive EGT damage is cumulative. Over 1400º F., you’re usually gambling against a stacked deck and it’s only a matter of time until you lose. The higher the EGT, the shorter that time will be."

#**102** 06-24-2005, 02:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jbaj007

From this site; talking about Ford, Cummins and Dodge, but piston alloy is piston alloy (to a certain extent). http://www.bankspower.com/Tech_whyegt.cfm

Thank you for the info

gsxr · #**103** 06-24-2005, 10:20 AM

Don't forget the placement of your EGT probe can affect readings. A probe just before the turbo could give different temps than a probe stuck in the exhaust port (where mine is). That was an excellent link though - thanks for sharing!

gsxr · #**104** 06-24-2005, 05:05 PM

Update... I did a couple of 0-100mph runs, just because I never had before. Time was 32 seconds - ouch. Need to rectify that, huh. My dragstrip times are measureably slower off the line due to the higher elevation, btw. I attached the text file below - scroll to the bottom for the 0-100 data. I'll also paste this into the '0-90' worksheet in the Excel file and update the version on my website.

Side note - I saw peak EGT's of 1300F. D'oh... time for water injection.

mdisav · #**105** 06-24-2005, 06:30 PM

Dave, Is your probe in the number one exhaust manifold where an existing hole is tapped to the exact thread size? That is where mine is. I did a 0-100mph run today not timed though. EGTs reached just over 1200F and coolant temp went to 100C without the a/c on.

Thanks jbaj007 for the EGT data!!

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