Hello,

Recently bought a 1972 220D w115.110 and have used it only sparingly.. less than 500 miles.

It started very nicely when I bought it and for few weeks, but recently it began to take more cranks to start, and eventually after few days, it now won't start at all. It will crank and I have a new battery, but it will not fire on its own.

The fuel filter shows liquid inside, the dash glow indicator light is very strong, the tank is full, but no firing.

I read people suggesting to check valve clearance for hard starts, but can't imaging how that would cause it to go from easy-to-start to no-start under 500 miles.

Also, although I use it sparingly, it doesn't sit for a long time.

Any pointers or help is very appreciated.

Thanks!

Perhaps it is sucking air in somewhere? Look for an possible fuel leaks then try priming it with the hand pump. If that doesn't work come back. It's very easy to do amd is one of those very basic things.

Thanks
David

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2000 Honda Accord V6 137k miles

1972 300SEL 4.5 98k miles

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Thanks for the reply. I have tried the priming few times... no luck. I will look for any fuel or air leaks.

Any other pointers?

Thanks!

Does it run well and strong once it is started ?
Valve settings can make a big difference.....
The cable fittings from the battery have to be clean and tight in addition to having a strong battery.
You might consider having a compression test run on it... it is an old car.
If you have a screw on filter try putting Diesel Purge into that and see if it runs better after that.... or do a legit Diesel Purge cleaning by following the directions on the can.... it helped my 240d....

has it by any chance been converted to the fast glow plugs? my 72 220 got impossible to start after i converted it and i learned only after selling it for a loss that the glow plugs had all burned out. i had not suspected them because they had very low miles.

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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

Thanks again folks for pointers. Few comments;

- The car would run flawlessly once started. This is as of the last time when it did eventually start after an hour of trying and after about 45secs of pulling on the plunger.

- To my knowledge, the glo plugs have not been replaced. I was considering replacing them. I have found two types on http://www2.discountmbparts.com/parts/parts1/discountmbparts/wizard.jsp?year=1972&make=MB&model=220-D-001&category=F&&part=Glow+Plug. Could anyone pls comment if either is good or better for this application? The price difference is not huge.

- I have read some incomplete info about the valve clearance settings and the required tools on the web. Could anyone pls post pointer to the required tool and procedure?

- Does anyone here recommend a good Diesel shop in San Jose, CA?

Thanks for your help!

Unless it has been converted that car has the old type series wired glow plugs. If you are getting a glow light with that system it means that all 4 glow plugs are functioning. Before we order glow plugs we need to confirm if the original series wired system is still in place or if it has been converted to parallel plugs. Is there a wire from the #1 plug going to ground? If so, they are series wired, so, since you have a glow light, the plugs are all good. If no ground wire, they are parallel, and there could possibly be one or more bad ones.

Pictures would help.

__________________
Palangi

2004 C240 Wagon 203.261 Baby Benz
2008 ML320 CDI Highway Cruiser
2006 Toyota Prius, Saving the Planet @ 48 mpg
2000 F-150, Destroying the Planet @ 20 mpg



TRUMP .......... WHITEHOUSE
HILLARY .........JAILHOUSE
BERNIE .......... NUTHOUSE
0BAMA .......... OUTHOUSE

It is most certainly the original serial type. I get excellent glo indication on the dash. I agree with you that this should mean glo plugs are working, but was recommended by the seller to change them as the car sat unused for a while. I have attached a picture where it shows glo plug #1 is wired to block.

Thanks!

fshacker,

We should first concentrate on the GP. Why? Its the easiest and lowest cost thing to do and most likely to cause hard starting

First we have to know what type of GP you have. Original on your car were loop type which are series GP. There are "W" shaped resistance wires between the GP. If one of the GP burn out or any of the connections open, none of the GP work because the series circuit is interrupted.

But its possible the GP were changed to parallel GP. So find out what type of GP you have and let us know so we can diagnose your problem.

P E H

Hi, The glo plugs are certainly serial. They are interconnected using what you referred to as W wires, and the front one is connected to the block using braided grounding wires. I have some pictures that I couldn't attach last time as they are large but will be happy to email them to you. Or you can see them at the end of the car slides on http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/fshacker/my_photos

Thanks!

It could use new filters and fuel return lines. That will at least ensure you have no blockage in that end of the system. From the description, you have no fuel to the engine, so no matter how much you crank that puppy, all you are doing is moving air.

Other option is the engine is so coked up from under use that you have no compression left to keep the engine or start it running. Clean the fuel system and get fresh filters, change your oil to Mobil 1, as well as all transmission and differential fluids. Diesel purge the thing, and get fresh fuel. Then tow it up a hill and run it down for a bump start. If you do not get a start after hitting 30mph down that hill, you have a turd engine and need to sell the car to me for $50.

If it does run, then drive it like you stole it as far from California until the tank is near empty. Fill the tank, and drive back at high RPM. This should help to clean out the booggers and snot clogging the engine. From then on, do not let it sit, and when you drive it, make it a long and hard trip, so that all the crud is burnt out.

__________________
clay

2002 s430 - Victor, a Stately & well tailored chap
1974 450sl - Frosch - Two tone green
1986 SDL - Polei

retired models-
1976 300D - Blei Vanst - it looks silvery
1972 220D - Gump - She was green, simple and ran
1995 E300D - Gave her life to save me against a Dame in a SUV
POS 1987 SDL - Beware Nigerian Scammers

I am satisfied that the problem is not glow plugs.


Let's work on fuel.

Temporarily remove the hose from the input side of the prefilter. Let the prefilter drain into a small container. Check the drained fuel for debris or water. Reconnect the prefilter. Tighten all fuel line clamps on that line (4). Give it about 25 hard strokes of the primer pump. You should see fuel bubbling in he prefilter in time with your pump strokes. Does the primer pump leak fuel? (If so, it also sucks air.)

Move to the canister fuel filter. Open the drain plug and let it drain a few ounces into a small contaner. Check for debris or water. Secure the drain plug. Crack open the vent on the top of the canister. Put a towel over it. Pump the hell out of the primer pump until fuel is squirting out of the vent. Secure the vent while pumping. Continue pumping with very brisk strokes for, say 50 strokes or so.

Now try to start it. It may help to jump it with a second battery as the cars battery may be a bit drained from all the previous cranking. Does it sound like it's turning over fast enough?

Please try those steps and report back.

Do I see a valve cover bolt loose in one of those pictures?

__________________
Palangi

2004 C240 Wagon 203.261 Baby Benz
2008 ML320 CDI Highway Cruiser
2006 Toyota Prius, Saving the Planet @ 48 mpg
2000 F-150, Destroying the Planet @ 20 mpg



TRUMP .......... WHITEHOUSE
HILLARY .........JAILHOUSE
BERNIE .......... NUTHOUSE
0BAMA .......... OUTHOUSE

Thanks for all the replies.

I will try all fuel related suggestions this weekend and report back. I have a trickle charger attached to the battery which keeps if full.

Thanks again!

Hi, Here is what I have done today;

- I tried the below steps while I changed the prefilter with a new one and I also changed the prefilter fuel lines as a precaution. No traces of water and hopefully the new filter takes care of the debris. I also have ordered a new cannister type filter and will replace it Monday. The cannister filter is dirty but not obstructed because I could see fuel in the inside of the filter

- I pumped the primer until it become stiff and not taking any more and closed the vents while doing it

- I tried to start it and it sounded attempting to engage the first few revs but then quickly sounded like pumping air in the cyls

- I loosened one of the injectors nuts and put a container under it and reved the engine for 10-15 secs couple of times. I saw only a trace of fuel coming, and I mean a trace, ... it is no more than a 1/4 spoonful, but I don't know what could be normal since I'm new to working on diesel. I would've expected from the size of the injector pipe to see some squirting/splashing at least, but it looked more like seepage.

- I poured some fuel in the injector pump where there is a Red cover that has the word "Oel" which in German stands for both Oil and Diesel. I did this from memory of old cars I have seen before where part of priming required squirting some oil into the pump. Hope I didn't mess this one ... but no change, still no starting

So I will change the cannister filter and redo your instructions above again and may give up and tow it to a shop unless you guys can think of something else. Couple of parts dealers told me sounds like compression issue and I'm kind of starting to feel the reality - I just can't believe compression can hit so sudden over a span of 4 starts with no white smoke or gradual reluctance or degradation... it really only took 4 starts from working like a charm for 8 weeks, to firing after 2nd or 3rd crank, to firing after a bunch of cranks, to no firing at all !!!

Thanks!

Dang. By the fact fact that it coughed a few times, it sounds like it might have been close to starting. It is a bit hard to quantify the amount of fuel squirted by the injectors during cranking, it's not much actually. I bet if it's a manual transmission car, a push start would get it going. At this point a compression test is not a bad idea though.

By the way, in this case, oel means motor oel . Below the red cap there should be a plug. Unscrew that to let the excess out, and give it a bit of oel. You may want to do this a couple times to purge most of the fuel out. (Removing the plug sets the level, sorta like a differential fill plug).

__________________
Palangi

2004 C240 Wagon 203.261 Baby Benz
2008 ML320 CDI Highway Cruiser
2006 Toyota Prius, Saving the Planet @ 48 mpg
2000 F-150, Destroying the Planet @ 20 mpg



TRUMP .......... WHITEHOUSE
HILLARY .........JAILHOUSE
BERNIE .......... NUTHOUSE
0BAMA .......... OUTHOUSE