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  #31  
Old 06-29-2009, 11:57 PM
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Originally Posted by TurboSDL View Post
ok so would you have to take the cam sproket off then? doesnt usually the sprocket slide over the whole key tho? or is the part that slides over the camshaft flush with the shaft and the offset part the key sticks out so the sprocket can slide over it? i woudl think tho that the key could be prone to snapping?
There is a write up in the DIY section. I have not replaced the key on mine as the do not make one to take care 2 Degrees. It has to be 4 or more degrees off. Also there is different degrees of Offset. You need to know how far you are off to begin with.
The sprocket will slide over the offset key and the key will not stick out.
I have not read of any Keys shearing or snapping off.

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  #32  
Old 06-30-2009, 12:56 AM
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The key is really only meant to index the gear to the cam. There is a bolt that secures the gear onto the cam and if it is torqued properly then the key sees very little force.
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  #33  
Old 07-01-2009, 02:54 PM
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Ok,

I am doing this tomorrow on both my 617 and 603.

Today when I was replacing the vac pump in my 603 I looked at the IP. First off I see no primer... So where do I prime it to get the drip from the tube? Second, I can't seem to find the bolts I need to loosen in order to rotate the pump.

On the SD I see all the stuff I need to get to.

My final question is the chain stretch. My SD has just under 5 degrees of stretch. How does that figure in to the 24 degree BTDC? Do I add to that or subtract or what?

I did some searching but most the info is for the 617 and I have both. My Army diesel mechanic friend told me to just adjust the pump with the engine running until the engine smoothed out. And that was how they timed HUMVEE's

Anyway, Thanks
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  #34  
Old 07-01-2009, 08:15 PM
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nobody?

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  #35  
Old 07-01-2009, 11:32 PM
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Originally Posted by ashedd View Post
Ok,

I am doing this tomorrow on both my 617 and 603.

Today when I was replacing the vac pump in my 603 I looked at the IP. First off I see no primer... So where do I prime it to get the drip from the tube? Second, I can't seem to find the bolts I need to loosen in order to rotate the pump.

On the SD I see all the stuff I need to get to.

My final question is the chain stretch. My SD has just under 5 degrees of stretch. How does that figure in to the 24 degree BTDC? Do I add to that or subtract or what?

I did some searching but most the info is for the 617 and I have both. My Army diesel mechanic friend told me to just adjust the pump with the engine running until the engine smoothed out. And that was how they timed HUMVEE's

Anyway, Thanks
I believe your IP is supposed to use that AB light or dynamic type timing; meaning it does not call for Drip Timing
Go to this site and pic your Engine to see.
http://www.ps2cho.net/downloads/MB%20CD/W124/Main.html

You do not have to figure the 5 degrees of stretch as you will be correcting the late IP timing when you rotate it to get that 1 drop per second.
The reason is that you are setting the begin of injection (using the Drip Method) on the IP to correspond to a certain place where the #1 Piston is on the Compression Stroke and the 24 degrees on the Crank Damper is used to referance that. You are not timing the IP to the Camshaft.
However, you will still have 5 degrees late Camshaft Timing.

Another choice would be to use the more accurate 2mm method to check your Timing Chain Stretch and install the correct offset key to restore the Camshaft Timing.
Afterwich, do the IP timing.
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  #36  
Old 07-02-2009, 12:25 AM
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WOW

Thanks for the link. I knew about the German site with the CD manuals online but I have never seen this one. I thought I needed the AB light for my 124 but could not see the "plug in" spot on the IP.

The timing stretch makes sense now that you explained it. I know I need to shim it but the SD is a glorified parts car/winter beater. I just want to try to lose this engine shake and recover some fuel economy.



Thanks again.
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  #37  
Old 07-02-2009, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by ashedd View Post
WOW

Thanks for the link. I knew about the German site with the CD manuals online but I have never seen this one. I thought I needed the AB light for my 124 but could not see the "plug in" spot on the IP.

The timing stretch makes sense now that you explained it. I know I need to shim it but the SD is a glorified parts car/winter beater. I just want to try to lose this engine shake and recover some fuel economy.



Thanks again.
The offset key is not expensive so it is mostly the extra labor involved in doing the 2mm method and changing the key and I guess a new Valve Cover Gasket if you want one.

Keep in mind any of the internet manuals are subject to dissapear without notice!
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  #38  
Old 07-03-2009, 06:09 PM
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so where do u get an offset key?
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  #39  
Old 07-04-2009, 01:35 AM
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Originally Posted by TurboSDL View Post
so where do u get an offset key?
The Dealer for sure Fastlane maybe.
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  #40  
Old 07-04-2009, 11:27 AM
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The key only corrects cam timing, not IP timing. Delivery of fuel timing will still need to be checked/corrected.

Also note that the measured chain stretch at the camshaft will be considerably more than what will create the 'late' fuel delivery.
This is due to the cam sprocket at the total length of the chain and the IP is at maybe half the driven length. The crankshaft pulls the chain along...
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  #41  
Old 07-06-2009, 10:49 PM
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I timed the 617 today, the 603 needs the AB light.

The DIY mentions 3 bolts to loosen. I only found three(nuts) on the IP flange. With all three loose the IP did move although not very much(1/2" at most). I got the engine at 26 degree BTDC, Forced Induction mentioned trying that number. I never really got the fuel to drip from the tube. At first it did then the primer would leak fuel from underneath and the fuel would come out the drip tube in a stream. I messed with it for a while and then got the IP in a place I thought was good. My inital mark I made with a marker is now about 1/8" away from where it was. The IP got rotated towards me about 1/8". I would have liked to have seen the pump move atleast an inch in adjustment but I could only get it to move back and fourth about 1/2".

So now the engine does not start quite as well as it did... It seems to lope(?) like a gasser with an agrresive cam in it. But it does have more power off the line. I did adjust a little bit of slack out of the throtle linkage. And I did lose some of the idle shake.

So is it timed?? I have no idea. I may try it again. Is there a 4th bolt/nut at the rear of the IP? I was happy to get the throtle linkage cleaned/lubed AND that darn air cleaner finally secured.
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92 400E
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  #42  
Old 07-06-2009, 10:51 PM
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PS...

My new parts car OM601 shakes something fierce at idle. Do you think I should try to adjust the timing to smooth it out. It is a "mis at idle" type of shake and not a motor mount thing. I have to drive it from the east coast to Indiana at the end of the month.
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83 300SD
85 300TD
92 400E
85 190D

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  #43  
Old 07-07-2009, 01:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashedd View Post
I timed the 617 today, the 603 needs the AB light.

The DIY mentions 3 bolts to loosen. I only found three(nuts) on the IP flange. With all three loose the IP did move although not very much(1/2" at most). I got the engine at 26 degree BTDC, Forced Induction mentioned trying that number. I never really got the fuel to drip from the tube. At first it did then the primer would leak fuel from underneath and the fuel would come out the drip tube in a stream. I messed with it for a while and then got the IP in a place I thought was good. My inital mark I made with a marker is now about 1/8" away from where it was. The IP got rotated towards me about 1/8". I would have liked to have seen the pump move atleast an inch in adjustment but I could only get it to move back and fourth about 1/2".

So now the engine does not start quite as well as it did... It seems to lope(?) like a gasser with an agrresive cam in it. But it does have more power off the line. I did adjust a little bit of slack out of the throtle linkage. And I did lose some of the idle shake.

So is it timed?? I have no idea. I may try it again. Is there a 4th bolt/nut at the rear of the IP? I was happy to get the throtle linkage cleaned/lubed AND that darn air cleaner finally secured.
There is a 4th bolt at the rear of the IP.
The above comment in red make me think that you were standing by the drivers side Fender and Rotating the top of the IP towards you. If you did this it would retard the IP timing.
Rotating the top of the IP towards the Engine advances the timing.

It is also a help if someone else pumps the hand primer for you and you can concentrate on turning the IP and watching the drips (Injector Hard lines removed to make the IP easier to turn, Throttle in the full fuel position, Hose to the Vacuum Shutoff removed).
If you wire the Throttle in Full Fuel be sure to tape a not on the Steering Wheel so that you do not start the Engine with it like that.
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  #44  
Old 07-07-2009, 01:16 AM
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Originally Posted by ashedd View Post
PS...

My new parts car OM601 shakes something fierce at idle. Do you think I should try to adjust the timing to smooth it out. It is a "mis at idle" type of shake and not a motor mount thing. I have to drive it from the east coast to Indiana at the end of the month.
Try loosening 1 Injector hard line nut and see if that changes the missing and tighten it back up and do the same to each injector on down the line.

If the Injector is good and everthing in the Cylinder is working properly when you loosen the Hard Line nut you should cause a noticable differance in the idle.
If there is something wrong with the Injector or that Cylinder loosening the nut will not have much effect on the idle.
If you locate a bad Cylinder you can find out if it is the Injector itself causing the problem by swapping one of the Injectors that is good with the one you think is bad.
If the problem follows that suspected bad Injector it is the Injector causing the miss.

You could also be haveing an air leak somewhere in the fuel inlet system.

You might be able to see if a motor mount is collasped.

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