Well said! I totally agree. I have lived in some terrible ghettos with lots of crime, and while there were shootings occasionally in the neighborhood, I never felt that a pistol was justified or would positively add to the situation despite having been mugged a few times.

In those situations, the mugger got the drop on me anyway, to pull a pistol would have resulted in me being shot or stabbed. The situation has to play out in a very specific way in order for you to successfully defend yourself with a gun.

Its like saying being a good driver automatically protects you from all accidents.

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If I get mugged...I'm playing the scared cooperative "don't kill me" passifist until they walk away.

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1987 300TDT - 195,000 (Original #14 head)
1993 190E 2.3 - 105,000
1981 300D - 250,000

At which point you would stand a fairly good chance of getting charged with murder as you shot them when they ran off. You are better off just carrying a knife and picking your battles.

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First of all, it is a "magazine", not a "clip".

Secondly, imo, you guys are getting your pants all in a wad over this Policeman. I have zero problems being stopped and my ID checked, which has happened to me. Never have been stopped to check my fuel tank yet. I'm be OK with it because I don't want people cheating the Fed/State tax system out of revenue by using untaxed farm fuel.

Aside from having my ID checked anyway when I use a credit card or write a check, ID verification can find illegal aliens, registration violations and probably car insurance violations too.

I don't expect most of you to agree with me but I think it needed saying.

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1993 W124 300D 2.5L Turbo, OM602.962
2000 Chevrolet Cavalier, 2.4L DOHC
2002 Ford Explorer, 4.0L SOHC
2005 Toyota Prius, 1.5L

http://www.fuelly.com/sig-us/40601.png

Agreed with your sentiments 100%. Never trust the police, never give any more information than necessary.

They are there to make arrests. If you happen to be a criminal all the better.

I run nothing but D2 in my tank. When I had some leftover transmission fluid I dumped it into my tank 4 months ago.

I've been asked if an officer can search my car. I asked what probable cause he had and of course he didn't have any so I refused. Didn't have much of an issue then (wasn't drinking or whatever). This was in PA too.

There is a video on youtube with a sheriff's officer talking to a group of law students. I believe the video is entitled "Don't talk to the police". If I wasn't in California I would post the link. It's very informative.

The wrong type of people become police officers. The bullies, low thinkers, and jocks are the ones who are working to protect us. Anything to rain their egos in should be done. Put them in station wagon Volvos and make their uniforms bright pink or yellow like in the UK.

As for tank dipping, I've never seen it happen before but I would ask for the statute and regulation numbers. You have rights, but exercise them politely like I did. If a cop really doesn't like you he'll jail you for whatever reason even if you rolled over and played dead.

Ok time to hit the beach.

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-Typos courtesy of my mobile phone.

I totally agree with this, ive always felt that for some people, they just dont have natural authority, and those that do don't have it right out of the police academy.
A cop has to be the authority in most given situations. A 20 year old kid new on the police force has no real authority apart from his badge, and if he or she is the right kind of personality, will make up for it by developing the bully mentality and use abusive behavior to do the things that they think need to be done.

For examply, I never trust any cop and tread lightly if they are wearing gloves. That just tells me that they at trying to remain unaccountable after the fact.

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Yup be polite, cooperative, and know that when an officer says, "There's a new regulation that requires me to hold you at gun point." He's probably making it up.

Here's the video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t7

Learn your rights and exercise them. Being cooperative does not mean let the law enforcement officer walk over you. He can and probably will.

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-Typos courtesy of my mobile phone.

I buy large (Prevost) motorcoaches for a living. These beasts carry 200+ gallons of fuel, and when I buy it I have to get it home. Fortunately, up to now I've always found the (racor) fuel filter bowls to be amber, not red.

Although I doubt that I (or any private coach) will be pulled over and stick-tested, I worry a little about picking up one with red fuel in the tank and being tested. I think that generally (not always I guess) you are in pretty good shape if you don't give them a reason to pull you over or suspect wrongdoing, which my Pilot brothers call "cleaning up the wreckage", or having everything in order before you start so that there isn't a reason to suspect nor ticket you and no reason to detain you if you are pulled over for another reason.

As to the handgun thing? To each his own, but it seems that many of the people I know with carry permits, ... are the very ones who shouldn't have one (high on the power of having a gun at-hand). Much like many of the Police Officers I know / have met.

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Gone to the dark side

- Jeff

I thought for a moment that I had entered by mistake in an NRA forum here...

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[/SIGPIC]~cirrusman

1983 Mercedes Benz 300SD - Wife calls him "Chitty Chitty Bang Bang"
[SIGPIC]




1983 Toyota Tercel (Tommy, The little Toyota that could)
1965 Ford F100 (Grandma Ford)
2005 Toyota Sienna (Elsa, Wife's ride)


Gone:
1988 Toyota Pickup
2004 Subaru Outback

1987 Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham
1986 Volvo 740 GL Station Wagon - Piece of junk.
1981 Volvo 242 DL 2 Door - Hated to see it go. R.I.P.
1987 Pontiac Fiero GT

Agreed about gun owners. Most people make it very clear that they own a gun and dream an the opportunity to use it.

As another person said, I've never been pulled over for no reason. Speeding has always been the case. When I'm at fault I am certainly not gonna pull the "I have rights" card and remove my chance of getting a warning. Last time I was pulled for speeding, I got my papers out and didn't mention my gun. He didn't ask, went through procedure and gave me a warning. It was late and my instrument cluster fuse was out and I had tried fixing it that day.

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1987 300TDT - 195,000 (Original #14 head)
1993 190E 2.3 - 105,000
1981 300D - 250,000

The burden is not on the carrier to present a "good reason" for believing they should carry. The burden is to establish a good reason why they *shouldn't*. That's what rights are about.

It's the same principle as choosing to remain silent even if you're innocent. It's your right whether it's "necessary" or helpful or not, and it's explicitly protected in that they deliberately instruct the jury (when they remember to) that your choice to remain silent is *not* to cause them to assume you must be hiding something or you would have answered.

Some of us carry simply because it's the way things have always been done in our family and around our area with "our" people. With no intention of actually harming anyone, but preferring to be ready for the worst-case "just in case" scenario, potentially. Or simply because there's no reason why a person *shouldn't* carry a gun just as there's no reason they shouldn't carry a pocket knife, a hammer, an ink pen, a hamster, or a picture of their mother-in-law if they want to. It's just a tool in a pocket unless it's mis-used. I'm all for preventing mis-use, Lord knows. But when the suspicion starts turning on the honest people who really *don't* intend any harm by it, that's when it starts to become a difficult situation. The right to carry means that you don't have to prove a good reason why you feel you should. Someone else should have to prove why you shouldn't.

In response to dropnosky:
It is, if he shoots the thief just for messing with the laptops. But it's still worth the carry so that the gun stays in his pocket until after he says "Leave that stuff alone," the thief says "You wanna make something of it?" and physically attacks him, and THEN it's within his rights as self-defense to make the attack stop.

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~Michael S.~
Past cars:

1986 300SDL
1987 300SDL
1982 240D
1982 300SD


Current:

1987 300SDL

I don't really care about the reasons people choose to carry weapons, and I recognize that it is a legal right. I'm simply saying that the cop has every reason to be careful whenever he has reason to believe someone is armed. He may encounter 100s of armed people over the years, if he's not careful with every one of them his luck may eventually run out.

Personally, I would rather see a very strict screening process to obtain a permit; maybe something equivalent to a low level security clearance (paid for by the applicant). IMO, somebody should spend some real effort on a real background check before issuing a permit. There are plenty of disturbed/drunk/high/angry folks out there without a criminal record. It could probably be done for a couple $1000, and it would weed out plenty of people that no-one wants to be armed.

There used to be plenty of laws to keep people "nobody wants to be armed" from being armed. In some communities, they still exist.

States and counties frequently had "May issue", "Permit to acquire", approval from the local Sheriff, etc. language which were very thinly veiled attempts to keep "those people" from being able to buy guns and defend themselves.

Once you are able to determine who "those people" are, you can see why such Jim Crow tactics did not provide equal protection under the law.

SteveM.

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'93 190E/D 2.5 Turbodiesel 5-speed (daily driver)
'87 190D 2.5 Turbo rustbucket - parts car
'84 Dodge Rampage diesel - Land Speed Record Holder
'13 Ram 2500 Diesel
'05 Toyota 4Runner

We certainly don't want poor people being able to protect themselves.

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'93 190E/D 2.5 Turbodiesel 5-speed (daily driver)
'87 190D 2.5 Turbo rustbucket - parts car
'84 Dodge Rampage diesel - Land Speed Record Holder
'13 Ram 2500 Diesel
'05 Toyota 4Runner

I've had many different encounters with police and my weapon.

The best would be a small town cop that said, "I'm damn proud you're exercising your rights. You drive safely and have a great day."

The worst would be a TX DPS officer asked me to come back to the back of the car (before asking for ID) and when I handed him both cards, he asked me where my weapon was. Front of pants holster (SmartCarry). He spun me around drew his weapon and order me spread eagle on the car. Reholstered his weapon, then stuck his hand in my pants, removed my weapon and threw it on the floor of the front passenger side. Told me I'd better not ever come out of a car with a weapon on me... He was an ass. What different is that from walking past him at the coffee shop with 24rds on my person?

I even have two cops in the family. Cops are people too. Some are great, some are complete asshats.

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'85 300TD "Puff The Magic Wagon" - Rolling Resto
'19 Mazda CX-9 Signature - Wife's sled
'21 Morgan 3-Wheeler P101 Edition
'95 E300d - SOLD
'84 300TD "Brown Betty" - Miss this one
'81 240D "China Baby" - Farm grocery getter