Need your eyes . . . - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Palangi · #16 11-23-2011, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerry

I also don't see any evidence of mismatched panels.

Look at the 4th picture. The rear fender and roof appear darker than the doors and front fender, especially above the trim line.

tankowner · #17 11-23-2011, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Palangi

Look at the 4th picture. The rear fender and roof appear darker than the doors and front fender, especially above the trim line.

You know, you're right. But I think that's just the lighting - especially if you consider that the panel curves in opposite directions away from the trim line and the whole thing is shined up like a new penny.

I'm going to go take a look at it, so I'll let you know how it looks in person.

Thanks again.

vstech · #18 11-23-2011, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Palangi

Look at the 4th picture. The rear fender and roof appear darker than the doors and front fender, especially above the trim line.

the "darker" below the line is simply a reflection of the pavement in my opinion. a good photographer would have gotten shots of the car in better lighting.

kerry · #19 11-23-2011, 08:08 PM

I think it's the lighting also.

MBeige · #20 11-24-2011, 12:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerry

I think it's the lighting also.

Agreed, seems the lighting and reflections make it seem like it's been repainted.

Nothing obvious from these angles either, except the left rear door is confirmed to be not fully closed in this pic:

Photographer/seller closed rear door for this photo

In this photo the left trim piece on the quarter panel seems to have a bigger gap than usual to the door trim piece (belt line moulding). This could lead to an illusion when seen from the rear, the trim piece seems to be pushed out from its 8mm screw fastener so it could make the rear look like it's mis-aligned.

Zacharias · #21 11-24-2011, 10:05 AM

I think it's a really sweet-looking 240d, looks clean and sits right at all four corners. As far as the paint, it could be immensely worse, and with a car that age I wouldn't be bothered by some respray areas.

I hope it sounds and drives as good as it appears. It's such a huge letdown to be disappointed after travelling to see a car.

Good luck!

Yak · #22 11-24-2011, 12:26 PM

Maybe someone can California can explain the tags, or if it's currently licensed. A pic of the rear plate says Oct '10; the photos say taken in July '11. My dated experience with CA DMV was that there could issues if registration wasn't current for a transaction.

The replace dash w/zebrano and the console w/ plastic is a mismatch, but explained by the new dash. The glove box alignment can be fixed, since it appears the glove box door isn't warped.

Oil cooler looks no-OE.

Maybe some body-/paint-work done on FR fender. Fog light is slightly mis-aligned (very minor) turn signal doesn't quite fit, and the paint on the front fender corner under the bumper looks differently colored/cleaner or different. But the top-inner side appears appropriately dirty and the bolt heads look painted, so it's tough to say.

Front glass looks clear, no scratches or chips visible, rubber seal looks "fresh" and not dry-rotted.

Oil dipstick loop broken and missing hood pad. Otherwise, it looks like new oil hoses, "appropriately" dirty near the valve cover.

My question to the seller would be suspension work. The tops of the shocks (engine bay pics) appear old/original - but they only have one nut and I think the OE had two. The tires look new-ish, but the front right may have additional wear/cupping inboard. Again, it's tough to tell due to lighting etc.

Odd wear on the tops of the passenger seat. Maybe swapped from the DS?

I don't see anything to run away from regarding bodywork, but questions worth asking.

Is there an A/C compressor somewhere? It looks like there's no York, and a disconnected hose on the passenger fenderwell, and there's no R4.

MBeige · #23 11-24-2011, 02:43 PM

Good catch Yak!

Flickr states that the photo was taken on July 2011. Since the rear tag is 2010 (nice catch) it could have been a PNO (planned non-operation). Maybe the seller can fill in that info. It's technically illegal to drive the vehicle on the street with this type of registration.

tankowner · #24 11-25-2011, 02:41 PM

Continued thanks for your feedback, I have some additional information on the car. . .

The owner indicates that he is, as far as he knows, the 3rd owner. The car was purchased in Cali when he was still living there, but has since moved to MO (sorry guys, I should have clarified earlier that the car was not in CA, but thanks to those that offered advice on long-distance purchases - it is still a few hours hours away though, so it is still relevant.) The car has not really been driven much since its transplant to MO. The owner also owned a '81 auto 240D that he ran veggie oil in - apparently the plan was to upgrade to this manual 240D, but life moved on for him and he no longer has the time to invest. Owner indicates that he has never run veggie in this car, it has been sitting since the move and now he is ready to part with it.

Other info:
-Car passed inspection within the past 60 days.
-Owner reports mileage in the high 20 mpg range.
- The vacuum system is sounds after repairing a diaphragm in one of the door locks. Locks operate properly, car shuts off with key, etc.
- Oil changes every few thousand miles. Oil cooler and lines replaced after he purchased because they were weeping where the crimped metal meets the hose.
-Owner rebuilt the injectors and indicates he used a pop tester to set them himself.
-No exterior leaks to report with the exception of a small leak at the trunk; a few drips noticeable after washing. Owner says the seal is folded down at this spot and thinks that is the cause.
- Owner replaced the dash himself with one he found while in CA - prior dash was cracked, currently lays a dash cover (not attached) over it to protect the uncracked dash from the sunlight.
- Owner did not replace the seats, so that work was apparently done by a previous owner.
- Owner reports no known accidents (I am awaiting the VIN# to do a Carfax); but he did acknowledge the ding to the grill which he thinks was done by the inspection garage - but wasn't confident enough to pursue it.
- Owner acknowledges a small rust spot on the lower, inner edge of the driver door.
- The power sunroof was removed for cleaning and greasing - works properly now.
- Owner acknowledges that the AC compressor is absent and has been since he bought it. AC wasn't much of a concern to him in CA, but that is a different story in MO, which he has factored into his asking price.

SO, that is what I know. The owner seems very straightforward and talked about how owning an old MB is partly a hobby that he enjoys but just doesn't have the time for anymore. I plan to run the Carfax as soon as he emails the VIN. We are currently at $2500 on the price. Tell me what you think . . .

Zacharias · #25 11-25-2011, 02:55 PM

The CarFax won't do much for you. Their system cannot handle pre-1980 (or is it 1981) cars with non-standard serial number arrangements.

Why does it have CA plates on it? When were these pics taken?

I have been cheerleading this until now. But if this is a case of re-use of sale pics (presumably from when the current owner purchased it) that pulls my emergency chain big time... I got ripped off on my CD by the vendor doing that.

Stretch · #26 11-25-2011, 02:55 PM

Buy it.

tankowner · #27 11-25-2011, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zacharias

The CarFax won't do much for you. Their system cannot handle pre-1980 (or is it 1981) cars with non-standard serial number arrangements.

Why does it have CA plates on it? When were these pics taken?

I have been cheerleading this until now. But if this is a case of re-use of sale pics (presumably from when the current owner purchased it) that pulls my emergency chain big time... I got ripped off on my CD by the vendor doing that.

Can you guys tell me about pre-1980 VINs because now I am getting a little uncertain. On my '83 I can find the VIN two place - on the B pillar (near door latch) and on the A pillar - visible through the windshield. When I was talking to the owner he mentioned something about a dust-up over the VIN# when he took the car to get inspected and basically said the garage didn't understand VINs on older cars. When I asked if he had a VIN# he said yes and emailed me this: 12312310146130 - looks like a chasis ID to me. What does a pre-1980 VIN look like (again, this is a '79 240D)

The car has CA plates on it because that is where it was purchased. The owner then moved to MO, but car has not been registered in this state. The pictures were taken in a park in MO - the date on them is July and the owner indicated that the car has been parked for longer than that. I believe that he took the pictures himself, what I am worried about is the VIN#.

When I asked if he had gotten interest in the car, he indicated that he had practically sold it once, but the sale eventaully fell apart because the inspection garage made a big deal about the VIN#. What's up with the VIN?

Zacharias · #28 11-25-2011, 03:59 PM

From 1981 on, standard VIN sequences are 17 digits/numerals.

Pre-1981 each manufacturer did their own thing.

It is possible that younger brain at a shop would freak out over an old VIN. It's happened to me at a dealer over a parts order on an old car (not Mercedes).

Your sequence is correct at 14 digits. Whether it contains the correct digits, with respect to the actual vehicle, you would have to confirm in person.

EDIT: 123123 is the correct start for a 240d. The only Mercedes VIN decoder I know of can't handle these old VINs, so I can't say any more.

Have the owner confirm if the bruhaha was just over the non-standard (old style) VIN, or was there a mismatch between the paper and the car itself? That happened to me on an older car....

If it was just the shop not used to an old Benz VIN, relax that is no issue.

Don't get too wrapped up in this dissection of your potential purchase based on what we can see in some pics. Just go see it and drive it....

tankowner · #29 11-25-2011, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zacharias

Don't get too wrapped up in this dissection of your potential purchase based on what we can see in some pics. Just go see it and drive it....

You're right and I'm not. I will leave it to the test drive to decide. I just got a little freaked over the VIN thing, but if the number supplied looks legit for a pre-80's MB, then I am okay with that. I just didn't want to drive several hours to test drive if the VIN was messed up.

Thanks!

EDIT: So where do you find the VIN# on pre-80's MBs?

Yak · #30 11-25-2011, 04:51 PM

I thought the standard locations for VINs were the driver's A-pillar and the firewall. I understand there can be some discrepancies in the numbers between VIN and series build numbers, so it's possible there can be mis-matches. I don't recall if the mismatch is usually some form of prefix or a suffix. That may raise concerns about things like a clear title, salvage- or rebuilds, etc. There may be nothing nefarious, but it might look off enough when combined with a move from out of state to scare off buyers.

For a CA-model and a diesel there may be additional identifying marks or tags on the radiator support or the door post that refer to a 1977 (I think) federal regulation. Something like "complied with DOT-R 1977 emission specs..." This doesn't mean it's from '77, just the label says that what the spec was.

It is a pretty car and definitely worth a look. I'd be a bit concerned about the work that's been done and the intent to go SVO/WVO but not completing it (e.g. rebuilt, pop-tested nozzles). I'd definitely include a start from 'cold' in the test drive, and possibly a compression check.

I would also maybe subtract a bit more for the missing compressor, depending on how much else is missing. Finding York brackets, hoses, etc, may be neither cheap nor easy. On the plus side though, it does give you a nearly clean slate to start with if A/C is a must have.

Get on out there and drive it.