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  #1  
Old 06-14-2013, 08:52 PM
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Judgement day 94 E320 save or use for 87 300D

First off, the reason for the post here is because this car could end up as the facelift car for my 87 300D.... need opinions.

I'm torn here. I have the 94 E320 up in the air for the first time. Ready to drop the transmission (no reverse) Did another walk around on the car and can't decide if I should fix this car and drive it, or part it and use the front/interior in my 87 300D.

What I understand is that the front brakes would also go to the 87.

The good-

1. even with the little bit of sticky stale gas in it (sat for some time) it purrs.
2.Started right up, drove nice.
3. Interior is in really good shape with only the drivers seat showing any wear. Has an aftermarket Fuzz buster/cd changer installed. (do not know the radio code)

4. Even the A/C blows cold.
5. New Bosh Euro headlights.
6. New wire harness.
7. New head gaskets
8. brake fluid looks new.
9. was owned by a forum member that took extremely good care of it.
10 Aftermarket remote entry.
11. Heated (leather) seats. Don't feel like mbtex?


The bad-
1. Needs tires/front shocks for sure, maybe rear also but look newer.
2. was a northern car /NH Shows signs of salty winters.
3. 220k
4. Sat for some time due to reverse fail.
5. Needs new windshield
6. body rust. looks surface. signs of salt underneath but solid. Unprotected parts (bolts etc) rusted.
7. took a tree branch to the roof.
8. the no reverse issue of course...

I'm into this car very safe. so I can go either way and be just fine on it but man it's a hard call...

Here are pictures of the car... video coming as soon as youtube is ready with it...
Attached Thumbnails
Judgement day 94 E320 save or use for 87 300D-img_0109.jpg   Judgement day 94 E320 save or use for 87 300D-img_0110.jpg   Judgement day 94 E320 save or use for 87 300D-img_0114.jpg   Judgement day 94 E320 save or use for 87 300D-img_0115.jpg   Judgement day 94 E320 save or use for 87 300D-img_0116.jpg  


Last edited by ngarover; 06-14-2013 at 09:02 PM.
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  #2  
Old 06-14-2013, 08:54 PM
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More....

Also, I have a suitcase full of documentation, all recipes etc on the car, boxes of spare parts the seller sent along in the truck etc... looks like a full set of rear control arms etc... other various goodies that I have not even taken the time to really go threw.
Attached Thumbnails
Judgement day 94 E320 save or use for 87 300D-img_0118.jpg   Judgement day 94 E320 save or use for 87 300D-img_0123.jpg   Judgement day 94 E320 save or use for 87 300D-img_0124.jpg   Judgement day 94 E320 save or use for 87 300D-img_0119.jpg   Judgement day 94 E320 save or use for 87 300D-img_0120.jpg  


Last edited by ngarover; 06-14-2013 at 09:05 PM.
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  #3  
Old 06-14-2013, 09:09 PM
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Hmm tough call.

Random thoughts in no particular order:

- the rust issue is not as critical as on a 123. 124s have galvanized steel so the rust should just be limited to the places where the paint has been breached. Looks like it can be saved. Also the tree hit looks fixable from here.

- Radio code, pull the radio and call Ed at Becker with the serial, he can get you the code. Or the dealer should be able to look it up by the VIN. My 98 has that same radio and if it has the Bose speakers it is quite good.

- Maybe the reverse issue is something simple...or not.

- It's a gas engine, but it looks like the major things (head gasket, wire harness) have been addressed.

My vote, fix it and either drive it or flip it on the FS forum.
__________________
2014 ML350 Bluetec (wife's DD)
2008 E320 Bluetec (my DD)
2008 ML320 CDI (Older son's college DD)
1998 E300DT (Younger son's college DD)
1987 300TD sold to vstech
----------
gone but living on
1983 240D (body to greazzer, engine to t walgamuth)
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  #4  
Old 06-14-2013, 09:27 PM
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Video link to car..... This is the first day I got it and did a walk around.

94 E320 first walk around - YouTube

Today up on the jack stands...

http://youtu.be/aFlyVumIY_Y
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  #5  
Old 06-14-2013, 10:21 PM
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Also just found out that the gas has been changed regular, so it just the gas currently in it that is getting old. There is not even enough in the car to register on the gauge. Car's been ran regularly even while it was sitting. The seats are Roser Leather, I have to correct radio code, just didn't follow the steps correctly, and last but not least, there are new brake pads in the truck for the rear cause all 4 where bought but was discovered that only fronts needed to be replaced!
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  #6  
Old 06-15-2013, 10:48 AM
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This decision is a no brainer....

Over the last twenty years of w124 ownership, I've bought/scrapped many W124 chassis cars.

With the value of really nice W124 cars hitting a ridiculous low, there is no economic justification to returning this car to the road. Even if you value your time at zero, and the car was free, you're not going to come out ahead.

I've had to make this decision lots of time, and only twice have I repaired the car. Once was a very nice, one owner 300TE with a bad trans ( I had a known good one in another wreck), and nothing significant wrong otherwise.

The other was my current 95 E300, which had full records, had been serviced as required and other than the crunched rear end (I had all the parts from a 94 E320 parts car), was also a very nice car. If I add up the value of the rear clip, exclusive of my time invested, I'm probably close to market value in the car. I chose to fix this car because of it's relative rarity...and because I wanted to drive a diesel again...

In both cases, I only had one main issue to deal with per car, and I had the needed parts for each in hand for no additional cost outlay.

The other no go is the rust. The W124 body is very good at disguising rust. I owned a 400E that had been driven in Pittsburgh. The car had been owned by a bodyshop owner. To walkup to the car and look at the paint and interior, you'd think it was a very clean car.
But.... look underneath, and EVERYTHING that bolted onto the body was rusted. Not just rust, but stuff like the rear subframe mounts rusting off, brake and fuel lines rusting through, calipers frozen, and much, much more. Moreover, just working on the car was a PIA. EVERY bolt was seized, then rounded off no matter how much penetrant you used.

Gack.

Use the parts to upgrade your D. But... be aware that many of the electrical connectors use a different style pin, a change I believe was made in 94. Oh, I bet your headlights are std USA, The '94 front end update uses a euro style USA legal light that perform at near euro levels. No 5w parking light or levelers, otherwise equivalent to euro spec.

Jim
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  #7  
Old 06-15-2013, 10:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimFreeh View Post
Over the last twenty years of w124 ownership, I've bought/scrapped many W124 chassis cars.

With the value of really nice W124 cars hitting a ridiculous low, there is no economic justification to returning this car to the road. Even if you value your time at zero, and the car was free, you're not going to come out ahead.

I've had to make this decision lots of time, and only twice have I repaired the car. Once was a very nice, one owner 300TE with a bad trans ( I had a known good one in another wreck), and nothing significant wrong otherwise.

The other was my current 95 E300, which had full records, had been serviced as required and other than the crunched rear end (I had all the parts from a 94 E320 parts car), was also a very nice car. If I add up the value of the rear clip, exclusive of my time invested, I'm probably close to market value in the car. I chose to fix this car because of it's relative rarity...and because I wanted to drive a diesel again...

In both cases, I only had one main issue to deal with per car, and I had the needed parts for each in hand for no additional cost outlay.

The other no go is the rust. The W124 body is very good at disguising rust. I owned a 400E that had been driven in Pittsburgh. The car had been owned by a bodyshop owner. To walkup to the car and look at the paint and interior, you'd think it was a very clean car.
But.... look underneath, and EVERYTHING that bolted onto the body was rusted. Not just rust, but stuff like the rear subframe mounts rusting off, brake and fuel lines rusting through, calipers frozen, and much, much more. Moreover, just working on the car was a PIA. EVERY bolt was seized, then rounded off no matter how much penetrant you used.

Gack.

Use the parts to upgrade your D. But... be aware that many of the electrical connectors use a different style pin, a change I believe was made in 94. Oh, I bet your headlights are std USA, The '94 front end update uses a euro style USA legal light that perform at near euro levels. No 5w parking light or levelers, otherwise equivalent to euro spec.

Jim
I do see your point. Here's what I 'm going to do, Tomorrow I'm going to drop the transmission and find out exactly what it needs to fix. I've read all the threads on this fix and all seem to be fairly simple. I spend a good part of the summer last year rebuilding transmissions for a local shop, so not that big a deal to me. Either way, I would have to drop the trans anyways so no loss. It will also give me a clear view of everything going on under the car obviously. I may go ahead and pull the body panels and expose the car underneath to get a better look at any rust issues. Again, would have to do it anyways. Same with taking off the wheels etc, if I find the car to be savable I can simply load the rims up and have tires mounted on them, drive the car while I work on the 87 some more and be able to really take my time with it. In the last 8 months, I've put over 10k miles on my 85 300TDT, driving it back and forth for work. It would be nice to give that car a rest also and address a few little things that nag me (like the crappy paint job).
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Old 06-16-2013, 12:06 PM
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If you are just looking for a beater with a heater, and you can get the trans working for more or less your time, then throwing another 500-800 into the car for tires, shocks and a windshield might pay off if you think you can get another 10-15k out of it.

Even running, a 220K mile car with bad paint, body damage and lots of rust isn't going to command much on the used car market.

I used to play this game, fix it up a bit and drive it until it really becomes a parts car. Then I had an epiphany, and realized if I just spent a little more than very little, I could buy a car in much, much better shape, for far less than what my low buck approach could manage. I was so excited when I actually drove a car home after I bought it!

My caution was looking at the car from the standpoint of a flip. There's just no value in the car once you address some of the issues. On the other hand, it's got quite a bit of value as a parts car, likely worth more parted out and scrapped vice whole and running. Definitely worth more parted out vice whole and NOT running.

Good luck which ever way you decide.

Jim
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Old 06-16-2013, 07:34 PM
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Started to work on it today, dropping the exhaust, but of course got called away for dad day.

Dropped the under engine plastic pan, Broke all 4 bolts to the manifold (of course) But expected that. There is quite a bit more rust under there than I like. Still, as you say, as a beater car for a bit it might be good. The wheels and new tires would go over to my 87 when it's ready, so no loss there. I like the rims a lot better than the stock 87's. I'll just have to see how everything comes out from this point. I should have the trans out tomorrow since I can spend the whole day with the car. So much easier with a lift and the correct trans jack... I'll be using an ATV jack... With my 99 E320, it took me about 8 hours to drop the trans swap some parts around to another trans and have it back driving.

The engine itself is strong, no smoke, no odd noise.. really runs nice. So someone would get use out of it I'm sure. In the video link you can see and hear it running.
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Old 06-17-2013, 12:18 AM
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I'm with Jim on parting it. You'll set yourself up with a good inventory of spares/upgrades for the diesel. You can also sell the gasser engine; just get good video of t running prior to taking it out. Note that the front seat frames are narrower on the W124 V8s than they are on the I6s and diesels. GSXR has some good comparative pictures on his gallery (w124performance.com). He upgraded one of his 87 300Ds.
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  #11  
Old 06-17-2013, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pwogaman View Post
I'm with Jim on parting it. You'll set yourself up with a good inventory of spares/upgrades for the diesel. You can also sell the gasser engine; just get good video of t running prior to taking it out. Note that the front seat frames are narrower on the W124 V8s than they are on the I6s and diesels. GSXR has some good comparative pictures on his gallery (w124performance.com). He upgraded one of his 87 300Ds.
So, the seats will not fit? Both cars are 6cyl... 603 and m104
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  #12  
Old 06-29-2013, 02:58 PM
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Originally Posted by ngarover View Post
So, the seats will not fit? Both cars are 6cyl... 603 and m104

Seats will fit, but the power seat base will be different wrt connections.

Jim
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Old 06-29-2013, 05:26 PM
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The memory power seats are different between gen 1 and gen 2 124s.

On gen 1 there is a set of wires from the door to the control box under the seat. There is an individual wire for each function (i.e. front of cushion up is on a different wire than front of cushion down). The door control is just a collection of dumb switches that ground the various wires coming from the control box logic. The control box actually switches the power to the motors, and reads the encoders in the motors to remember their positions for the memory function.

On gen 2 they put the door switches on a data bus system. When you push the switch to move the front of the cushion up, the door switch sends a message over the data bus to the box under the seat to send the power to the motor that makes the front cushion motor move up.

Gen 1 and Gen 2 non memory seats are straight wired, with power fed from the fuse to the door, through the switch contacts, and to the motors with no electronics at all. IIRC this is true across the entire W124 spectrum from 86 to 95. All passenger side seats are non memory in 124s.

If you look at the 124 ETM you will see the difference in the controls between the 1st and 2nd gen.
__________________
2014 ML350 Bluetec (wife's DD)
2008 E320 Bluetec (my DD)
2008 ML320 CDI (Older son's college DD)
1998 E300DT (Younger son's college DD)
1987 300TD sold to vstech
----------
gone but living on
1983 240D (body to greazzer, engine to t walgamuth)
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Old 06-29-2013, 05:27 PM
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Index of /images/W124_seats/seat_bases

I miss read it as an E420, sorry. My bad.

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  #15  
Old 06-29-2013, 05:36 PM
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I didn't realize they changed the seat bases too.

Makes sense if you think about it, a V8 will have more torque -> bigger transmission -> bigger transmission hump -> less room for the seat base...
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2014 ML350 Bluetec (wife's DD)
2008 E320 Bluetec (my DD)
2008 ML320 CDI (Older son's college DD)
1998 E300DT (Younger son's college DD)
1987 300TD sold to vstech
----------
gone but living on
1983 240D (body to greazzer, engine to t walgamuth)
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