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  #16  
Old 02-03-2004, 06:55 PM
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A short shot isn't going to hurt the glowplugs because it has to go through the air filter AFTER you've walked back to the driver's seat (paper air filter). Which means a short shot is a diluted shot. It's the long shot, especially after a prolonged cranking cycle, that gets folks in trouble. Paste whunter's directions to your can, please.

whunter, you said you ran out of the shop when the welding torch car was started. You don't work there, do you?
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  #17  
Old 02-03-2004, 11:34 PM
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Yes; I did work for the fool for three weeks.

Hello dabenz
To answer your question:
This happened in the late seventies.
Yes; I did work for the fool for three weeks.
When things stopped making noise; I went in, dragged my box out, loaded it in my Ford Mustang, ruined the passenger and rear seat, but my life is to precious to trust around a fool like that.
The fool/shop owner was still laughing about blowing the engine; as I drove away.
Last I heard; the shop went bankrupt and the owner disappeared.

Last edited by whunter; 02-03-2004 at 11:40 PM.
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  #18  
Old 10-23-2004, 11:25 PM
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JimSmith's answers???

Quote:
Originally Posted by leathermang
I guess I am going to have to clip JimSmith's answers on this from a couple of different threads.... I would have thought that this would be farther towards ' settled ' than our Oil and AC threads .
You never did clip the answers in here.
I looked for them at least twice, with no luck.
Could we recycle this thread for new members...
I know there are some young people = teens here now, who need to aviod this level of danger and cost....

Last edited by whunter; 11-12-2004 at 02:38 PM.
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  #19  
Old 10-24-2004, 09:29 AM
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WD40 will also work and it is not as explosive. I have even used it as a primer to start the mower engine in the spring.
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  #20  
Old 10-24-2004, 09:41 AM
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I was filling up at the local diesel truck stop one afternoon and pulled into the lane next to a fella trying to start an early 90's Ford diesel pickup with a livestock trailer attached. The truck looked real, real tired. Anyway, he was pouring gasoline into the intake trying to start it. You should have heard the noise due to detonation. I asked him about it and he mumbled something about the excessive mileage on the engine. I filled up, paid and was gone before he ever got it going. I felt sorry for the cows in the trailer.
I can't say I have ever had to use any kind of starting aids in my diesel MBs but do remember using starting fluid on the farm when I was growing up.
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  #21  
Old 10-24-2004, 09:44 AM
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Unhappy winyer starting

whats the best way to be ready for winter and,get good starts with my diesel 300d turbo diesel.
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  #22  
Old 10-24-2004, 11:32 AM
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What is starting fluid. then?

I was under the impression that starting fluid WAS ether.

If it isn't, what is it? It smells like ether to me.
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  #23  
Old 10-24-2004, 11:43 AM
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What is it, answer...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Eldridge
I was under the impression that starting fluid WAS ether.

If it isn't, what is it? It smells like ether to me.
This is the html version of the file http://www.sharecorp.com/msds/8550StartingFluid.pdf.
G o o g l e automatically generates html versions of documents as we crawl the web.
To link to or bookmark this page, use the following url: http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:Gt42BI5o9a4J:www.sharecorp.com/msds/8550StartingFluid.pdf+starting+fluid&hl=en

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These search terms have been highlighted: starting fluid
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Page 1
MATERIAL SAFETY DATA SHEET Share Corporation P.O. Box 245013 Milwaukee, WI 53224
GENERAL INFORMATION NUMBER: (414) 355-4000 EMERGENCY TELEPHONE NUMBER: (800) 776-7192
REVISION DATE: April 9, 2002 CHEMTREC: (800) 424-9300 DATE OF ISSUE: May 2, 2002I - Product IdentificationStarting Fluid PRODUCT CODE: 8550

CHEMICAL FORMULATION:
Pressurized diethyl ether based engine starter.
NFPA HAZARD IDENTIFICATION SYSTEM:
HEALTH: 2
FLAMMABILITY: 4
REACTIVITY: 1
HAZARD RATING:4 - Extreme; 3 - High; 2 - Moderate; 1 - Slight; 0 - InsignificantII - Hazardous IngredientsValues reported as TWA unless noted.

EPA 40 CFR: SUBSTANCEAPPROX %OSHA PELACGIH TLV302 355 372 CAS #
Diethyl Ether 40.0-50.0 400 ppm 400 ppm Y N N 60-29-7
Heptane, related light hydrocarbons 40.0-50.0 400 ppm 400 ppm N N N 142-82-5
Mineral Oil, severely hydrotreated < 1.0 500 ppm N/E N N N 64742-53-6
Carbon Dioxide 4.00-7.00 10,000 ppm 5000 ppm N N N 124-38-9 Key: PEL:
Permissible Exposure Limit TLV: Threshold Limit Value C: Ceiling level STEL:
Short Term Exposure Limit N/A: Not Applicable N/D: Not Determined N/E: Not Established Y: Yes N: No 302: CERCLA List of Hazardous Substances and Reportable Quantities (40 CFR 302.4). 355: SARA TITLE III / List of Extremely Hazardous Substances for Emergency Planning and Notification (40 CFR 355). 372: SARA TITLE III / List of Toxic Chemicals subject to Release Reporting (Community Right to Know) (40 CFR 372). III - Physical Data BOILING POINT (°F): 94, for Diethyl ether SPECIFIC GRAVITY (WATER = 1): 0.70 VAPOR PRESSURE (mm Hg): N/D VOC CONTENT (% by weight): 85.0 – 95.0 VAPOR DENSITY (AIR = 1): 2.5 EVAPORATION RATE (WATER = 1): > 1.0SOLUBILITY IN WATER: Slight pH: N/A APPEARANCE AND ODOR: Pale yellow to clear liquid, strong ethereal odor. IV - Fire and Explosion Hazard DataFLASH POINT (°F): < -56 (TEST METHOD):T.C.C. NFPA 30B Rating: 3 FLAMMABLE LIMITS IN AIR (VOLUME %)UPPER: 48.0 LOWER: 1.8 EXTINGUISHING MEDIA: Foam, carbon dioxide, dry chemical. SPECIAL FIRE FIGHTING PROCEDURES: Avoid possible accumulations of vapors at floor level, as vapor is heavier than air. Cool fire exposed containers with water fog. Firefighters should be equipped with full protective gear including self-contained breathing apparatus. UNUSUAL FIRE AND EXPLOSION HAZARD: Contents under pressure! Exposure to temperatures above 120oF may cause bursting. Extremely flammable.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Page 2
PRODUCT NAME: Starting Fluid PRODUCT CODE: 8550 V - Reactivity DataSTABILITY: Unstable explosive peroxides may be formed and concentrate by evaporation to hazardous levels. This process is favored by prolonged storage with exposure to air and light. Product is generally stable in sealed metal containers. INCOMPATIBILITY: Strong acids and oxidizers. CONDITIONS TO AVOID: Excess heat, open flame sparks. HAZARDOUS DECOMPOSITION PRODUCTS: Thermal decomposition may produce oxides of carbon. HAZARDOUS POLYMERIZATION: Will not occur. CONDITIONS TO AVOID: None VI - Health Hazard DataROUTES OF ENTRY INHALATION: X EYE CONTACT:SKIN CONTACT: X INGESTION:INGREDIENTS THAT ARE CONSIDERED BY OSHA, NTP, IARC TO BE SUSPECTED HUMAN CARCINOGENS: None EFFECTS OF OVEREXPOSUREIF IN EYES: Irritation. IF ON SKIN: Irritation, defatting and dermatitis with prolonged or repeated exposure. IF SWALLOWED: Gastrointestinal irritation, nausea, cramps, diarrhea. May be harmful or fatal if swallowed. IF INHALED: : Dizziness, strong anesthesia, intoxication, loss of consciousness.EMERGENCY AND FIRST AID PROCEDURES IF IN EYES: Flush eyes and under eyelids with plenty of cool water for at least 15 minutes. If irritation persists, obtain medical attention. IF ON SKIN: Remove contaminated clothing and wash with soap and water. IF SWALLOWED: Contact physician or poison control center immediately. Do not induce vomiting. Proper treatment is dependent upon condition of patient and amount ingested. IF INHALED: Remove person to fresh air. If breathing has stopped, administer artificial respiration. Obtain medical attention. VII - Spill or Leak ProtectionSTEPS TO BE TAKEN IF MATERIAL IS RELEASED OR SPILLED: Ventilate area and remove all sources of ignition. CO2may be used as a precautionary blanket. Soak up material with inert absorbent material and place in a labeled closed container for disposal. WASTE DISPOSAL METHOD: Consult local environmental authorities. Dispose of cans in non-incinerated trash only. VIII - Special Protection InformationRESPIRATORY PROTECTION: Use with adequate ventilation. Do not breathe vapors or mists. If recommended Exposure Limits are exceeded, wear a NIOSH approved respirator, following manufacturer’s recommendations. VENTILATION LOCAL: Recommended MECHANICAL: Not required PROTECTIVE GLOVES: Chemical resistant. EYE PROTECTION: Safety glasses or goggles. OTHER PROTECTIVE EQUIPMENT: None. PRECAUTIONS TO BE TAKEN IN HANDLING AND STORAGE: Store in a cool, dry place away from heat or open flame. OTHER PRECAUTIONS: Keep out of reach of children. Do not puncture or incinerate container. IX - Transportation Information (ground transportation only)DOT PROPER SHIPPING NAME: Consumer Commodity DOT CLASS: ORM-D DOT ID NUMBER: NoneDOT PACKING GROUP: None The shipping information listed above applies only to non-bulk (< 119 gallons) containers of this product. This product may have more than one proper shipping name depending on packaging, product properties, & mode of shipment. If any alteration of packaging, product, or mode of transportation is further intended, different shipping names and labeling may apply. REVISION DATE: April 9, 2002 Prepared by: PMR DATE OF ISSUE: May 2, 2002 This information contained herein is based on data considered accurate. However, no warranty is expressed or implied regarding the accuracy of this data or the results to be obtained from the use thereof. Share Corporation assumes no responsibility for personal injury or property damage to the vendee, users or third parties caused by the material such vendees or users assume all risks associated with the use of this material.

Last edited by whunter; 10-24-2004 at 11:49 AM.
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  #24  
Old 11-05-2004, 10:26 PM
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I was taught to put a little gasoline on the corner of a rag and spray the starting fluid on the same corner of the rag. With the air cleaner open as someone attempts to start the engine the other person lowers the corner of the rag to the air intake to allow the engine to ingest the vapors from the corner of the rag. When the engine hits you slowly pull the rag away from the intake and keep it just close enough to keep the engine running until it will run on its own. I have seen this done so that the engine starts normally with no horrendous clacking noises like I have heard when starting fluid or gasoline is fed into the intake.

In cold weather be very careful not to get gasoline or starting fluid on exposed skin, frostbite can ensue before you know that you did any damage. You may have frostbite before you feel it. These liquids do not freeze at any atmospheric temperature and can supercool your skin on contact to far below freezing temperatures. The difference between frostbite and hypothermia is that frostbite is frozen skin. Hypothermia is cooling of your core body temperature, hypothermia is a life-threatening condition and can kill very quickly. Have a happy winter.
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Last edited by TwitchKitty; 12-15-2004 at 01:10 AM. Reason: spelling
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  #25  
Old 11-11-2004, 08:56 PM
BusyBenz
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A month or so ago I began using my block heater every night, set the timer to come on at about 4:30AM and that was fine, now with the onset of colder nights, now dropping into the low 30 degree range, the temp guage barely registers any amount of heat from the block heater.

Question: Should I suspect the block heater eliment may be mostly shot and needs to be replaced?

I do keep a can of ether in the trunk as a last resort but never really thought about how to apply it for starting. I remember many many years ago as a kid hearing it was a no no for diesels but have since seen a few to use it, but until reading this thread, I never did know the limitations using it!

Thank you Whunter for bringing back awareness. This thread should be posted annually for the many newbies unaware!

BB
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  #26  
Old 11-11-2004, 09:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BusyBenz
A month or so ago I began using my block heater every night, set the timer to come on at about 4:30AM and that was fine, now with the onset of colder nights, now dropping into the low 30 degree range, the temp guage barely registers any amount of heat from the block heater.
That's exactly what it should do. When it is down below 30 degrees, the amount of heat from the block heater is not sufficient to raise the temperature of the entire engine much above 80 degrees or so. But, that is all you need. Think about starting the engine in 80 degree weather. You don't want to spend any more electric than that.

Now, if the block heater is not working, you will know it when the temp gets down below 20 degrees. If it cranks for ten seconds and starts with a cloud of smoke and runs rough for 15 seconds or so, then the block heater is not working. If is starts like it's 80 degrees outside, it's working fine.
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  #27  
Old 11-11-2004, 09:36 PM
Benster Tom
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Lightbulb Ether or Block Heater?

As a young boy I grew up in a large logging community. My father owned the only Service Station in 20 miles of the largest town. We serviced about a 100 Log Trucks, it was common to see a can of ether or starting fluid in a Diesel Log Truck. Loggers kept alot of it in there service trucks to start there Logging Skidders. We used it to some degree, but not much. My father always told me that too much could "lock up" the engine or "blow it up", besides being "harmful" to you. We normally just used our Block Heaters in our Ford F-250's at our shop. I've seen too much Ether blown into the air intakes, and the engines start "violently". The Block Heaters are the safer way to start a "Cold" Diesel engine. If that's not helping you've got more problems, such as the "glow plugs". I've had my 300 SDL for 2 years and have never blown any starting fluid or ether into it and I sure don't plan on it.
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  #28  
Old 11-12-2004, 11:09 AM
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Charcoal starter

Years ago I saw some guys use charcoal in a pan to heat up the engine enough to start it, yes, it was a diesel, a semi with a Cat engine. The charcoal was started and let burn to white edges and then they slid it under the truck. Well, it did start, and no one got hurt! But, I was amazed.

DS
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  #29  
Old 11-12-2004, 12:55 PM
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Thumbs down This works very well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dlssmith
Years ago I saw some guys use charcoal in a pan to heat up the engine enough to start it, yes, it was a diesel, a semi with a Cat engine. The charcoal was started and let burn to white edges and then they slid it under the truck. Well, it did start, and no one got hurt! But, I was amazed.

DS
87 300 D
But you must have a BRAIN to do it in a safe manner.

There are too many DANGEROUS FOOLS in the world for me to ever suggest doing this.

I watched one try to use this procedure on a Mack, near the Mackinaw bridge, he let it warm for an hour, then got out a can of ETHER, started spraying the intake, some dripped down to the charcoal, the blast threw him ten feet, and burned his snow suit and face mask.

Some people are DANGEROUS FOOLS, soon to be DEAD FOOLS.
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  #30  
Old 11-12-2004, 02:24 PM
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Sort of a fun thread. Brings back memories of the old wrecking yard I worked in while attending college. Saw more numskulls out there starting cars with acetylene and with oxegen, propane, pouring gas into carbs, paint, paint thinner, even once trying to get a car started by grinding up an M80 and sifting it into the carb. Saw several cars they got running and poured crap into the intakes until the engine either grenaded or usually just seized.
That dump did have a few diesel tractors. The yard rats wasted them quickly enough with starter fluid, and of course all the other stuff.
Was the best day of my like whem I escaped there. Funny what a guy will do to survive some times.
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