But keep it coming! I'm looking at a couple 190Ds now. All the info i can get on 'em will help.

NOW for a new question...

Is the newer 190D more expensive to maintain than the older 240D?

I would assume the 190D has more electronics and engine computers to be concerned with. Am i wrong?

I owned a 1983 240D (4-speed) and found it to be barely adequate for power, handling was marshmallowy at best, and MPG was unimpressive at 24-28mpg.

I owned a 1985 190D (2.2L, 5-speed) and I liked it a lot. It wasn't fast but it wasn't a total dog. Handling was very good. MPG was excellent, 35-40mpg.

I drove a 1985 190D (2.2L, auto) and felt the little 4-cyl was too weak for the auto transmission... faster than a 240D, but not much... I'd never buy one.

I drove a 1986 190D (2.5L, auto) and thought was was acceptable. Way better than the 240D anyway. I haven't driven a 2.5L with a 5-speed but I bet that would be downright FUN.

The 1987 190D Turbo is extremely rare (only imported one year) and is almost as quick as the 1987 300D Turbo, which was the fastest diesel MB imported until the 1998 intercooled turbo models. The 190D-T is 11.9 seconds 0-100kmh, the 300D is 10.9 sec. Both are downright fast for diesels, and are capable of 30-32mpg or better in the proper conditions.


Anyway... I would never buy another 240D, for myself or a loved one. I would definitely buy a 190D if the price and condition were right. (and location - can't find one near me!) The 190D can be more expensive to maintain, but IMO, it's worth it. Drive both and you'll understand. Don't buy a cheap 190, get one with good history (2-3 owners) and full service records, no deferred maintenance. Buying one with no records, no history, from a used car lot or something, is a H-U-G-E gamble and could be a serious money pit.

"There's nothing more expensive that a cheap Mercedes."

__________________
Dave
Boise, ID
Check out my website photos, documents, and movies!

Anyway... I would never buy another 240D, for myself or a loved one.

I'm actually hoping to find someone with a 240D, or even a 200 or 220 who'd say the same thing. I'm at the point where I want to cut my fuel costs and wouldn't mind having a second car; a cheap four-cylinder diesel would it the bill perfectly (but it'd have to be a Mercedes, I simply cannot see myself in a Volkswagon or something like that). The "cheap" part pretty much precludes anything newer than a W123, the cheaper you get them the more risk you run of being killed on repairs. With a 240D at least I have a chance of getting an honest car in my price range. I don't care a bit about power in this case though. I do 90% highway driving, and as long as it'll break 75 on a level, it's fine with me. The Fairlane stays either way, and I could always go back to it on the days when I'm craving power and have the money to burn. Heck, I've already decided to leave for work 5-10 minutes earlier and just drive slower, as unappealing as that prospect is, just for the sake of trying to save money on gas.

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Once and future king:
'64 Ford Fairlane w/approx 238,000 - looks rough, but amazingly reliable if you know how to look after it; I will soon begin work to totally restore and modernize it.
Family vehicles that I lay some claim to:
'78 300D w/approx 350,000 original, '62 Ford F100 4x4, '90 Ford E150 w/171,000 original

Yup - for what you describe, a 240D would work well. However don't expect to get more than 30mpg, even with a tailwind, out of a 4-speed (the auto will be less). For peak fuel economy you'll want a 190D with a manual trans, those can get 40+mpg. Beyond that you have to step down to a VW diesel to achieve 45-50mpg, with the loss of safety, etc... I still own a VW Dasher diesel but I only keep it because it won't die (!), it gets 45mpg no matter how I drive it, and the sound system is extremely impressive.

I've had my 240D for about 5 months now and I'm in love with the car. It only had 143,000 miles on it when I bought the car. It has required some minor things in bringing it up to real daily driver status, but nothing involving big dollars.

It is everything I would like to have in a new car except in the HP dept. That said, it's not really a problem with speed and excelleration, unless you don't plan your moves. And planning your moves tends to make for a very safe and pleasent driving experience. I have never had a problem with keeping up with or ahead of traffic here in town or in down town St Louis MO. This car is a pleasure to drive and I am glad I bought the car.

The car handles curves better then most new FWD cars, or about any PU truck on the road and up untill the skid point in a curve the car is flat level. I will be going to 205's or 215's when these tires need to be replaced to help improve the handling.

The down side is this car was set up for 55 mph speed limit, and at 65+ is really buzzing. To really cruise the interstate's at 70+ mph you need to change the rear gears to a higher ratio to bring the RPM's back down to a normal range. This would also improve the fuel mileage both in town and highway. I may do this later.

I took a short road trip in my car awhile back to check fuel mileage and found that at 55 mph the car get's 31 mpg on level roads and the city check I've done is 28 mpg high and 25 mpg with spirited driving. That means leaving every stop light with my foot to the floor.

Cruising down a narrow two lane country road at 50 to 60 mph is the most pleasent experience in this 21 year old car, and easly is quiter then a friends new Avalon and beats his fuel mileage to boot. One of the really comfortable things about this car and something I really love is the head rest and seat. Man they are made to be comfortable on long trips. The head rest in our VW is uncomfortable to lean your head against and the wife & I both hate them in the VW.

Finally the only thing now keeping the Benz from long trips is the CC died and the 51 mpg the Jetta gets is hard to get past. Not to mention if you need the power to run in the mountians or such, the VW has it with ease over most gassers on the road. If you need speed the VW will easy run past the 120 mark with ease.

This car was bought for a beater daily driver, but is in such nice shape I am thinking about doing a complete restore on her. However I'm gotten to be kind of consertive with my money in my old age and the thought of spending $4000 to $5000 to replace the carpet, headliner, and give it an OEM paint job gives me pause. But this is a car I could easly drive another 10 years, so I am really thinking about doing it, versus paying $57,000 for new E320 CDI MB that will never last as long and be as cheap to keep up as the 240D.

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'10 Chrysler T&C Stow-N-Go White. Grandpa's ride.

'13 Chrysler 200 Touring Candy Red. Grandma's ride.

Age and cunning will always over come youth and vigor.

Hey, MT Merc, it's like you're reading my mind.
I first just wanted a cheap 4cyl diesel for fuel economy. Given the choices in the U.S. i started looking into VW Rabitts, then Jettas. (i do like the look of the 1st generation Jetta.) But most (not all, but most) VWs are manual trans. and i get tired of shifting.
So, the search for an automatic brought me to the W123 Mercedes. I also figured; OK i'll want a 4cyl 240D. Then i'd have a small engine, diesel, automatic, and something that has more of a "mature" appearance than a VW.
AHH, but then i drove an 83 240D. I, personally, have to say it wouldn't suit me. It was sssslow to get going. (A/C wasn't on; it didn't work anyway) Now, once up to speed, it seemed fine. Like it'd cruise the interstates Fine. So long as you were able to merge onto the interstate - that is - And didn't have to change lanes. I need to do both in-town and interstate driving, so i kept looking.
That brought me to the 300D. (hence my user name) The 5cyl should give me a little more power. I don't need a speed demon - just something that is confident on the interstate. I'll need to change lanes; I'll need to pass; merge with no fear; and not feel like i'm getting run over or i'm in everyone's way.

AHH, but then ... again... I love the body style of the newer 190D!! And so i'm now considering one of these. IF I CAN FIND ONE locally.

The 190D's didn't have any electric engine controls until the '85 MY when they switched over to electric idle control from vacuum controlled. The engines are largely mechanically controlled though.

I would suggest you read some of the good Doktor's posts on the matter as he owns four 190D's and is most knowledgeable about them.

Here are some links
http://db.mercedes.cx/mb/200002/24/0003.html
http://db.mercedes.cx/mb/199812/04/0017.html
http://diesel.mbzarchives.org/2000/Feb/Vol_3_Num_98/ (19th post down "Questions: new to list")

Good luck in your search!

Chris

Chris James,
Thank you for your kind assistance. I will check those links out.

My 240d has what my friends and I call dial a squeel. You just turn the wheel for how much tire squeel you want. What's amazing is that there's very little steering issues as far as over/under steer goes. If I take a turn to fast is doesn't plow by plow I mean like turning on ice where you turn the wheel but the car goes straight, it's never done that on me, and it sure doesn't bite, it's just like "ok nate, little fast, I'm just gonna make noise and push out a little" It's beautiful. I love the 240d, my kids are going to drive this car, and I'm 21. As soon as I get a real job I'm looking for a 190d with a 5-speed, I've seen a few, but never had the funds for em. Then a diesel mog, then a cummins to tow it, ohh I can't wait!
-Nate

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'82 240D, 4-speed, 617 turbo engine

i own a 240td and a 190d 2.5 and the 190 is alot quiter, smoother and faster and so far hasnt complained in the cold weather like the 240 mihgt try to. but i love the size of the 240td and i did love the way it floated around the roads like a big boat!!! the 190 is also much more economical. i believe the acceleration figure are something like 0-60 = 28secs in the 240 and 15 secs in the 190,, roughly.
both are great cars though

I drive and maintain my 240D as a "hobby", and as a "passion". I can't imagine ever selling it (unless the wife puts her foot down with garage space and too many diesels...)

I drive my VW TDI for economy and performance. I'm fortunate to own a nice 240D and a nice TDI.

If you want an economical diesel AND performance, I'd go for the VW TDI over the 190D.

- Patrick

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1982 240D. 198k, Marine Blue/Blue, 4 Speed, Crank Windows, No Sunroof, No Rust, No Oil Leaks
2001 TDI. 197k, Lagoon Blue/Black, 5 speed, Chip, G60/VR6

As much as I hate to say it, the 240D isnt that great a car compared to what is out there.
If you compare cars by size/hp and fuel economy, the 240D is an overall loser...
yes, if you go by the numbers, the 240D sucks. I dont go buy numbers so I LOVE my 240D. If you dont love driving the thing (a W123) forget about it. 240D's are relatively easy to find with a stick though...
The 190D's smaller size has a LOT going for it. I assume that a VW TDI is out of your price range (otherwise, I'd get one too)
I would reconsider a vw diesel though.
Bads-
smaller
Front wheel drive
"refinement"
no auto trans

Plus
-35mpg no matter how hard you stomp it
-easier to park

The internet support for both vehicles is about the same. Lots of local VW boards along with vwvortex.com (good stuff in there, but you need to find it)

I'd seriously consider trading my 240D for a 80's vw diesel (of equal value). (if you dont miss the interior room). Parts cost and aftermarket/junkyard support are about equal.

Maybe I just want to swap an OM617 into my 240D, maybe then I'll be happy =)

To each his own
-John

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2009 Kia Sedona
2009 Honda Odyssey EX-L
12006 Jetta Pumpe Duse
(insert Mercedes here)

Husband, Father, sometimes friend =)

What makes the 87 300d faster than the 86?

There was no 1986 300D imported to the USA, only 1987 models. (There was a 1986 300SDL, though.)

__________________
Dave
Boise, ID
Check out my website photos, documents, and movies!

Wow, you know, I never ever noticed that! Either I've been looking too much or haven't been looking close enough I just knew that 1985 and earlier were the W123 and 617, and anything newer than that up to 1987 has the different body style and and head to look out for, and I still can't wake up so my brain must be clogged because I can't think of the body style and engine numbers... I really need some to wake up and not this snow I woke up to this morning.