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  #1  
Old 07-15-2004, 04:07 PM
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Vacuum Line Size OD & ID - Please

I have several places I need to replace the connectors on my '87 300 TD's vacuum lines. Does anyone know the size of the tubing with and without colored stripes?
Thanks for your time.
Steve

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'87 300TD - 132K - Soon 4-Sale
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Old 07-15-2004, 04:45 PM
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From my archives - I posted this a couple years ago

Here's a list of some of the more useful part numbers for rebuilding the vacuum system on an OM60x, and/or most 85-up MB's. (I think the older cars used more solid colors, I didn't experiment with ordering those.) I found on the EPC that the same part number can have a different description depending on what chassis you look up. Some chassis have more info than others. For a list, go to the "Intake & Exhaust Manifold" group in the engine section, then look at the general parts diagram. Try this with several chassis (123, 124, 210 for example). I also found out that the pictures don't always match up, and some may appear identical but can have widely differing sizes - which is often NOT mentioned in the EPC! So I've been ordering select items (1 each) to figure out what's what.

Unfortunately some parts have rolled to generic replacements, so we can never return the car to "original" condition. For instance, gray pipe was replaced with black, the brown/blue (for I/P shutoff circuit) has also been superceded to generic stuff, as well as the black w/white stripe to the transmission. The hassle with this is that the colors actually MEAN something, and when you use plain items instead it can be confusing. Black is normally a vent line to the interior, and MB has seen fit to supercede some p/n's to black. OK, enough rambling, here's the currently available p/n's that I've confirmed:

Vacuum line ("plastic" Tecalan pipe, 4mm OD, 1mm ID)
=====================================================
000-158-14-35 - Transparent (sort of white)
000-158-35-35 - Red?
000-158-88-35 - Transparent with brown stripe
000-158-89-35 - Transparent with red stripe
000-158-90-35 - Transparent with yellow stripe
000-158-91-35 - Transparent with blue stripe
000-158-92-35 - Transparent with gray stripe
000-158-93-35 - Transparent with black stripe
000-158-94-35 - Transparent with green stripe
000-158-96-35 - Transparent with violet & brown stripe
000-158-97-35 - Transparent with violet & red stripe
000-158-98-35 - Transparent with violet & yellow stripe
000-158-99-35 - Transparent with violet & blue stripe
000-997-39-52 - Brown
001-997-81-52 - Black
116-276-06-30 - Black with white lettering
123-276-16-30 - Black with red stripe


Rubber fittings & hose (3.5mm ID)
==========================
117-078-02-81 - 90-degree "L" shaped fitting
117-078-05-81 - 45-degree "V" shaped fitting
117-997-09-82 - Rubber hose (order by the meter)


Black "loom" (looks like heat shrink tube)
===========================================
040621-008200 - 8mm ID
040621-011200 - 11mm ID (most useful on my car)
040621-012200 - 12mm ID
040621-014200 - 14mm ID
(notice the pattern here? Larger & smaller are available too...)


Branch fittings (splitters)
===========================================
601-078-02-45 - "Y" shaped 2-port branch fitting (1 in, 2 out)
601-078-04-45 - "Y" shaped 3-port branch fitting (1 in, 3 out)
601-078-05-45 - "Y" shaped 4-port branch fitting (1 in, 4 out)
601-078-06-45 - "F" shaped 2-port branch fitting (1 in, 2 out)


The boost pressure line on the OM617's is larger than the vacuum stuff. The OM60x engine boost line is the same as the vacuum stuff (4mm OD). Anyway:

617-070-07-81 - Line from intake to s/o valve
617-070-06-81 - Line from s/o valve to ALDA

They're relatively cheap, and I think they include the metal fitting on the end.


Most of the pipe & loom is $3-$5 per meter (had been much cheaper, but MB is trying to make a bundle on parts now. ) If you haven't replaced them in your car, it's a good idea to just do it. Total cost is probably less than $40. It's amazing how much of that stuff snaps like twigs when you start removing it!


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1997 E420 - 155kmi (Bugeyes)
1994 E420 - 145kmi (Blondie)
1993 500E - 193kmi (Lollipop)
1992 400E - 189kmi (Stinky Dirty)
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Last edited by gsxr; 02-25-2010 at 06:26 PM.
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Old 07-15-2004, 04:57 PM
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gsxr
Thank you. That is exactly what I needed/wanted. Sorry I missed it in my search. Typically I do exhaustive and thorough searches. Blew it this time.

I am trying to fix some problems and prevent some. Not getting turbo boost, I bypassed the switchover valve with direct vacuum to the ALDA line. Turbo works. Scratching my head since the switchover does not appear to have any problems (air flows one way and not the other and the tested resistance is the same as the Y29) I haven't printed the electrical schematic from by CDs yet so I don't know where the electrical wires come and go from. I am thinking there is likely a switch related to air pressure somewhere that might me not doing what it is intended for.

Thanks again.
Seems good to drive my favorite again.
Steve
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'87 300TD - 132K - Soon 4-Sale
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'77 VW Type II - 77K - Restored
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  #4  
Old 07-15-2004, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by BrierS
gsxr
Thank you. That is exactly what I needed/wanted. Sorry I missed it in my search. Typically I do exhaustive and thorough searches. Blew it this time.
No, you didn't, it's probably not in the MBShop archives - it is posted on MBZ.org though:

http://engine.articles.mbz.org/diesel/hoses/





Quote:

I am trying to fix some problems and prevent some. Not getting turbo boost, I bypassed the switchover valve with direct vacuum to the ALDA line. Turbo works. Scratching my head since the switchover does not appear to have any problems (air flows one way and not the other and the tested resistance is the same as the Y29) I haven't printed the electrical schematic from by CDs yet so I don't know where the electrical wires come and go from. I am thinking there is likely a switch related to air pressure somewhere that might me not doing what it is intended for.
There is nothing electrical that will affect power, if you bypassed the s/o valve and ran a hose (carrying pressure, not vacuum, btw) between the intake manifold and the ALDA. Make sure the manifold fitting is clean! Next step is to verify you have boost pressure, you'll need a gauge, enough hose to enter the passenger compartment, then go for a drive while watching the gauge. (You can't rev the engine in park and get boost - have to drive it, floor it, put load on the engine...)

If you don't get any boost, it's possible the turbo wastegate is stuck open, OR if you have the Garrett turbo, that the wastegate hose is cracked or leaking. Either way you'd get zero boost pressure.

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Old 07-15-2004, 05:05 PM
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BTW - I'd disconnect and/or remove the EGR and ARV emission junk, as shown below:






Last edited by gsxr; 02-25-2010 at 06:21 PM.
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  #6  
Old 07-15-2004, 05:15 PM
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gsxr
Thanks again.
Saw the off-road vacuum line pics during my initial search and have already started the process by plugging and disconnecting. In the second photo, what is the line with a blue vacuum cap? I didn't notice it in the third photo.

Back to my turbo issue . . . when the vacuum source (bypassed the Y30) was good to the ALDA my power increased. Would this not indicate the turbo is functioning? It's been a long day for me so possibly I'm just in brain drain mode (my wife marvels at those moments).
Steve
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'87 300TD - 132K - Soon 4-Sale
'84 300D Turbo - 122K - Driving
'77 VW Type II - 77K - Restored
'08 250EX Ninja
English Bulldog (Brier) - My best friend. Passed away 12/02/04 while in my arms.
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Old 07-15-2004, 05:17 PM
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gsxr
I also noticed you went naked of clamps when you cleaned up using the "F" connector. ???? You must be using the right line/hose/connector sizes.
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Steve
'87 300TD - 132K - Soon 4-Sale
'84 300D Turbo - 122K - Driving
'77 VW Type II - 77K - Restored
'08 250EX Ninja
English Bulldog (Brier) - My best friend. Passed away 12/02/04 while in my arms.
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Old 07-15-2004, 05:21 PM
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Blue cap is on the larger black line, which is just a vent (fresh air source) into the passenger compartment. It connects near the power brake booster, so I capped it off there and yanked the black pipe out of the engine compartment - one less item to clutter things up!

Yes - if you bypass the s/o valve and run pressure directly to the ALDA, and power increases, your turbo is probably doing at least *something*. If possible, please do the following & post the results:

On a flat road, time the car from 0-60mph with a stopwatch. Also post the elevation you live at, along with the time. A good time near sea level is 10-11 seconds for the sedan, and 11-12 seconds for the wagon. If you're in the teens or slower, something is definitely not right...
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1997 E420 - 155kmi (Bugeyes)
1994 E420 - 145kmi (Blondie)
1993 500E - 193kmi (Lollipop)
1992 400E - 189kmi (Stinky Dirty)
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Old 07-15-2004, 05:37 PM
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gsxr
Will do (land speed test). If I make a run with the Y30 still by-passed and then another hooked correctly will the by-passed test put the ALDA at risk? I seem to recall reading something about using the by-pass as ONLY a test procedure.
Steve
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'87 300TD - 132K - Soon 4-Sale
'84 300D Turbo - 122K - Driving
'77 VW Type II - 77K - Restored
'08 250EX Ninja
English Bulldog (Brier) - My best friend. Passed away 12/02/04 while in my arms.
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Old 07-15-2004, 05:47 PM
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No risk at all... only risk would be if the engine was making too much power, as Y30 is part of the overboost safety circuit. Or too much boost, anyway. It's generally not a great idea to leave it bypassed long-term, in case the turbo wastegate fails closed and you get excessive boost. Even then, on an old injection pump, the possibility of injecting enough fuel to cause damage is pretty remote!

If you test both ways, with the ALDA disconected the times should be 3-5 seconds slower (from 10-12, up to 14-16). I bet you're a good candidate for an ALDA adjustment too...
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Old 07-15-2004, 06:19 PM
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gsxr said: "re: 601-078-06-45 - "F" shaped 2-port branch fitting - (great to replace the 4-port fitting after you yank the emissions stuff off a 124 diesel!)"

Yes but notice that the F-shaped fitting has shorter ends than the 4-way fitting, so to keep the fitting in the same position (ie. not going to the opposite side of the rad hose where it is a little cramped) I replaced the two hard lines with longer runs. Those being the main vac to the rest of the car seem important to keep in good shape (how do I know? just try driving with them loose and you'll get whiplash from the transmission when it shifts!)

BTW I am using silicone hose instead of the rubber that MB sells for splices (117-997-09-82) as it will outlast rubber by decades, it doesn't get loose when its old. Now if the fittings were just available in (blue) silicone....

BTW the local stealership soaked me $14 for that F-shaped fitting, even with the 10% discount they gave me! It does look better than the kluge I started to use made of a Y-shaped rubber fitting
DDH
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Old 07-15-2004, 06:22 PM
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GSXR,

Every time you post a photo of your engine I start to drool. Is that bad? How do you keep (did you get) it so clean?
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Old 07-15-2004, 06:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Alan Hamm
GSXR, Every time you post a photo of your engine I start to drool. Is that bad? How do you keep (did you get) it so clean?
LOL... uh, thanks! To get it that clean, you have to start with a southern or western vehicle with zero rust. Then replace the cylinder head so everything has to come out, then go nuts with a rag and WD-40... and replace ugly parts with new, like the platic coolant tank! (It's starting to turn that nice yellow color already, 2.5 years & 20kmi later...)



Here's another teaser from back then... it's not as clean now, I actually drive it, so it's kinda dusty...


Last edited by gsxr; 02-25-2010 at 06:22 PM.
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  #14  
Old 07-15-2004, 06:55 PM
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I agree, it is certainly cleaner than mine though mine isn't too bad.

Okay. Charlestown, NH is 115' in elevation. Ran two tests. 1st one was with the switch by-passed and it was 13.86 seconds. Problem with that run though. Noticed acceleration was good and then dropped off at about 45 MPH. A vacuum hose had popped out from my by-pass. Put everything back the way they are supposed to be and ran 0-60 in 12.71 seconds. I will run a couple more tomorrow so that I can get an average (besides it is fun). Let me know what you think.

I know I have some existing vacuum leaks to contend with. Since I have installed the new vac pump, I am going to start replacing vacuum lines and connectors.

Steve
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'87 300TD - 132K - Soon 4-Sale
'84 300D Turbo - 122K - Driving
'77 VW Type II - 77K - Restored
'08 250EX Ninja
English Bulldog (Brier) - My best friend. Passed away 12/02/04 while in my arms.
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Old 07-15-2004, 07:11 PM
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Steve,

12.7 seconds in a station wagon is pretty darn good. I'd consider tweaking the ALDA, especially if the car doesn't leap off the line, and/or you feel a "kick" around 2000-2500rpm as the turbo spools up. With the ALDA adjusted correctly, there should be smooth power off idle pretty much to redline (or the ~4800rpm shift points). That may help pick up another half second or more.

Regardless, I think your car is OK on power...!


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