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  #211  
Old 06-14-2017, 01:49 AM
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Location: Olathe, CO
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Cash in hand... Just saying. :-)
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1983 300TD, 215K

Pics here... http://s86.photobucket.com/user/diutley/library/
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  #212  
Old 06-15-2017, 11:08 AM
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Cash in hand and ready to purchase as well.

Please keep us posted..

Thanks.
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  #213  
Old 07-07-2017, 11:39 PM
Proud Meep owner
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Redding California
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I also would like to purchase one of these upgraded overflow valves when they become available again. Please keep me up to date. Thank you.
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  #214  
Old 07-19-2017, 10:07 AM
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Location: Amarillo, TX
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Count me in for purchase of upgraded overflow valve. I can return you an empty housing if needed (you know the story).
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  #215  
Old 02-16-2018, 09:18 AM
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In stock very soon !

Thanks everyone for your patience.

https://dieselfuelinjector.guru/shop?olsPage=products
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  #216  
Old 04-30-2018, 01:23 PM
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When you see no change after the spring change. If there also is no overflow from the relief valve. Or none existing before the spring change even.

It is probable there is not enough fuel pressure being applied to the base of the injection pump to start with. Possibilities are tired lift pump, Dirty tank filter or even the fuel filters up front.

Constant overflow to me is an indication that the pressure regulation change or the original configuration is regulating the pressure. Plus the applied pressure does exceed what is needed for the relief valve to function properly.

If you use a fluid dampened gauge. Put a close off valve in the line to it. Those strong pulses the injection pump elements generate can and probably will destroy any typical gauge. So you want to sample the pressure. Not monitor it over a period of time constantly. The harbor freight 0-60 pound cheap liquid filled gauge is more than adequate. It was around ten dollars for a very long time and may still be in America.

One thing not discussed at all so far is a pressure reading at speed. Under loaded conditions. To me this is also important. So I guess the best ideal is a long hose to get the gauge back into viewing range at speed.

Too many people think they do not have enough boost. Or just do not think it is safe to pass. When the reality is the engine is fuel starved for all practical purposes. Really degrading the potential performance.

My suspicion is when the operational pressure drops too low at speed. The engine is out of good power balance as well. Simply because a decent pressure makes the engine a little quieter at speed. This has been reported far too many times to ignore.

I also feel like a broken record. Until I can or someone else can come up with an alternative reasonable answer. Low fuel supply pressure on the 616 may be the cause of the number one rod bearing failure.

In fact if I did buy another 616 engine and it had very low fuel pressure. The engine is noisy enough to cover a wearing rod bearing. I would plasti gauge that bearing. Easy enough to change bearing shells on the first cylinder rod. Before the crankshaft gets scored up.

I suspected that damage may be created over a very long time of running low fuel pressure. Readers probably are aware that the first rod bearing is usually the one to fail. Especially on the 616 engines. Less so on the 617 engines. Yet still happens more than not. To me it trumps having to change an engine out down the road.

Also the 616 lift pump can be upgraded to a higher output pressure just by changing the lift pumps regulation spring from a 617 turbo engine. Leaving the lift pump as original makes the fuel filters restricting effect greater as it ages. Plus it will help to keep that higher pressure relief valve functioning better.

In manufacturing the 616 engines lift pump. It was designed to have a lower original output pressure. Same as the naturally aspired 5 cylinder I think.

Before I entered the picture it was assumed the first rod bearing failed because it was the last bearing on the crankshaft to see oil pressure.

At the time I was asked why they failed. After a lot of thought. I felt the old answer just did not hold water. Both engines have about the same oil pressure. The number one bearing on the 5 cylinder is even farther away.

Plus the loading of the cylinder is greater on the turbo five cylinders. So technically in my mind it should fail more than the four cylinder 616 engines experience.

Make no misteak though at the same time if a rod bearing fails even on the 617. Chances are very high it will still be the number one or two rod bearing on them.

When most of us acquired these cars they were old already. So I also considered the possibility of sludge build up in the oil passages from the lack of oil changes. Then again if this were the case. The oil has to travel farther to get to the number one rod bearing on the 5 cylinder. Leaving me with the only other difference being there are more power strokes per revolution on the 5 cylinder than the 4 cylinder . At the same time the five cylinder turbo power strokes are much stronger.

To remove sludge an old engine. I thought that a quart of miracle mystery oil in the base. Say every second oil change for awhile. Would slowly reduce it. It seems a bad ideal to get it all loose faster. That can block oil passages you are trying to clean. With resulting destructive results. Although people switching over to synthetic oils have not reported the problem either. It does have a cleaning action as well.

There also where some other considerations. Operational RPMs are higher on the 616 on the highway for example. So my only certain conclusion was it is better to have good operational fuel pressure than not. With one perhaps still remote possibility. That otherwise it might also shorten the engines life substantially by not having it.

I designed a test to perhaps prove the concept. It is an involved test and could cause me pain in also indicating something else to investigate. So I just made sure I had good operational fuel pressure on my cars.

So I leave this post with if a spring is changed and there is no difference. Either you had high operational pressure before. Far more likely though is you have another problem present in the same system as well.

This area in general is about the cheapest area to restore. Yet there has been massive resistance to even checking it out properly. In the majority of cases it is also great preventative maintenance to reduce episodes of quitting on the road.

Things that are becoming sub standard in the fuel supply system generate gradually lower and lower than desired fuel pressure readings first. Usually the fuel supply system just does not suddenly pack it in from being a good normal one on these cars

Plus as a fuel filter builds resistance to flow. The pressure differential across it increases because of the lack of changing it. This could force more dirt through it than intended by the filter designers. I could write a manual perhaps on what preventative maintenance should be done. To stop all too many cases of premature engine failures.

I am very lucky in that all four of my 616 and 617 engines are in very good condition overall. One original engine in a car with a perhaps honest 165 thousand miles and another being a total drop in by a Mercedes dealer not long before I aquired it. Years ago now. Both those cars indicate to me just what they were like when pretty new performance wise.
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  #217  
Old 05-31-2018, 07:01 PM
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SPRINGS JUST ARRIVED TODAY. I will get all back orders out in the mail tomorrow. Thanks everyone for your extensive patience
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  #218  
Old 06-04-2018, 10:03 AM
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Perhaps this is a stupid question, but searching here and via google to see other forums....

What is the process to remove the lift pump for refurbishment?

Ive pulled the spring before with everything on the car. Measured fine. But it seems like this would be a smart mod to do in general, and if doing this, might as well update these nearly 40year old pumps at the same time.

I can't seem to find a good pictorial or write up. I'm just not sure if it's particularly complex or if there are any issues to watch out for.

I did find a good OM606 how to on here but that's not a 616/617.

Thanks!
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Own:
1981 240D (73K)
1982 300CD (162k)
1991 350SD (113k)
1998 Chevrolet S-10 ZR2 (62K)
2011 BMW 135i cv (14k)
2014 Honda Odyssey (6k)
2015 Honda Accord Hybrid (5k)
Had:
2008 VW Rabbit (70k)
2004 SAAB 9-3 (83k)
1991 BMW 318i (183K)
1983 300D (228K) (wrecked by at-fault uninsured driver)
1985 300D (233K) (now in FL)
1994 Acura Integra (188k) (Rusted out)
1992 Toyota 4Runner (72k) (Rusted out)
1990 Daihatsu Rocky (??) (No parts)
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  #219  
Old 06-04-2018, 05:42 PM
Shern's Avatar
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Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 501
Quote:
Originally Posted by JHZR2 View Post
Perhaps this is a stupid question, but searching here and via google to see other forums....

What is the process to remove the lift pump for refurbishment?

Ive pulled the spring before with everything on the car. Measured fine. But it seems like this would be a smart mod to do in general, and if doing this, might as well update these nearly 40year old pumps at the same time.

I can't seem to find a good pictorial or write up. I'm just not sure if it's particularly complex or if there are any issues to watch out for.

I did find a good OM606 how to on here but that's not a 616/617.

Thanks!
It's pretty easy. Three nuts and a paper gasket keep the pump flush with the Injector pump. First remove the fuel filter line. Next remove the primer pump, you should then be able to remove the plastic line compression fitting to the secondary filter with a flare nut wrench. Loosen those three nuts and back the pump off the studs.

Once you remove the pump, you want to remove the flare fit/mount, the spring and valve is underneath. On the bottom of the lift pump under the port you connect to the primary fuel filter, is another nut that gives you access to another spring and valve. On the back of the pump, there's a roller/cam lobe/tappet (forgive me) that interfaces with the IP that you can disassemble and remove. Once you remove the plunger, deep in the bore is a tiny o-ring you can replace (keeps oil and fuel from mixing). The giant hex head in the front of the pump contains the main pressure spring. Apparently, if your spring is not broken (99% likely to be fine) it's a good idea not to mess with removing that cap to replace the crush washer -unless of course it's leaking which is equally unlikely. Getting all this stuff off the pump when it's not mounted is a b_stard. Lots of soft wood in a vice so you can crank down on the nuts with a breaker bar and deep sockets. Just be careful when you're mounting the pump in the vice that you don't clamp down on that flange (the one that mounts to the IP) as apparently it's a little fragile.

It's an easy job, just a little annoying because some of those valves/nuts/attachments are on pretty tight. I had a nearly impossible time removing one of them -nothing fit but a crescent wrench which stripped painfully with every turn. Later had help with an angle grinder removing a small bit of metal to fit a socket, then no problem.
When you reinstall the pump, use Gasgacinch or permatex high tack sealant on the studs and the gasket -mine leaked with the new gasket alone.
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  #220  
Old 06-04-2018, 06:56 PM
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Location: New Jersey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shern View Post
It's pretty easy. Three nuts and a paper gasket keep the pump flush with the Injector pump. First remove the fuel filter line. Next remove the primer pump, you should then be able to remove the plastic line compression fitting to the secondary filter with a flare nut wrench. Loosen those three nuts and back the pump off the studs.

Once you remove the pump, you want to remove the flare fit/mount, the spring and valve is underneath. On the bottom of the lift pump under the port you connect to the primary fuel filter, is another nut that gives you access to another spring and valve. On the back of the pump, there's a roller/cam lobe/tappet (forgive me) that interfaces with the IP that you can disassemble and remove. Once you remove the plunger, deep in the bore is a tiny o-ring you can replace (keeps oil and fuel from mixing). The giant hex head in the front of the pump contains the main pressure spring. Apparently, if your spring is not broken (99% likely to be fine) it's a good idea not to mess with removing that cap to replace the crush washer -unless of course it's leaking which is equally unlikely. Getting all this stuff off the pump when it's not mounted is a b_stard. Lots of soft wood in a vice so you can crank down on the nuts with a breaker bar and deep sockets. Just be careful when you're mounting the pump in the vice that you don't clamp down on that flange (the one that mounts to the IP) as apparently it's a little fragile.

It's an easy job, just a little annoying because some of those valves/nuts/attachments are on pretty tight. I had a nearly impossible time removing one of them -nothing fit but a crescent wrench which stripped painfully with every turn. Later had help with an angle grinder removing a small bit of metal to fit a socket, then no problem.
When you reinstall the pump, use Gasgacinch or permatex high tack sealant on the studs and the gasket -mine leaked with the new gasket alone.
Thank you very much, this is a wonderful write-up!
__________________
Own:
1981 240D (73K)
1982 300CD (162k)
1991 350SD (113k)
1998 Chevrolet S-10 ZR2 (62K)
2011 BMW 135i cv (14k)
2014 Honda Odyssey (6k)
2015 Honda Accord Hybrid (5k)
Had:
2008 VW Rabbit (70k)
2004 SAAB 9-3 (83k)
1991 BMW 318i (183K)
1983 300D (228K) (wrecked by at-fault uninsured driver)
1985 300D (233K) (now in FL)
1994 Acura Integra (188k) (Rusted out)
1992 Toyota 4Runner (72k) (Rusted out)
1990 Daihatsu Rocky (??) (No parts)
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  #221  
Old 11-05-2018, 09:23 PM
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Posts: 7,332
http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/attachments/diesel-performance-tuning/125547d1415060926-performance-overflow-valve-valve-2.jpg

Can someone measure the ball bearing and give me a dimensions?




I must have lost it and am wondering if I use a ball bearing from something else that is 5.9 mm/.23 inches
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  #222  
Old 11-06-2018, 01:05 AM
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Its either 6.00 or 6.35mm and probably along the lines of G10 or better.
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  #223  
Old 11-06-2018, 09:40 AM
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It's 6.00 mm
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  #224  
Old 11-06-2018, 10:17 AM
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Location: South Carolina
Posts: 5,114
Out of my current batch, I have aroud 50 left for the PMs I got. You can order here or at www.dieselfuelinjector.guru
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  #225  
Old 11-06-2018, 07:32 PM
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Posts: 7,332
Different check valve I pulled from a junkyard... not able to be changed to a better spring. Glad I didn't have this one...
Quote:
Originally Posted by greazzer View Post
It's 6.00 mm
Well I'm going to stay with my 5.9 mm instead of cutting my junkyard unit to get the ball bearing.
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Performance Overflow Valve-img_6288.jpg   Performance Overflow Valve-img_6289.jpg  
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