How professional mechanics figure their labor time - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

aklim · #1 04-17-2005, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Carlton

However, to bring you back on topic, we were discussing repairs by a mechanic. If one mechanic agrees to change a water pump for 8 hours labor and another agrees to change the pump for 5 hours labor, you are still getting the same product in the end, in theory. The man who charges 8 hours labor may get the job done in 5 hours and pocket the remainder. The man who gets the job done in 5 hours is charging exactly the time that it took.

You would be foolish to simply dismiss the lower price to change the water pump, simply because the price is 60% of book, IMHO.

OK. I'll ask this: WHY? Why would you go to 60% of what every other shop does? I know I might go to 95%, lets say but I definately will not go to 60%. So, I am having a hard time trying to fathom out why anyone else would. Now, if it is a startup shop trying to draw in customers, I understand. You would be right that it is a better price IF they are both doing quality work. However, I still am suspicious as to why anyone would do it. When I didn't ahve the facities to do it, I farmed out an intake manifold job. The guy basically lowballed everyone else by 40%. Didn't make it home and the gasket blew out because it was not sealed right. Too much silicone and not enough torque on the bolts. This experience and many more in many different realms make me distrustful of too good a deal.

My problem is that I have had too many deals that looked good but turned out bad. Often, I found my butt sore and I didn't even get a reach around and there is a brown stain on the matteress when I accept these good deals. That is why I am suspicious. I tend to be cynical of human beings which is why I would rather stick with what the average rate is. Yes, sometimes I will lose out but so far, I have been ahead in the long run.

Brian Carlton · #2 04-17-2005, 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

OK. I'll ask this: WHY? Why would you go to 60% of what every other shop does? I know I might go to 95%, lets say but I definately will not go to 60%. So, I am having a hard time trying to fathom out why anyone else would. Now, if it is a startup shop trying to draw in customers, I understand. You would be right that it is a better price IF they are both doing quality work. However, I still am suspicious as to why anyone would do it. When I didn't ahve the facities to do it, I farmed out an intake manifold job. The guy basically lowballed everyone else by 40%. Didn't make it home and the gasket blew out because it was not sealed right. Too much silicone and not enough torque on the bolts. This experience and many more in many different realms make me distrustful of too good a deal.

I believe that we are talking about two different types of people.

1) An individual with limited skills, limited tools and limited knowledge who works out of his garage. I would put myself in this category. So, if I want to do a job for someone, I might give them a price that would give me a day's pay. Say I charge $200.00 for the day. I'm OK with this. Now the going rate is 6 hours labor by the book. I might not get it done in 8 hours, but, I'll bust my ass to get it finished in one day. I'm happy with the $200.00. The quality of the work may be acceptable. On the other hand, it might not be acceptable because I'm not a professional in the true sense of the word.

These are the people you wish to avoid.

2) An individual who has a high degree of skill and works as a professional mechanic. Johnhef falls into this category. Now, if he owns a shop and he has developed procedures and/or practices to cut the book time from 10 hours down to 5 hours, he makes a decision to charge you a price depending on his personal feelings on the matter. He doesn't go out and take a poll of competing shops to determine if they are all charging 10 hours. He can easily do the job in five hours, so, he decides to charge you 7 hours for the job. The quality of the work is identical to that for which you would have recieved if you went to a dealer or another indy and they charged you the full 10 hours. Why did he charge you only 7 hours? Well, he is of the opinion that this amount of money is a fair price. Now, we know that you don't trust this individual because you have lumped him in with the mechanic up in the first paragraph.

Your problem is that you are unable to discern the difference between the mechanic in the first paragraph and the mechanic in the second paragraph, so, you go out and pay retail rates and are happy about it so that you don't get screwed.

In reality, whether you get screwed or not has little to do with the price charged. It has everything to do with the skills and knowledege of the technician. Many, many people pay book rates at the dealer and get very shoddy work. A high price is no guarantee of proper performance.

aklim · #3 04-17-2005, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Carlton

I believe that we are talking about two different types of people.

1) An individual with limited skills, limited tools and limited knowledge who works out of his garage. I would put myself in this category. So, if I want to do a job for someone, I might give them a price that would give me a day's pay. Say I charge $200.00 for the day. I'm OK with this. Now the going rate is 6 hours labor by the book. I might not get it done in 8 hours, but, I'll bust my ass to get it finished in one day. I'm happy with the $200.00. The quality of the work may be acceptable. On the other hand, it might not be acceptable because I'm not a professional in the true sense of the word.

These are the people you wish to avoid.

2) An individual who has a high degree of skill and works as a professional mechanic. Johnhef falls into this category. Now, if he owns a shop and he has developed procedures and/or practices to cut the book time from 10 hours down to 5 hours, he makes a decision to charge you a price depending on his personal feelings on the matter. He doesn't go out and take a poll of competing shops to determine if they are all charging 10 hours. He can easily do the job in five hours, so, he decides to charge you 7 hours for the job. The quality of the work is identical to that for which you would have recieved if you went to a dealer or another indy and they charged you the full 10 hours. Why did he charge you only 7 hours? Well, he is of the opinion that this amount of money is a fair price. Now, we know that you don't trust this individual because you have lumped him in with the mechanic up in the first paragraph.

Your problem is that you are unable to discern the difference between the mechanic in the first paragraph and the mechanic in the second paragraph, so, you go out and pay retail rates and are happy about it so that you don't get screwed.

In reality, whether you get screwed or not has little to do with the price charged. It has everything to do with the skills and knowledege of the technician. Many, many people pay book rates at the dealer and get very shoddy work. A high price is no guarantee of proper performance.

You're right. Just because you pay more doesn't mean you will get better work. Yes, if I could pick them apart, I would go for the one with better track records. However, everyone always claims their work is top quality and they are the greatest. What I am saying is that if 10 shops all charge $10 and one particular one charges $5, I want to know why. This is if I don't know any of them.

Brian Carlton · #4 04-18-2005, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

However, everyone always claims their work is top quality and they are the greatest. What I am saying is that if 10 shops all charge $10 and one particular one charges $5, I want to know why.

Agreed.

Johnhef · #5 04-18-2005, 12:11 AM

awww. group hug time.

Brian Carlton · #6 04-18-2005, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnhef

awww. group hug time.

I'm not hugging him, no matter what.

tangofox007 · #7 04-18-2005, 12:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Carlton

I'm not hugging him, no matter what.

If you do, charge him book rate plus half an hour!!!! Otherwise, he won't trust that you really meant it.

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