I've only had the 300D since turkeyday, today was the first time I had ocasion to pull the wheels off. I had a slight feel of warped rotors, not bad at all, but not smooth either. I found out why, the happy go lucky tire installers who put the new tires on the front shortly before I got it seem to have done all the could to tighten the living heck out of the lug bolts..

After breaking them loose, and tighting them a sane amount, most of that shimmy is gone.


Side question, that short little tire iron in the spare compartment, is it that short to keep you from overtorquing the lugs or...?

I normaly use a torque wrench but I don't have it handy right now..

Anyway, beware the idiots, those torque sensitive extensions don't cut it either as far as I'm concerned.

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One more Radar Lover gone...
1982 VW Caddy diesel 406K 1.9L AAZ
1994 E320 195K

Most tire shops that have their act together now use a torque wrench for final tightening. Some still do though just use a pre-set impact wrench. Generally not too big a deal on cars with steel rotors but an imapct wrench can be devastating on newer cars with composite rotors. It took literally years before D-C dealers learned this on the 90's Jeep Cherokees. Then again they made lotsa bucks for a loooong time replacing warped rotors with only 7000 miles on them. Just dumb or just business?
I personally stand there and watch a wheel install when getting new tires and if I don't see a torque wrench at hand I mention it to them.

This is one of the reasons why I threw in the towel and bought my own tire machine and wheel balancer.

When the tire stores DO use a torque wrench, they are only using it to make sure the lugs are tight enough that they don't fall off. They are not using it to tighten the bolts equally and do not tighten them in a pattern. Most of these people are only there for a paycheck.

Actually overtightening the lugs in and of itself should not warp rotors if done in steps and in a star pattern. It's still not good if for no other reason than it makes it somewhere between difficult and impossible to change the tire if you have a flat.

The short lug wrench is plenty long enough to tighten your lugs properly. In fact I don't bother with a torque wrench, that's what I use, but I tighten them evenly and in a star pattern. I've done this on every Benz I've ever had and it has never caused warped rotors.

I have finally come to the conclusion that a common cause of warped rotors is tire foam. It hits the rotors in spots, even in a trace amount will cause problems. I am going to cut a circle of cardboard and hold in place while I use the tire foam to prevent any of it from finding its way to the rotors.

Before I started doing my own tire work, I had found a tire store that had no problem letting me remove and replace the wheels myself. They jacked it up for me and I took it from there. I would rather do that than to sit in a stupid waiting room anyway.

Have a great day,

It's a problem that's serious enough that they could easily snap off a lug bolt. And if you don't really inspect and find it right there when you pick up the car, you might not get them to pay for your whole new hub assembly.

My workaround on this problem is to always take the tires off the car and take them loose to the tire shop. You can do this in 2's or if there's a special deal for 4's, use the spares you have around and/or jackstands.

Never again will I take the whole vehicle in to the tire shop for new tires. They use it as an opportunity to find other things "wrong" with your car: "Oh, you need new brakes and rotors" "Oh, you need a new exhaust" "If you leave without us fixing your brakes, we're going to call the police" etc etc



Ken300D

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1982 300D at 351K miles
1984 300SD at 217K miles
1987 300D at 370K miles

I took my '64 190D to a Sears shop once for tires and they told me it needed new ball joints. I asked if they were sure it needed new ball joints because it didn't think it did. YEP, absulutely needed new ball joints.

Now just for you younger guys: MB didn't use ball joints until the 115s came out in '68. Up until then, the front ends had kingpins and bushings.

After I told the idiot behind the counter that the car didn't have ball joints, I chewed him out up and down. This was before Sears got in trouble for defrauding customers by telling them they needed new parts when they didn't.

Thinking back in retrospect, I should have told them to replace the ball joints and see what happened.

P E H

PEH:

They would have charged you for them while letting the car sit for a day or two.

My friend Hans says he knows for a fact that a shop right down the street from him charged a customer for an engine rebuild on a 4.5L once when it blew a spark plug out (from them stripping the threads putting it in) -- let it sit out back for a month and charged the customer a couple thou. Put a helicoil in (badly -- he had to replace it later).

As far as tightening lug bolts goes, I won't let anyone work on the tires who doesn't use a torque wrench properly. I've seen several places that do -- buying a new set of alloy rims on a Lexus or Benz usually persuades them it's not saving money to let an idiot with a air impact put the wheels on.

On the W126 with the long lug bolts, it's very possible to twist them so that they jam in the wheel. Have to get the entire hub off (some idiots will also cut the wheel, or heat the bolt red-hot in the hub, etc). Big expense, usually only happens once at a tire shop (Hans charges $400 to fix, plus parts). The wheel can be bent, also.

Steel rims will often warp if the bolts (or nuts) are overtightened -- feels like a bad tire or warped rotors, usually goes away when they are removed and replaced correctly. Sometimes bends them permanently, though.

I just lean on a 3/4" ratchet handle, figure that is in the range of 80-100 ft/lbs. Never had a problem, and can use the tool kit wrench to get them back off if I need to.

Peter

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1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!

There is no reason in the world why you could not get ASE certified in brakes and suspension; at least.
Then when they threaten to call the police; you offer to call the police and charge them with fraud and deceitful business practices.
I have been threatened three times:
First time. I did call the police; the officer forced them to loan me the tools to get the wheels back on and they did not get a dime of my money.
Second time. I demanded to speak with the manager; showed my ASE master certification wallet card and threatened to call the police, they where paid only for the tires.
Third time. I was with my lawyer; discussing living trust, etc matters, his MB had a flat at 65 mph.
I put the spare on and we went to his regular shop.
An hour later, they gave him a song and dance about bad rotors and brakes plus four tires.
I went with him to look at the car on the hoist, the scum had swapped tires with the MB on the next hoist and the pads where 50%.
I butted in and requested they stop the shell game, and put the correct wheels back while I watched or I would call the Secretary of State and the police.
They tried to brazen it out, I had a state police Sargent on my cell when the shop owner rushed over and corrected the situation.
They lost a great customer and my lawyer is very happy, he has me review his vehicle service with him now, so far it has saved him $38,000.00 in not needed work over 7 years.
Never be intimidated by a sales person or mechanic.
If they try to get pushy: Tell them; thank you very much, I am on my way to the dealer as I do not feel you are competent to correctly repair a MB.
Remember:
It is your car, you might allow them the honor of touching it, if they respect you and your car.
Have a great day.

__________________
ASE Master Mechanic
https://whunter.carrd.co/

Prototype R&D/testing:
Thermal & Aerodynamic System Engineering (TASE) Senior vehicle instrumentation technician.
Noise Vibration and Harshness (NVH).
Dynamometer.
Heat exchanger durability.
HV-A/C Climate Control.
Vehicle build.
Fleet Durability
Technical Quality Auditor.
Automotive Technical Writer

1985 300SD
1983 300D
2003 Volvo V70

https://www.boldegoist.com/

Very well said!

"There is no reason in the world why you could not get ASE certified in brakes and suspension; "

Yes, as long as you have at least two years working professionally in car repair AND pass the test. You can study up and pass the test, but if you don't have the work experience, that is a reason in the world.

I just wanted to make sure you knew that there was more to it than passing the test.

Have a great day,

Thanks Larry
I did not recall that.
:Sad: I have seen several persons fake up the two years.
There are many diesel discussion members who should be professional mechanics IMHO.
Did you know that active OEM auto engineers can get a waiver on the two years.

I am not surprised at the "faking." The reason I say that is that the last time I took tests they required a photo ID. That tells me that there was some hanky panky going on.

My pro experience is from over 30 years ago, but that did not matter to them.

I agree that it is sad. To me it is sad to see anyone cheat at anything. Unfortunately the world we live in has way too many cheaters.

Have a great day,

How true! Without them though, we wouldn't have half the threads in this forum.

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DJ


84 300D Turbodiesel 190K with 4 speed manual sold in 03/2012

Does that mean I can get ASE certified if I pass the exam (I work as an engineer for an auto parts manufacturer)? I've always been toying with the idea of getting a certificate to certify my wrenching abilities.

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95 E320 Cabriolet, 169K

You know, whunter, I was thinking about heading into the field, myself... thanks for the kick in the pants. Do you (or anyone else here) have any advice about pursuing a career in auto mechanics? I used to be a computer geek, but those jobs are all over-filled with over-qualified folks these days. I never really much enjoyed that work anyways.

Is school the path, or apprenticeship, or what? Thanks!

Ash

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Ash Peltier - tools, truck, tales
---------510-331-4118-----------
1982 240D - (272,000)
1998 Honda VTR1000F(RT) Superhawk Freeway (58,000) "Madrid"
1996 Toyota T100 4x4 (84,000) "Mary Kay"

at the same time is best.
I was lucky; my first mechanic-boss was 85 years old.