What does the health insurance industry add to the equation? - Page 12 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

cmac2012 · #**166** 07-29-2009, 04:52 PM

Oh, here we go, this article claims that VA costs are stable, doing better than the HMO sorts:

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1376238,00.html

DieselAddict · #**167** 07-29-2009, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmac2012

Oh, here we go, this article claims that VA costs are stable, doing better than the HMO sorts:

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1376238,00.html

Great article. Now I'm thinking some actual government takeover of health care (as opposed to just insurance which is a no-brainer to me) probably wouldn't be bad. Especially the following segment of the article above sums up the issue pretty well:

Quote:

Private hospitals, which make their money treating people who come to them sick, don't profit from heavy investments in preventive care, which keeps patients healthy. But the VA, which is funded by tax dollars, "has its patients for life," notes Kizer, who served in his post until 1999. So to keep government spending down, "it makes economic sense to keep them healthy and out of the hospital."

This is exactly why the entire medical industry shouldn't be all about profit. Certainly doctors and nurses should be well paid but they should get compensated partly based on patient health outcomes rather than the # of treatments performed as happens in the current system. And removing profit from health insurance and having a single-payer system that answers directly to the payers (the taxpayers) would go a long way toward reducing costs and making health care more accessible to all. If only the special interests and all the ignorant people got out of the way.

732002 · #**168** 07-29-2009, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MS Fowler

Do we need to beat the dead horses of SS and Medicaid? yes they are funded---for now, but they can't continue to expand coverage with a diminishing source of revenue.
The government does the military thing rather well--at a price, a big price, How well do they handle the medical part? Is the VA medical system the one you want?

Do you like the way the government officials set up one system for their car, and another one for themselves? The ruling class versus the working class. No thank you.

You keep confusing pay with care. AFAIK, every hospital must give care to anyone regardless of ability to pay. The care is provided--it can be expensive, and you be making payments for a long time. But level of care and the paying for that care are different issues.

You still are not answering the most basic question. Should everyone have
health insurance or do you prefer the status quo, with estimated 85% of Americans covered?

If you don't want everyone covered you will not like any plan that tries to
cover everyone.

The VA could be good , we just choose to not fund it as well as weapon
systems. Fighter planes have a cool factor plus a strong lobby, broken
soldiers can't compete with that.

Hospitals do not always get paid. They don't try to send bills to the homeless. If you do have a home and no insurance, medical bills are a major cause of bankruptcy.

Chris Bell · #**169** 07-29-2009, 09:31 PM

The future
http://www.cnsnews.com/public/content/article.aspx?RsrcID=51238

http://www.timesnews.net/article.php?id=9015592

Do a google news search on tenncare, it's where we're headed. Get use to it.

cmac2012 · #**170** 07-29-2009, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DieselAddict

This is exactly why the entire medical industry shouldn't be all about profit. Certainly doctors and nurses should be well paid but they should get compensated partly based on patient health outcomes rather than the # of treatments performed as happens in the current system. And removing profit from health insurance and having a single-payer system that answers directly to the payers (the taxpayers) would go a long way toward reducing costs and making health care more accessible to all. If only the special interests and all the ignorant people got out of the way.

Yup. Too many examples of doctor's padding their bill have been found. The stories from McAllen, Texas are pretty wild.

I mean, I agree that doctors deserve to make decent wages. But crookedness is never good.

cmac2012 · #**171** 07-29-2009, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Bell

The future
http://www.cnsnews.com/public/content/article.aspx?RsrcID=51238

http://www.timesnews.net/article.php?id=9015592

Do a google news search on tenncare, it's where we're headed. Get use to it.

Dude, no comment on the Rand study showing that the govt. run outperforms private for profit systems?

Rand is not some far left think tank.

Bill Frist and family's HMO had to pay back some $1.2 billion in overcharged Medicare funds and I'm sure the slap they got on the wrist had to hurt.

Chris Bell · #**172** 07-29-2009, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmac2012

Dude, no comment on the Rand study showing that the govt. run outperforms private for profit systems?

Rand is not some far left think tank.

Bill Frist and family's HMO had to pay back some $1.2 billion in overcharged Medicare funds and I'm sure the slap they got on the wrist had to hurt.

Dude, no comment on the complete failure of tenncare.

cmac2012 · #**173** 07-29-2009, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Bell

Dude, no comment on the complete failure of tenncare.

I just now read it and it doesn't look good. I'm sure that any transition won't be easy.

But the alternative to doing nothing is not so good either. Our health care costs about double most other advanced nations, we have lousier outcomes, and about 50 million people have no coverage.

At this rate, I can see other nations running circles around us. We have a major structural disadvantage.

Chris Bell · #**174** 07-29-2009, 11:01 PM

Latest Zogby poll, 83.5 % are very satisfied or somewhat sattisfied withe their health care.
Except for the fear mongering left wing fools, why are we destroying our health care system.
http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.cfm?ID=1722

Chris Bell · #**175** 07-29-2009, 11:19 PM

Love the fire paragraph from this article..

"Americans are fairly evenly divided on the health care reform proposals working their way through Congress, but most remain convinced that the plans will raise costs and hurt the quality of the care they receive. " So, why are we doing this again, except for the fear mongering left wing fools.

This is a Rassmussen poll, only 23% of americans are ignorant enough to believe that health care costs will go down if Hussien care is enacted

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/healthcare/july_2009/just_23_believe_health_care_costs_will_go_down_if_reform_passes_congress

Matt L · #**176** 07-29-2009, 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Bell

...only 23% of americans are ignorant enough to believe that health care costs will go down if Hussien care is enacted

Statements such as this really do not help your argument.

Chas H · #**177** 07-29-2009, 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Bell

Latest Zogby poll, 83.5 % are very satisfied or somewhat sattisfied withe their health care.
Except for the fear mongering left wing fools, why are we destroying our health care system.
http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.cfm?ID=1722

Here's a direct quote from your link so we don't need to deal with biased parphrasing.

"Key survey findings included that 84 percent of those who are currently insured are satisfied with their health care. For those without insurance, only 46 percent had some level of satisfaction with their health care. Almost 80 percent agreed that rising healthcare costs are hurting American businesses. An expanded role for government in health care is opposed by 48 percent of Americans, while 44 percent support it. Forty-six percent of respondents agreed that a public plan is needed to "keep insurance companies honest.""

The goal of healthcare reform is to expand coverage to everyone. There is no issue with the quality of care.
The healthcare industry is currently spending $1.4million a day in lobbying against healthcare reform.
Plus the Zogby poll does not give the percentage of respondents to the poll that have their healthcare insurance paid by their employer.

MS Fowler · #**178** 07-30-2009, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 732002

You still are not answering the most basic question. Should everyone have
health insurance or do you prefer the status quo, with estimated 85% of Americans covered?

If you don't want everyone covered you will not like any plan that tries to
cover everyone.

The VA could be good , we just choose to not fund it as well as weapon
systems. Fighter planes have a cool factor plus a strong lobby, broken
soldiers can't compete with that.

Hospitals do not always get paid. They don't try to send bills to the homeless. If you do have a home and no insurance, medical bills are a major cause of bankruptcy.

Show me that Article in the Constitution that mandates that the government provide health care, or is that just a silly inconvenience?
How is a country in debt able to afford to buy this new toy?
Are we discussing excellence of healt care, or the ability to pay for it?

#**179** 07-30-2009, 07:23 AM

"Show me that Article in the Constitution that mandates that the government provide health care, or is that just a silly inconvenience?"There is not a COTUS mandate for health care however if we bill ourselves as the greatest country in the world shouldn't our health care coverage reflect that?
"How is a country in debt able to afford to buy this new toy?" I belive it will save money in the long run for everyone. Less unecessary testing, and fewer people having to pay for the uninsured, which you do anyways"
Are we discussing excellence of healt care, or the ability to pay for it?" The ability to pay for health care is a major cause of debt and no one really knows the "true" cost of what the insurance company bills people for. The excellence of health care also figures into the equation.

tbomachines · #**180** 07-30-2009, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by helpplease

The ability to pay for health care is a major cause of debt and no one really knows the "true" cost of what the insurance company bills people for. The excellence of health care also figures into the equation.

I do. The public has some false concept that HI companies make gobs and oodles of money and deny deny deny claims. Truth is that they make just enough profit to operate, <5%, the better ones (more claims paid, etc.) <2%. As I have said earlier, many of the employees in the industry are actually underpaid (me included).