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  #61  
Old 12-22-2012, 06:21 PM
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"Your question is stupid and not worth answering"... You're really going to win people over with that. I'm looking for a conversation, you're looking to argue and belittle.

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  #62  
Old 12-22-2012, 07:21 PM
Inna-propriate-da-vida
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dubyagee View Post
Regulation of personal choice is not the issue. Trying to ban or regulate a right is the issue. Regardless of the belief of a slippery slope or the insults directed at those that believe there is one, the weapons style or capacity had NO bearing on the school shooting. The weapon is not to blame or the access to the weapon.
I respectfully disagree with this statement.
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  #63  
Old 12-22-2012, 07:38 PM
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We agree to disagree.

I have a question, what would be different in this situation if the mag capacity or weapons style would have been different? He had multiple guns and apparently a lot of ammo.

Time was on his side and he could have reloaded as needed.
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  #64  
Old 12-22-2012, 07:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TylerH860 View Post
Once again, my question was why own such a gun? What possible reason other than showing off at the gun range? Is showing off at the gun range with a 100 round assault rifle worth having these available for the general public?

I am looking at a reason that's logical enough to justify these occasionally falling in the wrong hands. Handguns and hunting rifles make sense. I like both of them.

What I wasn't looking for was the standard NRA card carrying member talking points. I think I joined the NRA when I did an introduction to hand guns course years ago...

From what I understand, the police responded to Sandy Hook within minutes. If the nut job only had a few handguns with 15 round magazines, could he have produced the same carnage in the same amount of time? 20 dead most with multiple hits on all of them? Would he have been as confident in his scheme with handguns? Doubtful. Same story for the movie theater whacko.

....but once again, I'm not looking for an argument that can never find common ground. There is no changing your mind on the issue or mine. What I was looking for is why would you want to own such a gun and is it worth the side effects to you? Is the only reason because of the second amendment, and you're worried banning some guns will eventually lead to banning all guns?
The answer to WHY is easy...Why do people want to have cars that go 150mph? Why do people want trucks that are lifted so high that they are at risk of falling over on a turn?
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  #65  
Old 12-22-2012, 08:04 PM
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pot vs booze

[QUOTE=cmbdiesel;3071150]Geez... what did pot ever do to anybody??
In the big picture, pot is no different than booze and vice versa. I am not sure that pot is addictive whereas booze is or at least can be. Also, I really don't know if excessive long term pot smoking can cause terminal disease whereas booze can. BUT, I really think folks would be better off not using either or just using them every blue moon if that.
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  #66  
Old 12-22-2012, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TylerH860 View Post
Gun people help me understand...

Why do you want to have assault rifles and high capacity magazines? Should your desire to own these guns trounce safety concerns with all the nut jobs?

I'm honestly having a hard time wrapping my head around this. I am not interested in second amendment arguments like, "because I can" or "because 'Merica", nor am I interested in the cars, drugs, people kill people argument or somesuch. Just wondering what is your motivation to own one of these killing machines, despite them being so easy to fall into the hands of crazies.

Unlike a handgun you can't use it for defense, unless its in your home, but I'd think you'd do lots of damage to your house or risk hitting a family member should you unload a magazine when the adrenaline is pumping. I have some experience with guns and would think a pistol would be much better for protection and home defense. Its not a practical gun for hunting either; the only use I can see is for fun at the shooting range.

All assault weapons are good at is killing large amounts of people, plain and simple. Is it just fun to have that kind of power in your hands, are you preparing for a zombie apocalypse, or what?

Banning Assault weapons and high capacity magazines makes perfect sense. The nutties can still get guns but they won't be able to kill as many people.
I'll take a crack at this.

I'd love to be able to afford an assault rifle, but since they are class 3 and expensive, and I don't have $100k to throw at collecting them right now I settle for semi automatic sporting rifles.

I'd love to ad an M16 and STG44 to my collection, but doing so would cost the better part of $40k.

I buy and collect military rifles because I find them to be very interesting. Its not different than collecting Mercedes, you get into the back story of an FN49 and before you know it you have one, and you just have to have the latest expression of FN's design the Scar while your at it.

Very few things in this day and age of disposable consumer goods are built like firearms. A good rifle like a Stag or Colt AR is built to last for decades, its something you can pass on to your kids. I own and shoot a number of rifles that are approaching 100 years old. Its very impressive that a Swiss gunsmith in 1915 cared enough about his job, and was so good at it that almost 100 years later his rifles bolt still locks up solid, and it still prints a nice group on paper 100 yards out. The gunsmith is long gone, but his creation and the expression of his skill is still with us.
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  #67  
Old 12-22-2012, 08:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnumPI View Post
If banning high-capacity magazines saves some children, wouldn't banning all magazines save all the children? Ditto for assault rifles/all rifles. All I ask for is some f***ing consistency. Otherwise you indirectly make the case that it's OK for some people to be killed as a compromise to whomever, usually a strawman. Unless, you can concede that it isn't about protecting anyone as best as possible, it's about "feeling safe".

Assault Rifle

Ranch rifle

Same gun.
Neither one of those is an assault rifle.

Once in for all, you are Mercedes guys so I expect you to know this!



This is an assault rifle, its capable of fully automatic fire.
It costs $20k+, and is an NFA item on a form 3.



This is a semi automatic sporting rifle, with a lot of useless Gucci gear on it, and cheap crap ammo in the mag.
$900 plus gear, and a few permits depending on where you live.

Their is a vast difference between these rifles.
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  #68  
Old 12-22-2012, 08:29 PM
Inna-propriate-da-vida
 
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[QUOTE=greazzer;3071505]
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmbdiesel View Post
Geez... what did pot ever do to anybody??
In the big picture, pot is no different than booze and vice versa. I am not sure that pot is addictive whereas booze is or at least can be. Also, I really don't know if excessive long term pot smoking can cause terminal disease whereas booze can. BUT, I really think folks would be better off not using either or just using them every blue moon if that.
Pot is much less destructive to mind and body than alcohol. If one were to be illegal, it should be booze. Fortunately, neither will be soon.
There is no toxic level of weed, you cannot smoke yourself to death, a big enough bottle of booze, and you could be dead in an hour.

All things in moderation, especially moderation....
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  #69  
Old 12-23-2012, 12:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TylerH860 View Post
"Your question is stupid and not worth answering"... You're really going to win people over with that. I'm looking for a conversation, you're looking to argue and belittle.
Why did you put quotes around that? Who said it?
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  #70  
Old 12-23-2012, 12:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hatterasguy View Post
Neither one of those is an assault rifle.

Once in for all, you are Mercedes guys so I expect you to know this!

This is a semi automatic sporting rifle, with a lot of useless Gucci gear on it, and cheap crap ammo in the mag.
$900 plus gear, and a few permits depending on where you live.

Their is a vast difference between these rifles.
Well, I agree of course. I think the CA definition is(was?) 3 accessories = assault rifle.
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  #71  
Old 12-23-2012, 03:39 AM
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So why do a lot of people have to get killed before it seems to be so upsetting? What's the right number before it's not OK? 20? 10? 1? You tell me when it tarts to bother you?

Besides, you aren't going to ever get rid of guns in America. It's as American as mom and apple pie. Problem is, there's a gun for every man, woman, and child - apparently over 300 million. Hell, why not 500 million?
You see, it doesn't matter at this point. Guns have become such a part of American culture that everyone simply accepts the fact that they are here and they're not going to go away. Ban certain types and there's still going to be 250 million left to go around. Even if not one more was made and no more were introduced into the huge amount already out there, there would still be millions of them. So, don't worry. You will always be able to get one.

However, there are two sides developing which is hardly a surprise. Isn't everything getting split down the middle these days? One side is black and the other side is white. One side R's the other side D's. The new fight is and will be over guns and there's more than just a small potential for the really hard line gunners to go after someone and take them out - they feel that strongly about their rights. Even if any new laws that are passed come watered down and useless as far as makiing any real changes, there will be those who will violently oppose them.

What's wrong with safe/safer storage? What's wrong with having meaningful back ground checks on buyers? What's wrong with having some stuff restricted - you can own it but you have to cross all the T's to get one first? If it's going to make everyone feel safer having a certain limit on mag size why fight that? No one is saying you can't have any of these things - only saying that some sensible limits need to be considered. Why? Why fight this tooth and nail?
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  #72  
Old 12-23-2012, 04:14 AM
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This issue is now be played out on so many differant threads..

Gotta call Troll on the OP.

Ya know..stir up the pot...keep crap simmering.
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  #73  
Old 12-23-2012, 09:22 AM
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Ah yes, love the smell of simmering crap in the morning.

Nice pics but you left off the MP5 and the UZI, guess 'cause they're not rifles.

Ever heard of a KG9?
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  #74  
Old 12-23-2012, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TylerH860 View Post
...
I was really looking for a good reason to own ....
What is a 'good reason' for owning any tool? I mean, we can rely on ACE mechanics for autos, electricians for electrical stuff, etc.

There are so many experts around there is no good reason for anybody to own a tool, just hire an expert.

A weapon is a tool.
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  #75  
Old 12-23-2012, 11:43 AM
Inna-propriate-da-vida
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Botnst View Post

A weapon is a tool.
And a lot of tools own weapons.

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On some nights I still believe that a car with the fuel gauge on empty can run about fifty more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. - HST

1983 300SD - 305000
1984 Toyota Landcruiser - 190000
1994 GMC Jimmy - 203000

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