There'll be a trial. Long as he doesn't do anything stupid when the Marshals show up.

So Cliven is not just a freeloading moocher who sucks at the .gov teat, he is also woefully under educated when it comes to understanding the legal arguments he has chosen to defend himself with....

The Irony of Cliven Bundy's Unconstitutional Stand - Matt Ford - The Atlantic

Admittedly, I never heard of the 'Paramount Allegiance' clause before either.... ;)

Seems as if the Mexican Cession occurred decades before his forebears settled there as well.... so much for 'preemptive'....

This guy is an asshat, and the mobilized militias are even worse....

Two decades after Nevada's founders proclaimed unswerving obedience to federal authority, Cliven Bundy's family first settled the land where he and his supporters now make their heavily armed stand against federal power. It's doubtful even the Nevada Constitution will change their minds—if legal and constitutional arguments could persuade the militia movement, there might not be a militia movement.

Had a thought....what if these federales were confronting a family that were illegally growing marijuana and in the process the federales pushed down the families daughter and maced her brother. Would you guys be good with that?

It's been a long time since I worked out west (Wyoming), but I clearly remember the contempt for the federal government that was widespread and among some people, very near hatred.

Nowadays many federal agencies no longer used federal vehicles in many areas. Fed employees of some agencies (NPS, FWS in particular) don't wear their uniforms in some areas.

Clearly Bundy is breaking the law.

Equally clearly, a lot of his neighbors see his actions as a cause célèbre and a fine opportunity to make a point about the relationship between land users and the landowner.

Are they right?

If the fed shoots a bunch of civilians over grazing rights then the feds will have proven the ranchers argument with the lives of the ranchers.

Answer your own question and then I'll address it.

Another thought.... The Feds Sunday showed their willingness to kill Americans. They refuse, however, to use such measures on the border to try to control illegal immigration and drug running. What's wrong with this picture?

Of course I wouldn't be good with it if they were not violently resisting with deadly force.

The ranchers were offering to resist with deadly force.

Are the growers armed, defiant and confrontational?

I don't recall anything happening to Cliven's daughter....

Nevada rancher's son tasered by federal agents in fight over right to graze land | Mail Online
I do like the part of the video where the kid (nephew or some such) claims to have been hit by multiple vehicles, including a dump truck.....
Kind of hard to take anything these people say seriously.

What we want to know is would you be defending the pot growers?;)

I'm not talking about the ranchers. I'm talking about the unarmed family members that were pushed down and maced.

I would be defending the unarmed pot growing family members being pushed down and maced. I would not be defending them for growing the poison any more than I would defend bundy if he turns out guilty.

You used it as an argument by analogy. An analogy should work both ways congruently.

If it's good for the federales to abuse dope suspects it is also okay for them to abuse grazing violators and vice-versa.

I would argue that it is an extremely dumb move in both cases for the feds to go to violence.

Pretty sure they haven't killed anyone.... you are overstating with use of the word 'willingness'
They even let off the taser before the guy lost control of his bowels...
That's showing some consideration right there....


If they really wanted to kill these people to settle this issue, there would be dead people.
Pulling back to let the situation calm down actually shows that someone somewhere has a brain.
Next time, they will take Cliven nice and quiet down at the local breakfast joint.

I would say that it's even dumber to offer up physical violence to a larger and better equipped force...;)

Guessing that the ranchers never found a use for Sun Tzu...

The feds will be back. With lots of handcuffs, appropriate warrant(s), an overwhelming force - well armed of course, and motor coaches to haul off the arrested. Ambulance type services, if necessary, will be first allocated to LEO. The rancher should start reading the mail from the courts.