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  #1  
Old 06-06-2005, 11:38 PM
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Can a Jag replace a Benz?

I still haven't bought a new car yet. The more time I read and ask questions, the more I see how a used car from the 1990s that's out of warranty can be a handful with repairs. There is no Benz in my price range ($12,000-$14,000) that seems to be a safe bet. Either the car is last of the old generation (W124) of first of the new (W140). I will not buy a W140! So far, the top 2 cars on my list as of today are a 1996 BMW 740iL and a 1996 Lexus LS400. You can see from my earlier thread what I was looking at:

Which Car Would You buy? 56k Warning

On the weekend, I passed by the Jag dealer and couldn't help from staring at a beautiful Black XJ they had. Considering that the 1998 and up generation is German designed with a ZF 5-speed automatic transmission with Bosch electronics and Japanese and Nippon parts, is it possible Jag finally got it right? Can a Jag be the car I choose over a Benz for the first time? What do you guys think? Are these cars an option or out of the question?


Here is one to look at:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=31847&item=4554459845&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW
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  #2  
Old 06-06-2005, 11:55 PM
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Good luck with the Electrics/Electronics.
My understanding is, they have improved in the last 4 or 5 years, since Ford " took charge ".
You may also want to price a few spare parts & maintenance items, just to compare.
Nice looking cars, always have been.
Just do your research.
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  #3  
Old 06-07-2005, 12:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manny
Good luck with the Electrics/Electronics.
My understanding is, they have improved in the last 4 or 5 years, since Ford " took charge ".
You may also want to price a few spare parts & maintenance items, just to compare.
Nice looking cars, always have been.
Just do your research.
There is a dealer in Ontario that is well known. They seem to always have a large selection. You may know them:

http://www.birkshiremotors.com/2home.html

http://www.trader.ca/powerpage/listings.aspx?vlotid=29033
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  #4  
Old 06-07-2005, 04:34 AM
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Jaguar = Danger. My friend bought his dads 2000 XJR. this car had nothing but problems. Now with the transmission. He is looking at a $4000 repair and is ready to give up. If your price range is $ 14.000 get a W210. ( I just got a 1999 E 240 for $ 13.000- absolutely no problems) A Jag potentially can wreck your finances. Remember Lucas electronics. Lucas is the Lord of Darkness. Pretty car tough.
Good Luck,
usaustria
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  #5  
Old 06-07-2005, 06:53 AM
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Jags

I think the jags are beautiful fast luxury cars. Howerver, the beauty of a Mercedes is that spares can be bought at a fairly reasonable cost from online vendors. I don't see many people selling cheaper parts for a jag. To my knowledge they are also not the most DIY friendly cars either.

For a used car, Jag has an excellent bang for buck rating but you should be able to get a W210 Mercedes within your price range.
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Check out the W114, W115 enthusiast website.
http://www.stroke8.org

http://www.w108.org

Join the Mercedes W108 group
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http://www.w108.org/gallery/albums/a...0959.thumb.jpg
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  #6  
Old 06-07-2005, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alabbasi
I think the jags are beautiful fast luxury cars. Howerver, the beauty of a Mercedes is that spares can be bought at a fairly reasonable cost from online vendors. I don't see many people selling cheaper parts for a jag. To my knowledge they are also not the most DIY friendly cars either.

For a used car, Jag has an excellent bang for buck rating but you should be able to get a W210 Mercedes within your price range.
I don't get too excited when I see a W210 for some reason. I have seen some of them that have a lot of rust which scares me. These are cars on Ebay in the US. The other thing is that some people say that the W210 is very reliable and other have had a lot of problems. It doesn't come accross to be a car as relaible as an LS400 for example, based upon what I've read. The Jag I don't have enough feedback to form an educated opinion yet. That's what I'm looking for.

I did find this though:

http://media.ford.com/news/section_news.cfm?make_id=95&section=80&change_jag_session=true

http://media.ford.com/news/index.cfm?make_id=95
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  #7  
Old 06-07-2005, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usaustria
Jaguar = Danger. My friend bought his dads 2000 XJR. this car had nothing but problems. Now with the transmission. He is looking at a $4000 repair and is ready to give up. If your price range is $ 14.000 get a W210. ( I just got a 1999 E 240 for $ 13.000- absolutely no problems) A Jag potentially can wreck your finances. Remember Lucas electronics. Lucas is the Lord of Darkness. Pretty car tough.
Good Luck,
usaustria
It's the beauty of the car that got me going. The autolux connolly leather in the XJ8 VDP is the same a Rolls Royce leather and the lambswool footwell carpeting and all that wood...it's just beautiful, but maybe I should be more careful. I just don't want to fall into a trap.

The old joke was:
Why do British people like to drink warm beer?
Because their fridges were made by Lucas.

Thinngs have changes since those days. I thought I read somewhere that Lucas is actually a respected company now. Not sure though, and do these new Jags use Lucas anyway?
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  #8  
Old 06-07-2005, 11:23 AM
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Jag Replacing Benz

Sure, if you want to jump out of the frying pan into the fire.
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  #9  
Old 06-07-2005, 11:27 AM
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There will probably be almost as many opinions on your question as there are forum members

My choice would be the Lexus.

When it comes to Jags I'm kind of old fashioned. I like the older ones and wouldn't touch the newer ones. (Kind of like my philosophy about M-Bs.)
Through the years I've learned to get along with Mr. Lucas, at least in his earlier endeavors. The Lucas stuff I've encountered all worked surprisingly well as long as a reasonable amount of care was given. One big advantage has been the ability to take apart and repair all of the older Lucas electrics.

(But then, on the other hand, I'm used to putting a grease gun on 17 zerk fittings on the Healey every 1000 miles. Maybe I'm just nuts.)

Wes
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  #10  
Old 06-07-2005, 11:40 AM
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I would also seriously consider buying an XJ8.

Yeah, I know there are people that have had problems with the cars, but I believe their experiences are merely anecdotal. The quality surveys say otherwise. Jaguar has routinely posted higher quality ratings than Mercedes at least since 1998-ish, maybe longer.
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  #11  
Old 06-07-2005, 01:37 PM
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Ford/Delco took over the Jag electronics by the early 90's.

I had an earlier '92 XJS V-12 that was absolutely beautiful and luxurious...and expensive to maintain. Unloaded it for the SL we have now, which is draining my pockets right now for a $7 headlamp bulb and $30 washer pump!

That is my typical experience right now...I can always expect to add a couple of zeroes if I get the Jag part versus the MB part.

One year, a broken glove box lock was $120! Same design as my $11 VW lock...except it had to be imported from GB due to having to specially key the lock!

The endless climate control and lamba sensor issues is what made my finally get rid of it. Decided $6K of repairs with less than 45K miles on the vehicle was enough!

Stuff like that wears you down.
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  #12  
Old 06-07-2005, 02:01 PM
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Some early year v-8s had nikasil cylinder liners that corroded with high sulphur US fuel. Better study up on that.

There's a forum called JagLovers or something similar that I posted to recently to try and get some help for my mother's car. The people on that site are helpful, but way off the number of DIYers on this board, so that even what I would consider simple questions are sometimes unanswered.

Try this site, too: motorcarsltd.com

My mom is 70 something and her XK8 convertible rear passenger window wouldn't roll up. The DEALER in Austin wanted $1400 for replacement of the motor/regulator and told her how lucky she was that they had one in stock. I almost hurt myself laughing when my Dad called to ask if that seemed right.

This was before the dealer checked fuses or anything else. So.

I did what I would do with my cars and got online, but as has been said, there aren't a lot of online parts sellers for recent year stuff. This window regulator was a dealer only thing from what I could tell.

I posted a message and found a regulator w/no motor from a recycler for $150 after a few days.

They are beautiful cars. They are not cheap to own. Be sure the engine was replaced if it was one with the cylinder problem.
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  #13  
Old 06-07-2005, 06:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence Coppar
Sure, if you want to jump out of the frying pan into the fire.
lol
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  #14  
Old 06-07-2005, 06:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Benz
Ford/Delco took over the Jag electronics by the early 90's.

I had an earlier '92 XJS V-12 that was absolutely beautiful and luxurious...and expensive to maintain. Unloaded it for the SL we have now, which is draining my pockets right now for a $7 headlamp bulb and $30 washer pump!

That is my typical experience right now...I can always expect to add a couple of zeroes if I get the Jag part versus the MB part.

One year, a broken glove box lock was $120! Same design as my $11 VW lock...except it had to be imported from GB due to having to specially key the lock!

The endless climate control and lamba sensor issues is what made my finally get rid of it. Decided $6K of repairs with less than 45K miles on the vehicle was enough!

Stuff like that wears you down.

I had a 1987.5 XJ6 and that one cost a pretty penny to maintain. Then I replaced it with a 1990 XJ6 and had nothing go wrong at all.

I guess I want a nice car and not the repairs which looks like it's a tall order these days. The good cars are old now and getting tired, the newer cars are breaking down just as much with carzy stupid electronic and quality control issues, and so leasing seems to be winning the vote for a lot of people. This new car that I buy may be the last if things keep going the way they are now and I may jump on the leasing idea and enjoy a warranty for a change.
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  #15  
Old 06-07-2005, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oxymoron
Some early year v-8s had nikasil cylinder liners that corroded with high sulphur US fuel. Better study up on that.

There's a forum called JagLovers or something similar that I posted to recently to try and get some help for my mother's car. The people on that site are helpful, but way off the number of DIYers on this board, so that even what I would consider simple questions are sometimes unanswered.

Try this site, too: motorcarsltd.com

My mom is 70 something and her XK8 convertible rear passenger window wouldn't roll up. The DEALER in Austin wanted $1400 for replacement of the motor/regulator and told her how lucky she was that they had one in stock. I almost hurt myself laughing when my Dad called to ask if that seemed right.

This was before the dealer checked fuses or anything else. So.

I did what I would do with my cars and got online, but as has been said, there aren't a lot of online parts sellers for recent year stuff. This window regulator was a dealer only thing from what I could tell.

I posted a message and found a regulator w/no motor from a recycler for $150 after a few days.

They are beautiful cars. They are not cheap to own. Be sure the engine was replaced if it was one with the cylinder problem.
Thanks for the links .

After reading your post, I made a few calls and found out that the Nikisil problem is public knowledge. I thought only BMW had the problem. Boy, maybe I might have to go back in time and consider buying a W123 or even a W114! What is more reliable that one of those cars?

http://juanfra.bravehost.com/fotoscoches/mercedes.htm
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