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  #1  
Old 02-02-2007, 12:29 PM
Max47's Avatar
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SSS (Sudden Stalling) Factsheet

Hi Guys,
I'm pretty new to this forum, wifey car suffer from the SSS(Sudden Stalling Sydrome). So I come to this forum to see if I can find solution to this problem.

I do some search in the archive for the last 2 weeks I guess, and ask questions to others members. Believe me I learn something in the process.

-first there is a lot a MB suffering from the SSS it seem that all model suffer from that SSS at one time or another.

- Second trying to troubleshoot the problem from post on this forum could be difficult at least. Incomplet info, no car model, no engine model, etc.

-Third when digging the archive I find this interesting SHOP NOTE that was send to the Mercedes dealers few years ago:

SHOP NOTE:
"(The owner states that the engine dies intermittently when coming to a stop. (Maintenance note: This problem has been around for a long time. Mercedes-Benz has published several bulletins about the problem. See Diagnostic Directory 07.3-88043/30T93031/07.3-91043/54-89101/AF07.32-U-6701A & TIN 07.3/6. There are about a dozen things that can cause the engine to die. We normally see on about 3 or 4 cause all the problems. Sometimes there can be more than one of these things acting up at the same time. That's when it gets hard to find the problem. The components that cause the most trouble are the fuel pump relay, the flywheel position sensor, and the over load protection relay. We have also seen the Hall Effect sensor, the tachometer, the distributor cap and rotor, the ignition coil, the oxygen sensor, the ignition module (see D/D 15-89041), the idle air valve, temp sensor, wiring harness, EHA valve & the electronic accelerator (see D/D 30T93031). We try and replace the most common things first and if that doesn't take care of it then we get into the more unusual components.)"

Any of you guys working for Mercedes could find those bulletins and share it with all of us. I think those bulletins will help us troubleshoot our SSS. Those bulletins should be public domain stuff since Sudden Stalling is a SAFETY ISSUE.

I think as a group we can built experience on troubleshooting the SSS what we need is a factsheet so each time one of us find the problem of is Sudden Stalling car he will fill the factsheet and posted under this thread.

With the time there will be more and more solved SSS and this will help others to quickly isolate the gremlin(s) in their car and put them in the locked glove box.

I put one of my gremlin in the glove box yesterday, let see if he have some friends under the hood if not I will report here in a few days. No sudden stalling this morning, but it was only -8C, my gremlin go out most of the time at -10C and colder so let wait.

My next post will be the factsheet I'm talking about.

Again if you get those bulletins please PM me or publish it under this thread.

Thanks for your time
Max
JD Combines Specialist

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  #2  
Old 02-02-2007, 12:49 PM
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Factsheet for SSS

Ok, here's the factsheet, if you have solved a Sudden Stalling problem lately please take the time to fill out the form.
Just copy it in your word processor, fill it and post it back here under this thread.

If you think I forgot something please let me know.

Thanks

Max
JD Combines Specialist.
-------------------------------------------------------------
SSS factsheet:

Car model:
Year:
Chassis Model:
Engine Model:
Mileage(km/miles):
State:
Last tune-up (km/miles):
-Spark plug:
-S/P Cable:
-Rotor:
-Cap:

What kind of sudden stalling do you experience?

-Deceleration: ( this when your release the accelerator and put your feet on the brake pedal)

- Coasting: (this is when you just release the accelerator a bit to keep your speed)

- Crusing: (this is when you run at normal speed on the highway)


- Acceleration: ( this is when you accelerate to pass another vehicule or any other type of acceleration)

Does all the instrument and light are working in your dashboard?

-Temp gauge:
-Oil pressure gauge:
-Tachometer:
-Fuel Gauge:
-Alternator Gauge:
-Abs light:
-Srs light:
-Engine light:
-O2 sensor light:
-all the other light :
P.S. some model do not have a O2 light sensor but instead they have a check engine light.

STALLING INFO:

How often does it Stall:

-Random:
-Every day:
-At a certain outside temp(specify):

Does Any light come on or flikering before it Stall?:

-ABS light:
-Check Engine light:
-O2 Sensor Light:

Engine Temp when stalling:

Outside Temp when Stalling:

Fuel gauge reading:

Alternator's reading:

Ac/Heater on or off:

Heated seat on or off:

Does it Start easy after Stalling:

-Push the accelerator pedal down and it start after few turn
-Sometimes it start easy sometimes i have to wait 2 to 10 minutes
- I have to wait from 2 to 10 minutes before it will re-start

After stalling when you get the engine running:

-The idle is smooth (specify RPM):
-The idle go up and down(specify RPM):

If the idle go up and down does it settle to normal after:

-The engine temp reach (specify Temp)
-I stop the engine for few :
-Minutes(specify):
-Hours (specify):

Deceleration Stalling:

-If you put the car in neutral at the same time you decelerate does it stall??

- If you double pedal (one feet on the brake one feet one the throttle) and keep the RPM over 1500 does it stall??

Troubleshooting and Diagnostic

Which procedure have you follow to troubleshoot your problem?

-Thread from this Forum(Specify, give the link)
-Mercedes shop manuel
-Personal procedure
-Guess work

Which part(s) have you replaced and why??

-Ex: -The ovp, because my abs light was flickering

-The 4pin sensor because the spec. was no more then 130 ohms difference between the diag., mine have about 200 ohms difference

Ps. try to give as much spec as you can this will speed up the troubleshooting time for the other members since if they have the spec. it will be easier for them to check.

Do you do any other maintance to the car at same time??

-Ex: -Yes I replace the rotor and cap.
- Yes I replace some of the light in the dashboard

How long since you fixe-it?

-A day
-A week
-A month
-More then a month
Ps. Please keep your report update until it reach more then a month.

Comment:
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Last edited by Max47; 02-02-2007 at 01:08 PM.
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  #3  
Old 02-02-2007, 12:54 PM
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You forgot the most important part.
Year & model of car & what engine.
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  #4  
Old 02-02-2007, 01:14 PM
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Hi Manny,

Sorry, my word processor seams to have gremlin too.
LOL

Is it ok now???

Max
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  #5  
Old 02-02-2007, 01:18 PM
david s poole
 
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yes that you forgot.most of the time when SSS occurs at very low temps it can be pinned down to not enough fuel.
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  #6  
Old 02-02-2007, 02:25 PM
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-------------------------------------------------------------
SSS factsheet:

Car model: C220
Year: 1995 1/2 (pre facelift)
Chassis Model: W202
Engine Model: no freaking clue
Mileage(km/miles): 218309
State: BC, Canada
Last tune-up (km/miles): I dunno? Odometer stopped before I bought the car
-Spark plug: OEM Bosch (yes it serviced 12 years, I should find the previous owner and kick his ass)
-S/P Cable: OEM Bosch
-Rotor: None - independent ignition
-Cap: None - independent ignition

What kind of sudden stalling do you experience?

-Deceleration: ( this when your release the accelerator and put your feet on the brake pedal)

Does all the instrument and light are working in your dashboard?

-Temp gauge: Y
-Oil pressure gauge: N/A does not exist
-Tachometer: Y
-Fuel Gauge: Y
-Alternator Gauge: N/A does not exist
-Abs light: Y and on at the time of stall
-Srs light: Y
-Engine light: N
-O2 sensor light: N/A does not exist
-all the other light : Y
P.S. some model do not have a O2 light sensor but instead they have a check engine light.

STALLING INFO:

How often does it Stall:

-Random: 3 out of 20 times at a stop light

-At a certain outside temp(specify): Cold near 0C.

Does Any light come on or flikering before it Stall?:

-ABS light: Y
-Check Engine light: N
-O2 Sensor Light: N/A does not exist

Engine Temp when stalling: 50C

Outside Temp when Stalling: 0C

Fuel gauge reading: 3/4

Alternator's reading: N/A does not exist

Ac/Heater on or off: ACC at 20C

Heated seat on or off: N/A does not exist

Does it Start easy after Stalling: N

-Push the accelerator pedal down and it start after few turn

After stalling when you get the engine running:

-The idle go up and down(specify RPM): 300-400RPM

If the idle go up and down does it settle to normal after:

-The engine temp reach (specify Temp): 80C

Deceleration Stalling:

-If you put the car in neutral at the same time you decelerate does it stall?? N

- If you double pedal (one feet on the brake one feet one the throttle) and keep the RPM over 1500 does it stall?? N

Troubleshooting and Diagnostic

Which procedure have you follow to troubleshoot your problem?

-Thread from this Forum(Specify, give the link)
W202 speedometer issue - Searched but cannot find answer

Which part(s) have you replaced and why??

- OVP, because there was no CEL, broken speedometer and ABS light was on. ABS was not functional at the time of the stall as well.

Do you do any other maintance to the car at same time??

-Installed K&N air filter. Don't think it is at all related.

How long since you fixe-it?

-A day

Comment:
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
OVP is a dodgy piece of equipment that should definitely be reinvented so this kind of embarrassment can be avoided. I stalled in front of another W202 and he honked at me....

Last edited by hk20000; 02-03-2007 at 12:01 AM.
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  #7  
Old 02-02-2007, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Max47 View Post
Is it ok now???
Max
No. It's still a mystery.
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  #8  
Old 02-02-2007, 10:38 PM
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manny

Hi Manny,

I hope you can see all the factsheet by now??

Max
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  #9  
Old 02-02-2007, 11:13 PM
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Uh, I think he wants to know what kind of car YOU have. Looks like someone filled in a 95' C220, but I think that is someone elses automobile?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Max47 View Post
Hi Manny,

I hope you can see all the factsheet by now??

Max
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  #10  
Old 02-02-2007, 11:23 PM
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hk20000

Hi,
Thanks for taking the time to fill the factsheet for SSS.

The factsheet will give all of us quick reference.

Reading your factsheet was a learning experience now we know that a C220, chassis model 202, 1995 with a bad OVP relay will give the following symptom.

- ABS light on
-Speedometer not working
-Odometer not working
-Stalling at deceleration 3 time out of 20 at outside temperature around 0C.

Just one thing is it an error or ???

At the question :
Does Any light come on or flikering before it Stall?:

-ABS light: N
-Check Engine light: N
-O2 Sensor Light: N/A does not exist

Does the ABS light was on when the car stall???
If yes please edit your factsheet and do the correction otherwise it might be confusing since your saying the ABS light was on all the time

By the way is it a made in Austria Ovp or made in Germany Ovp??

Again thanks for your time your factsheet will help others members to isolate their gremlin(s) and put them in the locked glove box faster.

Max
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  #11  
Old 02-03-2007, 12:03 AM
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corrected. Austria OVP replaced with German one. (KES or something?)

I don't know what u mean "is it an error or ???"
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  #12  
Old 02-03-2007, 09:56 AM
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In the case of my 1989 300TE it was something as simple as replacing the Hall Effect Sensor.
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  #13  
Old 02-03-2007, 11:00 AM
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Benz-LGB

Hi Benz-LGB

We know from the SHOP NOTE publish earlier on this thread that Hall Effect Sensor could be a cause for SSS.

What might be interesting if you still remenber what was the symptoms and what was the procedure you have follow to isolate the HES.

If you don't mind please take the time to fill the factsheet it will help all of us.

Thanks

Max
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  #14  
Old 02-03-2007, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Max47 View Post
Hi Benz-LGB

We know from the SHOP NOTE publish earlier on this thread that Hall Effect Sensor could be a cause for SSS.

What might be interesting if you still remenber what was the symptoms and what was the procedure you have follow to isolate the HES.

If you don't mind please take the time to fill the factsheet it will help all of us.

Thanks

Max
The car is a 1989 300TE with the M103 engine. It currently has 208k miles. The problem, however, began at around 185k miles.

The engine would cut out as the car was coasting to a stop (either the foot off the gas or actually braking). There were no warning signs, no shakes, no hesitation. Just a complete cutting out--as if someone had reached in grabbed the key and turned the engine off.

The car would the restart immediately.

Because of how the car stalled (no hesitation) we thought it was an electrical problem. That narrowed the search.

My mechanic tried replacing a few things (which needed replacing anyway at that age). Finally he hit upon the HES and bingo!

You can do a search under my screen name for more details.
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1990 300CE "Sam Spade"
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Last edited by BENZ-LGB; 07-17-2008 at 11:36 PM.
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  #15  
Old 02-03-2007, 05:39 PM
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Posts: 10
Thumbs up Sudden Stalling Syndrome

My wife's 1992 300E just went through this same "SSS". It would stall in stop and go traffic as well as when she was taking a turn a little sharp at an intersection.
I replaced the Overload Protection Relay ($63) which is located behind the battery next to the computer module. It was a 5 minute repair and the problem is now remedied. The old one had water in it which was evidenced by condensation built up under the clear plastic double-fuse cover on same. This is a common problem. When/If you replace the module, put a bit of vaseline on the O-ring gasket for the double-fuse cover. Search the Parts icon on this website for a photo and ording information of this module.
It might also be:
Coil
Fuel Injectors
Wiring harness

But I'd begin with the least expensive and easiest remedy in your troubleshooting and go on from there.

Good luck. Ain't this fun? The Mercedes Benz dealer/service shop in Naples estimated $1400 to do this job for me. They said "wiring harness cracked and needs replacing". Bulls#$& !! There was nothing wrong with the harness. It is brand new and was replaced only 2 years ago. It is in perfect condition.
Watch out for scheisters.

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