Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help




Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes ShopForum > Technical Information and Support > Tech Help

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 03-10-2003, 08:52 PM
96C220's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hamilton, NJ
Posts: 367
This may sound sacrelige but.... I need your opinion here.

Okay an interesting situaton has presented itself here to purchase (gasp...) a BMW M3 - 1995 model, manual trans.

The body has 160k miles

The engine was replaced at 122k mi because the dinan supercharger the owner had on it basically destroyed it.

The transmission was replaced at 117k mi cause of a stripped 2nd gear synchro.

The car is owned by a co-worker of mine, who has had it since day one...

It was initially leased, and then bought out by him.

He has high performance brakes, stainless lines, and a bunch of other stuff - intake, exhaust etc.

The car has been driven hard, autocrossed etc... has been through several sets of wheels, but has been maintained well, and looks near new.

He is going to trade it for a 540i 6spd. - He's crossing into that dangerous zone known as adulthood - his daughter is 6 and he wants something with more room and less of a harsh ride.

I can have the car for ~ 10000.

The car would be a 3rd car for me - Mostly a weekend / nice day toy. I've been longing for a manual transmission for a while, and there are very slim pickings in the MB arena.

I would kill for a 190e 2.3 - 16 with a manual in the NJ / NY area that hasnt had 15 winters take its toll on the body, but that is a dream for a different day.

Oh well, thanks in advance to the advice,

George
__________________
George Androulakis

Former Mb's:

1990 500sl R129 - 76k Original Miles - New project - Follow the saga http://90r129.blogspot.com/
1990 190E 2.6 148k mi (sold)
1989 420 SEL 246k mi (sold)
1995 C220 175k mi (sold)
1992 190e 2.6 74k original miles (sold)
2000 c230 Kompressor 122k miles (RIP)
1996 C220 149k mi (sold)
2000 C230 Kompressor Sport 127k (sold)

Current Cars:

2009 Mercedes c300 4matic
2006 Mercedes s430
2005 Jaguar XJR
2003 Cadillac Escalade
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 03-11-2003, 08:12 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: England
Posts: 1,841
The main question you will have to ask is, can you afford to run it?

A low list price is well and good..

BUT, of all the cars I would ever want to have to pay to run, the very bottom of the list (next to an old, mistreated Porsche 911) is a well-thrashed BMW M-car.. especially at 160,000 miles, and /especially/ one that's been autocrossed and modded. Parts are very expensive.

IMO If you want a good (manual) M.. go looking for an M3 that is worth owning, I wouldn't recommend buying this one just because it presented itself. As it's a weekend toy you won't use daily, you're probably best off with a good condition, pref. low mileage one if you can hack the investment.


Bear in mind, if you're looking for a weekend/nice day toy, an M3, especially the E36 M3, doesn't really cut it, it's just a high power saloon(well coupe) - *especially* alongside real sports cars such as the very highly rated Porsche 968.


my 0.02

good luck with whatever you get!

Russ
__________________
190E's:
2.5-16v 1990 90,000m Astral Silver
2.0E 8v 1986 107,000m Black 2nd owner
http://www.maylane.demon.co.uk/190esmall.jpghttp://www.maylane.demon.co.uk/190esmall2.jpg
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 03-11-2003, 01:14 PM
G-Benz's Avatar
Razorback Soccer Dad
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Dallas/Fort-Worth
Posts: 5,711
I agree. The car has seen a hard life, and you are only aware of what has been replaced due to failure.

Many other components suffered abuse during that period but haven't announced themselves yet, such as the suspension (bushings, spindles, springs shocks, etc.).

And because it is an M3, despite what might be shared by the other BMW platforms, the parts for that model will always be more expensive to purchase.
__________________
2009 ML350 (106K) - Family vehicle
2001 CLK430 Cabriolet (80K) - Wife's car
2005 BMW 645CI (138K) - My daily driver
2016 Mustang (32K) - Daughter's car
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 03-11-2003, 01:36 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 645
The whole thing boils down to whether this is exactly what you want, and whether it is the best one you can get for the money.

There are always more used cars people want to sell than people who want to buy them.

The main elements are time and money.

How much money can you spend?

How long can you wait?

Somewhere, at some time, someone will want to sell either that 2.6 manual 190, or a manual transmission will become avaialable and you can install it in the 190 you already have.

Surely somewhere in Europe that transmission exists, waiting for you to buy it.

On the other hand, an M3 (I assume this is a convertible) is a very sexy car, and I don't think $10,000 is that bad a price.

Good luck with whatever you do.
__________________
Semibodacious Transmogrifications a Specialty

1990 300D 2.5 Turbo sedan 171K (Rudolf)
1985 300D Turbo TD Wagon 219K (Remuda)

"Time flies like and arrow, yet fruit flies like a banana"
---Marx (Groucho)
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 03-11-2003, 01:46 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Dallas TX
Posts: 28
Find an older BMW 635....

with a 5 -speed. You'll enjoy the gobs of torque and the handling is quite good! The ride is not harsh and you're more in tune with the road than a MB. I'm on my third one now and haven't regretted the experience. I also have a 560SL. It a great touring car, but not the same driving experience of a BMW.

Greg
Attached Thumbnails
This may sound sacrelige but.... I need your opinion here.-1986635.jpg  
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 03-11-2003, 06:03 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: S. Texas
Posts: 1,237
Remember, the car may have a relatively new engine and trans. but not only does the rest of the car have 160K miles on it but all components that suffer during driving, i.e., suspension, rear end, etc. have 160k hard miles on them.

The suspension bushings may be new but the 'A' arms, shocks, springs, steering linkages, ball joints, etc. have probably all taken a tremendous beating. Take the car to a good front end alighment place and get it checked. The arms may be bent to such an extent that the car may be right at the limits of alignemt adjustment. Remember, that if you have to replace one are the others are not far behind it. Could be in for big bucks.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 03-12-2003, 06:02 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Newcastle upon Tyne, UK
Posts: 215
Hard driving such as you suggest will have stressed the bodyshell. Even if it is still straight (unlikely) it is always going to feel 'loose'.

Plus, use of power enough to trash the engine and gearbox and probably the wheels, is going to leave the diff, halfshafts all very suspect.

An M3 can be an enjoyable car despite not being a real sports car, but this sounds like it's going to be hole in the road into which you pour money.

And no matter what you do to it, it's never going to be as good as the same car that has been driven more sympathetically.

But it's your money. You could just waste it on fast women and slow horses!
__________________
Cheers, Neil
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 03-14-2003, 03:08 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: LEMONT-CHICAGO
Posts: 412
Drive the M# for a few days. I found riding in one very uncomfortable. The seats are hard and the ride is harsh. On the M3 I was shocked to see to poor build quilty on the one I drove. ( a friend's). When it was relatively new the drivers door would not open (plastic handle defective) The interior plastic crap was falling apart. I thought about a BMW but I'm too cheap to let someone else do the maintenance like valve adjustments which require expensive tools.
__________________
1990 190E 2.6
1996 Grand Voyager 3.3
1985 Mustang GT 5.0 5 SPD
1982 Suzuki GS 750T
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 03-14-2003, 11:07 AM
96C220's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hamilton, NJ
Posts: 367
Well the opportunity came and went.

I go to work and I ask the guy what is going on with the car, let me take it for a ride etc....

And he says its gone. Apparently he went around to a few dealers and took the highest offer he could get for it asap. He ended up selling the car for the sub 8000 range, just because as he put it "it was time to go".

Oh well the search carries on.

Thanks for all the advice,

George
__________________
George Androulakis

Former Mb's:

1990 500sl R129 - 76k Original Miles - New project - Follow the saga http://90r129.blogspot.com/
1990 190E 2.6 148k mi (sold)
1989 420 SEL 246k mi (sold)
1995 C220 175k mi (sold)
1992 190e 2.6 74k original miles (sold)
2000 c230 Kompressor 122k miles (RIP)
1996 C220 149k mi (sold)
2000 C230 Kompressor Sport 127k (sold)

Current Cars:

2009 Mercedes c300 4matic
2006 Mercedes s430
2005 Jaguar XJR
2003 Cadillac Escalade
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 03-14-2003, 11:50 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 788
Not a sports car?

How can the E36 M3 not be considered a real sports car when it was deemed "The World's Best Handling Car" time and time again by more than one magazine...notable ones too, like C&D and MT. I remember that in at least one of the tests it beat, amongst other cars, a Ferrari F355 and a Viper. As far as a car being a sports car or not, I would put just as much if not more weight on handling as outright power. The Miata has next to no power and no one says it's not a sports car! I know no one said it, but I hope no one is implying that a 190 2.3-16 is a "real sports car"!!

Also, if you are interested in an M3 and are wanting to do mods, go for a 95 because that was the last year of OBD I and you can do ten times more to a 95 than a 96. If you want to mod one check out www.activeautowerke.com. If you don't want to mod one, get a later model with the 3.2 (95 was a 3.0). Although they had the same HP (240), I think the 3.2 was a little torquier and a little easier going if I remember correctly. Let us know what you end up doing!
__________________
'86 420SE Euro
904 Midnight Blue, Gray Velour
Dad bought it new, now I own it.

"A Mercedes-Benz is like a fine wine, it only gets better with age."
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 03-14-2003, 07:32 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 645
What is a sports car?

I would call a BMW M3 a sports car. It's not exactly a 1965 Mustang or a 1958 T Bird, after all.

Many years ago, (in the late 50's) a friend and I bought a wrecked MG TD and rebuilt it. The following summer we bought a 1950 Jaguar XK 120 from the same semi-alcoholic veteran farmer with an English wife and restored that. We sold the MG for $1200, realizing a profit of nearly $500. The Jag went for $1950, and an $800 profit (which was our labor). I am afraid that both went out with shiny new paint from Ol' Earl Scheib (both British Racing Green). Minimum wage at the time was around 70 cents an hour, so we thought we had really outwitted the system. Many, many test drives were required.

Although both of these cars certainly handled better than my 1949 Studebaker Champion or my buddy's Henry J, neither seemed capable of holding the road so well or stopping so quickly as my 1985 TDT wagon, which certrtainly is not a sports car in anyone's book.

So I guess the bar has been raised over the years.

It would be nice to have the MG or the Jag around. They sure were cool looking vehicles, ever so much cooler than a 1950 Ford Tudor, even with blue taillight gems and double spotlights.

Many years later I learned that in 1950 the XK120 did not come in British Racing Green, unless one had a really good friend in the factory, I suppose..
__________________
Semibodacious Transmogrifications a Specialty

1990 300D 2.5 Turbo sedan 171K (Rudolf)
1985 300D Turbo TD Wagon 219K (Remuda)

"Time flies like and arrow, yet fruit flies like a banana"
---Marx (Groucho)
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 03-15-2003, 09:32 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: England
Posts: 1,841
Sports car?

So we don't go too off topic, I started a new thread to discuss what's a sports car:

Sports car?
__________________
190E's:
2.5-16v 1990 90,000m Astral Silver
2.0E 8v 1986 107,000m Black 2nd owner
http://www.maylane.demon.co.uk/190esmall.jpghttp://www.maylane.demon.co.uk/190esmall2.jpg
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:45 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2011 Pelican Parts - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page