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  #1  
Old 04-18-2004, 12:33 PM
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1988 300SEL question

I looked at the owner's manual and can't find the answer to my question. The "low oil" light indicator flashed today after a 30minute drive. How much oil is there between the spot beteen the two arrows on the dip stick and to when the indicator lights up that you're low on oil?

Also.. a year ago I got around 418miles on a full tank (20.5 gallons, not including reserve). This year I had a pretty bad milage showing... somewhere in the nieghborhood of 280 miles. Now, I just reached the MIDPOINT and am at 186 miles for a half tank.

418 miles on full tank: 90% highway 10% street
270 miles on full tank: 80% street 20% highway
186(half tank) est. 372 miles full tank: 75%highway 25% street

As a driver, I like to go about 70-75 on the highway avg. Obviously less when there is traffic and road hazards. With the above figures, am I in the "normal" range? I freaked out a little when I got 270 on my tank and wasn't sure if I had some sort of engine problem. I did a search in the archives and found a stat for a 300SE... but since its a shorter chassis and weighs less, I would imagine the milage would be different than that of an SEL.

What scares me right now is the oil consumption of my engine (m103) with 189,500 miles. I have to check my records as to the miles it had when I did the last oil change, but I am guessing around 1700 miles. I get my wheels rotated for free at Goodyear since I bought a set of new tires and warranty, and I get coupons for $18 oil changes ( I supply my own Mann oil filter). If it went from normal range to a range that triggered the light on my dash, how much oil am i losing?Doing a search, it seems that the m103 does tend to lose oil.

Comments are appreciated.
Sharif

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  #2  
Old 04-18-2004, 01:17 PM
fahrgewehr2's Avatar
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Oil Level is down a quart when light comes on.

You are probably leaking a little, burning a lot. It's time for a valve job.

When you measure mileage, dont put much faith in the reserve llight. They can come on pretty early.
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'80 300D 255k Purchased new by family in 1980.

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1973 220 (gas)
1980 300SD
1992 400E
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  #3  
Old 04-18-2004, 02:14 PM
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How sure are you how full it is after an oil change? Per the advice in this forum, I didn't fill my M103 more than halfway between the dipstick marks.

How old is your O2 sensor?

Sixto
95 S420
87 300SDL
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  #4  
Old 04-18-2004, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by fahrgewehr2
Oil Level is down a quart when light comes on.

You are probably leaking a little, burning a lot. It's time for a valve job.

When you measure mileage, dont put much faith in the reserve llight. They can come on pretty early.
How would I properly measure my MPG then? Also.. if I lost 1qt of oil during that milage.. then I believe I am doing fine. Right?
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  #5  
Old 04-18-2004, 02:46 PM
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Calculate, rather than measure, mileage by dividing distance travelled by amount of fuel to fill-up. It's best to do this over time to smooth out differences in temperature, how full it actually gets, etc.

Folks post a personal best 35mpg in a 560SEL. I suspect the fill up just after netted 10mpg with the same driving. The difference is attributable to not quite filling up to the top for that 35mpg run giving the impression of having used less fuel, or fuel vending equipment set by unscrupulous vendors.

A quart in 1700 miles doesn't seem drastic. Particuarly at 70-75mph when the M103 is turning over 3500rpm. M103s are known to consume more oil at high rpm. Consumer Reports' article on the 300E in 1986 noted that it's probably a design feature that the engine ingests oil at high rpm. I take that for the observation more than logic.

Sixto
95 S420
87 300SDL
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  #6  
Old 04-18-2004, 03:42 PM
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Snibble:

The amount of oil you are using isn't extraordinary on an M103 at 180,000+ miles. At least you have a later engine with the harder valve guides, so at best you are looking at valve guide seals. Worst case, of course, it a valve job. Pretty typical at that milage.

However, first replace the oil filler cap (or just hte gasket). They start to leak about this age, and it's hard to tell since they will only leak significant amounts at highway speeds, where the oil will drip clean off the engine before you slow down. My TE has only used a half quart of so since I replaced my filler cap in July last year, instead of the quart every three months or so (my mother drives it, usually not on the highway).

As for the milage, it's also time to check the mixture and O2 sensor -- if the senor is slow responding, you will run rich and burn more fuel.

Peter
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1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!
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  #7  
Old 04-18-2004, 06:00 PM
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oops.. off with my number

Just went out and checked when the oil change took place... from the time I had the oil changed and the level was appropriate, it has traveled 1447 miles before I noticed the oil light indicator light up.

At the Mercedes show last spring, member ebennz (Peter) saw my car and said he thinks he sees the begininng of guide seal needing to be done. Maybe now I am due up on that..

psfred... your help is always appreciated. I will order a new oil cap for my engine... shouldn't be much. BTW.. I noticed in some ebay pictures, the caps were a little different than mine. My oil cap is made out of plastic and the area where you grip to twist is wide. The ones I saw on ebay were either metal or plastic and the "gripper" was thin. Is one an older style?

Where there any other updates to the engine that mine doesn't have? My car was built on 5/5/1988
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  #8  
Old 04-18-2004, 08:47 PM
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Before you order a whole cap, try just replacing the cap seal psfred mentioned. about a buck on Fast Lane. They also stock the seal for the fuel cap. Both mine were rock hard compared to the new seals.
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  #9  
Old 04-18-2004, 10:51 PM
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Snibble:

A puff of blue smoke on startup is a definite sign you need new vavle guide seals, since oil will seep down the guides with the engine off when they get worn. You won't see the oil smoke with the engine running, just when you start up.

You will also get mixture control problems when the guides get worn -- air leaks in. Can get so bad you cannot get decent idle, although the car will run fine off idle.

You can check the mixture and lambda control with a digital VOM that reads duty cycle -- Sears has several models for about $35.

Peter
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1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!
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  #10  
Old 04-19-2004, 09:25 PM
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Today, as I was replacing the air filter.... I noticed oil around the oil fil up hole and a puddle about the size of a half dollar which accumulated just to the bottom of where excess/spilled oil runs down to. I have a feeling that my oil cap could be the #1 problem. I haven't seen any leaks since I washed down the engine with a degreaser. .
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  #11  
Old 04-19-2004, 09:35 PM
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A drop of oil leaking out every couple of minutes is a quart in 500 miles at 60 mph, more or less. I'd bet your oil consumption will drop dramatically with a new cap or seal.

Cheaper than a quart of oil.

Peter
__________________
1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!
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  #12  
Old 04-19-2004, 10:38 PM
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psfred... fastlane offers 2 models for the gaskets. Which one is it?

1) Fits old style cap 102 018 08 02 : 38.5 x 59mm
2)For oil cap 111 018 03 02 : 47.5 x 59mm
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  #13  
Old 04-20-2004, 07:15 PM
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The 111 cap is metal with a thin ridge down the center. I believe the 102 cap is the original one on the 102/103 engines with a thin ridge (made of plastic). I don't think you can get a gasket for the new ones, but they only cost a couple bucks. You'd have to remove the gasket and measure it to see if it is the one with a 38.5mm hole in the center.

They all fit the same.

Peter
__________________
1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!
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  #14  
Old 04-20-2004, 09:19 PM
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psfred... thanks. Today after my classes and appointment, I stopped by the Mercedes dealership and bought the oil cap. I didn't see a difference in ordering it online for less and pay shipping or just go the dealership. In any case, I might have spend a couple of bucks more at the dealership. When I went to replace the oil cap, I noticed today A LOT more oil around the filler area and it spreading back. I went ahead and replaced the cap. While I took the old one out, I examined the gasket. I didn't see anything wrong with it. It felt the same as the other one. However, when I took the new one off and put the old one back on... I felt a difference in how it sealed and the new one was WAY better.

BTW.. you are right.. the oil cap is the 111 model. Both the old and new are 111.

I will come back to this thread on my next oil change and post results.
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  #15  
Old 06-04-2004, 02:15 PM
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oil consumption on 300se

I am not going to say that some or all of the suggestions posted to your original post could solve your problem. BUT, be careful and don't throw money in the wind. I have an 89 300se with 196k on it now. At about 175k(owned since 164k) I notice a significant amount of oil consumption. It was and still is using about a quart to quart and a half every 700-800 miles. I have replaced the oil cap gasket/seal. I talked to one of my mb mechanics and he said it probably needed a valve job with the mileage on it. So, I spent about $800 to have it done and immediately saw I had the same problem. My car now fouls cylinder 2 & 6 the worst, but about every 2 months, I have to put a new set of plugs in it. I have tried synthetic to help clean the system. It does the best with the synthetic, but the problem is still there. So, I basically threw $800 in the wind. My other mechanic says with it having a valve job done, it probably needs rings. I have read posts here that a valve job helped the problem and I don't doubt that a bit, but I want to warn you that it may not take care of your problem if yours is like mine. I hope I have been helpful.

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