Mercedes: No More Superfluous Electronics
 

In some ways Mercedes is trying to copy the Toyota model, in working with the suppliers but it is also taking a step backwards by having less electronics than Lexus. Lexus has more electronics and is more reliable at the same time. Below is what Mercedes has done or is planning to do:

MERCEDES: NO MORE SUPERFLUOUS ELECTRONICS
In a move aimed at reducing “needless” functions and boosting quality, DaimlerChrysler
AG’s Mercedes arm eliminated some 600 electronic features from its vehicles last year.
And it vows to be more discerning in the future in terms of adding new technology, and to
rigorously test those that it does.
The automaker has been plagued by a string of electronics-related glitches in recent
years that dropped it into the second tier among brands on recent quality surveys. It
reasons that one way to minimize the risk of such problems is to limit the number and
complexity of in-vehicle gadgets.
In a speech at DCX’s Innovation Symposium last month, Stephan Wolfsried,
Mercedes’ vice president for electrical and electronics and chassis development, outlined
the brand’s plans to better focus vehicle content and improve the reliability of onboard
electronics. He says future vehicles will be designed more for normal users rather than
techies, with the amount of adjustable controls and memory settings confined to those
that are used regularly. One casualty of the new strategy: multi-person memory settings
on individual key fobs that get used only if a driver borrows another person’s set of keys.
At the same time, Mercedes is adopting a “zero error” policy that strives to make the
reliability of electronic features at least equal to that of comparable mechanical systems
for both safety and non-safety functions. Standardized software tools will be used whenever
possible, and suppliers will be required to test and certify all software—including
how individual components interact with other systems.
To help suppliers improve quality, Mercedes promises to provide them with more
precise specifications—and stick to them throughout the development process—that
detail functionality and durability in measurable terms. Semiconductors will be sourced
from fewer suppliers, which Wolfsried says will allow Mercedes engineers to work more
closely with each one to meet tight specifications such as those for temperature and
vibration-resistance.
Mercedes also has asked its semiconductor suppliers not to add new functions or
continually reduce component size during a vehicle’s life cycle. It says it would rather use
the same system throughout the life of a vehicle than have to re-integrate and retest
slightly upgraded units every few years.
In coming years, the automaker expects to revert from plastic fibers to copper for the
MOST (Media Oriented Systems Transport) communications bus to minimize dispersion
losses that can occur when plastic units are bent into tight spaces. But it plans to switch
from conventional CDs and DVDs to emerging HD, Smart Media and PCMCIA cards for
future telematic and multimedia applications other than music systems, due to the
temperature sensitivities of CDs/DVDs.
JUNE 2, 2004

F I N A L L Y !
 

It's about time!

I thought my '92 201 was the last Benz I would ever own. I just couldn't see myself buying one of their newer cars. They're loaded with unnecessarily complex "gizmos" that serve no real function.

They added these "features" in the name of convenience. Do you know what I consider convenient? Having a car that runs properly! Do I really need my car to be able to differentiate between my key and my wife's key so that I don't have to push a button to adjust a seat, or move a lever to adjust a mirror? C'mon... how lazy do you think I am?

American car companies have relied for years on cup holders, nonsensical "trip computers", and puffy cheap velour to sell their second-rate cars to the mindless masses. Mercedes used to be above that. Hopefully they're getting back to their roots.

Jeff Pierce

The fact that 600 features could be removed shows how rediculous MB has gotten in pandering to the gizmo-hungry first time buyers!!!

What's sad is the statement "Lexus has more electronics and is more reliable at the same time".

I find it insulting and ironic that MB thinks I'm so lazy that I need to push a button for something I can reach and use a lever, yet thinks I don't mind bringing in and paying for repair of these convenience items. Where's the "convenience"?

"Zero error policy"..."improve funtion"..."improve durability"..."improve reliability" --- it's all palaver. We hear it from manufacturers all the time.

It's all too little too late for my wallet. Kind of reminds me a certain space vehicle program. "We've learned from our mistakes and intend to not make any more mistakes in the future." Well, if the company is built in such a way as to allow the mistakes in the first place, how do we trust the formulation of the fix?

'82 300D turbo..... 'nuff said.

Cheers,
Wes

I'm with Kestas on this. I'm sure that many people who know me would take issue with this, but I really am indeed smart enough to turn the knob colder when I get hot and turn it hotter when I get cold.

I also have enough strength to crank up my own windows and enough driving experience to handle a car that is in a slide without a gyro and computer to do it for me.

When all this stuff is working it's great, but when it's not you are completely at the mercy of the dealer. I am an electrical engineer with many years of electronics, computer hardware and software experience, but without the guarded dealer software tools and other technical information I am at almost a total loss to fix the kind of gizmo gremlins that creep into these cars.

My C240 probably was one of the greatest all around driving cars I ever had. It was quiet, smooth, powerful, handled predictably and mechanically was as solid as any MB or any other car I've ever had.

Back in January I had to jump start it and a few days after that many Gremlins occurred that involved TWO DAYS of actual work by the tech to get it straightened out. Then on the way home from the dealer it flashed a bunch of crazy messages and then seemed to be okay.

Two weeks ago an electric window mechanism broke causing me to haul my family 150 miles on a hot day with the windows down. Then on the way to the dealer I stopped for gas and it didn't want to start. It then out of the blue decided to start and then all sorts of crazy messages flashed starting with Instrument Cluster Failure. Then it flashed a bunch of stuff again before I could get to the dealer.

I got a chance to get rid of it and I dumped it. The thought of paying for two days of technicians work plus who knows what in parts after it goes out of warranty was too much for me.

My 300E is still on the road and up in good shape. It is now my long distance car.

I worked myself to death to pay for that car for it to end like this. Things like this operate like a pendulum. I expect that in 6 or 8 years they will have corrected the mistakes that they are now realizing. Meanwhile I have a great 300E and a Euro 123 car that I expect to put back on the road in due time. I also have a stick shift Vette and the car that I replaced the C240 with (I'll never tell.) It's small, relatively simple and a hoot to drive on short hauls.

I sincerely hope that MB gets their gadget/technology act together.

Have a great day,

Yeah, I work in the 'quality industry' breaking stuff.

We just laugh when executives say things like "zero error".

The old addage is that 3 things are of utmost importance when developing a product:

1) Time to market
2) Quality
3) Content

Then we say, "pick any 2", because one of them is going to have to slip.

If you ask an engineer, they will generally say "Content" is the top thing.

If you ask a marketing executive, they will generally be fixated on "Time to Market" and "Content". Gotta meet those quarterly targets, and match the competition feature for feature. Dealers are going to be demanding the same. Repairs are a profit center, afterall.

If you ask a customer, they will generally say "Quality" is the top thing.

Would consumers really trade bells and whistles for reliability? In the long run, quality does seem to drive sales in a significant way. It's just less tangible and hand-to-mouth than the other 2.

One more note comparing MB's "new" approach to that of Toyota: Toyota makes an exceptionally good car. Where Toyota vehicles shine is in their quality control when it comes to parts -- particularly electrical parts. It is unmatched by ANY carmaker -- at any price. Go find a 20 year old Toyota in a junk yard; hook up a battery to it, and there's an excellent chance all the power windows, locks, interior switches, and motors still work. There's probably a good chance that the engine would start as well. The problem would be that everything else on the car would be completely worn out -- especially the body.

If MB has learned some lessons about electrical systems from Toyota, that could be a VERY good thing.

Jeff Pierce

Remember when the press used to rag Mercedes about the manually adjustable LH outside mirror back in the eighties. Mercedes said that a manual adjustment worked just fine, and they were right. Ironically, the mechanism on mine was alway stiff and it finally broke. It may not have been lubricated properly when assembled.

I found a mirror from a wreck for nothing, removed the adjusting mechanism, cleaned and lubricated it, and installed in in my mirror. It's worked fine ever since.

Back then Mercedes motto was "engineered like no other car in the world", and I think it was a valid claim.

Now they show ads with dragons jumping out of the engine compartment. Who are they trying to sell these cars to? Go figure!

Duke

Does this mean MB is going back to pneumatic and hydraulic systems?

Sixto
95 S420
87 300SDL

I think you reach an age...I'm 40something...where you are just sick and tired of every new gadget you get causing additional headaches and problems you somehow didn't have before. I look at some 20 something people I work with and they have to have "the latest thing"...even if they have no use for it! The only things I see as actually useful recent(post-1985) improvements have been reliable ABS and maybe on star and similar telematic systems, especially if you live in a sparsely populated area or are "senior"...

My grandfather his thinking along these lines, bought what must have been one of the last US passenger cars made without power steering or brakes, a brand new at the time strippo 1975 Maverick!

$1000 GPS ----> an $8.00 atlas, some planning, and some common sense. Map goes out of date - another $8.00 vs $200 for the new CD's...

$400 Dual climate controls ---->conversation and negotiation with everyone else (free)

5000 way Power Seats---->move your butt and a few levers


In the late 1990's(?) Alan Greenspan (about 70(?) at the time) was wondering what a $200 PDA did that a 50 cent pencil, a notebook, and some common sense couldn't do...

One other point: all electronics (automotive and otherwise) is now disposable and essentially unrepairable. The standardized transistors chips of the 70-80 era with numerous second sources that you could actually replace with a $3.00 Radio Shack soldering iron is now replaced with glob technology, ASIC's, and surface mount that essentially cannot be repaired by hand with any tools, even surface mount tools of the 1990's. No one - and I mean, no one - will ever be able to repair the elctronic modules made today 20 years from now, probably not even the original manufacturer. I bring this up because I've looked over the modules in my 86 SL and they actually ARE repairable and can be reverse engineered for the most part. This might make the most expensive and valuable part of a 2004 car the electronics package in 2024, not the engine or transmission.

Here's my 2 cents...

What disappoints me more than the fact that MB launch a sub standard product is their attitude to fixing known problems. There are always issues that crop up in manufacturing; the difference is how they are handled. Anyone at MB could research model weaknesses on this forum, for the W210 there's the clicking seats, window regulators, ac evaporators, cracking dashes, etc. They don't need BS laden management edicts like "zero errors" they need someone to give a damn.

On a recent motoring show they said that a seven year old Lexus LS 400 is more reliable than a brand new BMW 7 series! It isn't just MB who seem to have lost the plot.


I feel better after that!

Peter

My aunt has a C240, and it's been an excellent car, except for, wait for it, some electronic problems. When I compare the W203 and my W202, I am surprised at the increase in "technology" over my car. I USED to think my car too complex...

Some things I like about my "old" (6.5 years and not getting younger) C230...

1. Manual seats (sorry Yanks, we got 'em). They do everything the power seats do, except stop working.

2. Uncluttered engine bay and lots of DIY stuff like belts, brakes, filters, etc.

3. No traction aids at all. (sorry Yanks, we could get 'em without until 1999MY) Geez, half the posts have something to do with ESP and ASR.

4. Old-style wired-in radio. If my OE radio goes south, a very simple job to tie a new system into the OE wiring.

5. Manual day/night mirror. I find the automatic one annoying, always flipping when I don't want it to. one thing I sure don't miss from our W210.

6. Manual wiper controls. I can do it, and I like saving bucks on windscreen replacements.

Some things I DO NOT like...

1. Drive by wire. Okay, the cruise works like a damn with DBW, but that little motor is north of $1K. Sheesh, 100 years and the throttle cable suddenly is no good. Gimme a break.

2. Sensors. To meet OBD-II we have about 100 O2 sensors and the rotten AAM. MB needs to come up with an OBD-II and emissions legal system that is either simpler or cheaper to repair.

3. FSS. Whatever happened to the neat "schedule of maintenance" book? Oh, yeah, it's BACK. Guess they wised up.

4. The 722.6 tranny should have been ironed out BEFORE being put into 1997 and 1998, and some 1999 cars. Cripes. "Adaptive" sounds like "we're not sure what it'll do, it has a mind of it's own." I love having five "cogs" in an automatic, but make it work.

All told, this is good news. Let's hope it works.

I've personally experienced similar down fall of once great outfit.
Everything we did was of the highest standard and quality. After the founders retired/passed away, the coorporation lost it's soul. The "professional" CEOs moved in and things started going down hill. The once inspiring motto "in search of excellence" got canned too! I guess the motto is now "in search of CEO bonus".