How long can diesel sit? - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

jamesNB · #16 02-28-2008, 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OMEGAMAN

they used to pull the compression release and let the pony motor crank the engine over for a while before letting it start.

Years ago, I had an old outboard boat motor from the early fifties. When you were starting it, it had a compression release valve that would release some of the pressure until it got going. I was a teenager back then and I remember thinking, wow, cool design.

2.5Turbo · #17 02-28-2008, 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamesNB

Years ago, I had an old outboard boat motor from the early fifties. When you were starting it, it had a compression release valve that would release some of the pressure until it got going. I was a teenager back then and I remember thinking, wow, cool design.

You know, I wish my Honda outboard had something like that. I know the newer ones do, but this ours is like a '94 or something. It's a 4-stroke 25hp 3-cylinder pull starter. Half the people I know can't start the darn thing cold

. However, I can start the backup motor, the Mercury 2-stroke 25hp 2-cylinder pull starter, with one arm...

t walgamuth · #18 02-28-2008, 04:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colorado220

Thanks, is there a way to test for alge? or just pump some out and look?

I guess you didn't read my long post. Cloudy.

Tom W

t walgamuth · #19 02-28-2008, 04:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamesNB

I'd drain the fuel out of the tank. The main concern you have now is getting the car started. I'd recommend changing all the fluids (fuel, oil, trans fluid, diff oil, coolant ect).
Also, when a gas engine has set for a while, it's a good idea the pull the plugs and squirt some Marvel Mystery Oil or transmission fluid into the cylinders to make sure the pistons are free. I don't know if that is recommended for Diesel engines. Maybe someone else can chime in.

I would definately not dump the fuel without checking it for bacteria. It is a smelly messy job and what do you do with the fuel after you drain it? It is much more likely to be good than bad, IMHO.

Even it it does have bacteria, you can treat it with biocide and run it. After a treatment the dead bacteria will flow through the filter and burn off.

About the only reason to drain a tank imho is if you are changing the tank (a very unlikely thing).

Tom W

jamesNB · #20 02-29-2008, 12:42 AM

I still say drain the tank. That will eliminate bad fuel as a variable and also get any gunk out of the tank. If the fuel is bad you'll end up chasing your tail trying to get it started and running smoothly. If there is water in the fuel you'll be able to see it settle out in the bottom of the container. I had a Mazda (back when they were good and made in Japan) and the owners manual recommended draining the fuel tank once a year. Of course I'd run it down to Empty before draining it. It was easy because it had a plug in the bottom like the oil pan.
Drain it and save yourself some headaches.
As for disposal you can:
1. Filter it and add it back to the tank a couple of gallons at a time once it's running fine.
2. Use it for cleaning parts.
3. An oil disposal place should take it.

t walgamuth · #21 02-29-2008, 07:04 AM

the advice you got for your gasser mazda is not good advice for a diesel.

Diesel hardly ever goes bad. If it is contaminated with bacteria a treatment with biocide will kill it and render the dead carcasses harmless.

Even if you do drain out water and bacteria contaminated fuel you will still need to treat the tank with biocide to kill the residue that will not drain out easily.

You are not being helpful in stubbornly continue to recommend this useless action.

Tom W

jamesNB · #22 03-01-2008, 02:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

the advice you got for your gasser mazda is not good advice for a diesel.

Diesel hardly ever goes bad. If it is contaminated with bacteria a treatment with biocide will kill it and render the dead carcasses harmless.

Even if you do drain out water and bacteria contaminated fuel you will still need to treat the tank with biocide to kill the residue that will not drain out easily.

You are not being helpful in stubbornly continue to recommend this useless action.

Tom W

Stubborn? Yes. Bad advice? I doubt it.
Twelve years is a long time to let anything sit. I don't care if it's gasoline, Diesel Fuel, or asphalt. Drain all the fluids, including the fuel. Eliminate it as a variable. What is it going to hurt?
Surely you know bacteria and algae aren't the same creatures? Nonetheless, if there is or was crap growing in the tank, dead or alive, it will clog the filters. If there were organisms growing in it, surely you realize that has changed the composition of the fuel?
Even if there's no sediment, rust, crust, gunk or water and the fuel is crystal clean, what was put in it last? DF1? DF2? Who knows? It can make a difference.
Drain the tank and clean it. Worst case, it took a couple hours and if it doesn't fire up, you know the fuel's not the problem.
I can't believe you think draining the fuel is "useless". I believe it is common sense.

t walgamuth · #23 03-01-2008, 05:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamesNB

Stubborn? Yes. Bad advice? I doubt it.
Twelve years is a long time to let anything sit. I don't care if it's gasoline, Diesel Fuel, or asphalt. Drain all the fluids, including the fuel. Eliminate it as a variable. What is it going to hurt?
Surely you know bacteria and algae aren't the same creatures? Nonetheless, if there is or was crap growing in the tank, dead or alive, it will clog the filters. If there were organisms growing in it, surely you realize that has changed the composition of the fuel?
Even if there's no sediment, rust, crust, gunk or water and the fuel is crystal clean, what was put in it last? DF1? DF2? Who knows? It can make a difference.
Drain the tank and clean it. Worst case, it took a couple hours and if it doesn't fire up, you know the fuel's not the problem.
I can't believe you think draining the fuel is "useless". I believe it is common sense.

Do you even own a diesel?

Tom W

babymog · #24 03-01-2008, 10:26 AM

The bacteria "algae' that grows in the diesel tank is in the boundry layer between the fuel and the water. Doesn't change the fuel.

Diesel fuel will oxydize, it does change the fuel, but it is still combustible in a diesel engine. Will it yield full rated BTU? No. It will probably burn less efficiently so you'll have less mileage and power, probably not noticable. It will not do any damage to the engine.

You can pump a little fuel from the bottom of the tank (or siphon) to see if there's water in it, let it settle for a while in a clear container and you'll see it if it's there.

If it doesn't have water in it, don't worry about it. Filters are important though, I recommend carrying a filter or two until you're sure it won't be fouling filters.

RUN-EM · #25 03-01-2008, 10:41 AM

After all, it already has a few million years of aging start on it. "New" purchase of SDL had 10 year old diesel in it. Added lucas fuel injection cleaner to it and fired right up. Smoked and clattered a bit but cleared up after driving a while.

Regards

Run-Em

jamesNB · #26 03-01-2008, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

Do you even own a diesel?

Tom W

Of course.
Moreover, I did petroleum research for a number of years, including Diesel fuel, gasoline, fuel additives.
It has taken me a long time to learn this but if you are starting something; do it right. If something is worth doing, it is worth doing right.
I'm not saying the fuel won't burn; I'm saying change the fuel and clean the tank.

t walgamuth · #27 03-01-2008, 01:07 PM

That would be fine if you had a good place to dispose of it. Personally I have not had any luck with finding a legal environmentally responsible place and method to dispose of the fuel.

Where did you do this research?

Tom W

babymog · #28 03-01-2008, 04:21 PM

I had 265gallons pumped out of one of my motorhomes, bad algae problem, the truck service place pumped it into empty 55gallon containers and used it for heat.

jamesNB · #29 03-01-2008, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamesNB

As for disposal you can:
1. Filter it and add it back to the tank a couple of gallons at a time once it's running fine.
2. Use it for cleaning parts.
3. An oil disposal place should take it.

Any place that takes old paint should take fuel. Ultimately, it's burned in cement kilns, or used to boil water to turn turbines. The tough stuff to get rid of are the chlorinated hydrocarbons like chlroform, methylene chloride and pesticides.
I was a chemist at a private lab that had contracts with oil companies, engine manufacturers and engine component manufacturers, and the Federal Government.
Later I went into clinical chemistry and then organic chemistry. About 8 years ago I made a radical career change. Now chemistry is just a hobby. (extracting essential oils from plants, making environmentally friendly pesticides and wood preservatives, making soap and a couple other Skunkworks Projects and keeping up with current research).

kerry · #30 03-01-2008, 06:38 PM

I say burn it. What's it going to do in the worst case scenario? Plug up some filters.
If I recall correctly, that Volvo engine has problems delivering enough oil to the head.