Millenium auto group in NJ says go to hell? - Page 14 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

A264172 · #**196** 04-11-2007, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Doe

Not proven well or otherwise--is the guy a customer? And I don't mean has he ever bought some valve stem caps at the parts counter, either.

Oh, you mean cu$tomer...

I have a client that calls me names I can't write on this forum.
So I treat him the same way. I get along with him better than 99% of my other clients, so it could be this guy just has a different level of 'communication'...

Anyway it's a Milenium customer service problem. The chances of anybody getting fired are next to nil. They are most likley forgetting about you guys the second they hang up the phone and hoping you forget to call back. More than a 50% chance whatever they tell you they will do is a lie.

Jim B. · #**197** 04-11-2007, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Doe

Not proven well or otherwise--is the guy a customer? And I don't mean has he ever bought some valve stem caps at the parts counter, either.

Not proven well or otherwise, well gee, John, what DOES it take to prove it for you? You listened to DarkOne's tape recording of the obscenity laden rant, what more possible proof do you need? You're familiar with legal scenarios, so you'd know that even in a CRIMINAL proceeding it's BEYOND a reasonable doubt, and even by this standard, listening to a tape like that would convict on that standard. (99% to 1%)

For a civil action, the burden of proof is "preponderance of the evidence" (51% to 49%, or "more likely than not").

I'm very sure MBCA's legal department is aware of those standards, and suspect the finance and public relations departments have a much lower bar to take into account before doing anything.

I hope Alon, (ASHMAN) weighs in again, he is going through service advisor training now in Chicago. He has a pretty good idea of the importance of customer relations, how to treat a customer. His last post on this matter was to the effect that ALLL customers should be treated equally and with respect. Not a terribly difficult concept to grasp.

The mistake made by the Sales manager is taking the risk to abuse what he THOUGHT was a worthless valve cap buying, coffee and donut seeking customer, and not a 2007 CLS AMG buying customer.

How on earth did he know that DarkOne COULDN'T ALSO by 5 new cars for cash?

I have spoken to personally and read about MANY customers who didn't buy a certain MAKE of vehicle because of bad treatment by the DEALER sales force. Bought a different MAKE of car because of it. Not logical maybe, but it happens a lot.

Attitude of dealer personnel, be it in the parts department, whether for valve stems or a crate motor, the service department, whether for an oil change or a major engine rebuild, or in the sales department, whether for a C230 coupe or a Maybach 62, counts for a lot. Bad service and they can walk. Many will.

Jim B. · #**198** 04-11-2007, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Doe

Talk about timing, eh Jim

Yeah, it made me laugh too!!!

SwampYankee · #**199** 04-11-2007, 03:01 PM

It's Jersey, doesn't everyone talk like that?

Jim B. · #**200** 04-11-2007, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Doe

I am not the cheerleader that a lot of you guys are for MB, but love the cars and intend on owning them for the forseeable future--but this thread is ridiculous. Someone calls up wanting coffee and donuts for a parking lot get together and the sales manager calls him a jerk. Big deal. The sales manager sounds like a jerk and shouldn't have done this, but he probably gets tired of tire kickers and people who will never in their lifetimes buy a new car (which is how Mb stays in business, btw) or get work done at a dealership BEFORE threatening to take his business elsewhere. Hollow extortion threats piss me off too.

I agree the guy was a jerk. I think it is silly that a bunch of adults are harrassing the dealership on the phone--let the owner know what happened and if the owner wants to fire him, so be it. This makes mercedesshop look worse than the dealership, in my opinion. As it has been said here before--the guy just doesn't speak for all of us.

Yes this whole thing is ridiculous, but who started it? Assuming DarkOne's request was reasonably framed, (which he assures us it was), the Dealer's sales manager's response was ridiculous, and far worse, by any reasonable measure.

Therefore the gloves were off, and DarkOne's mention of this on the forum elicited responses from its members, which was reasonable, and the chips, in the form of responses, fell where they might.

Yes it might go unpunished this time, but a group like this is within its rights to support or respond to an incident of this type.

Any high line car dealer that through its personnel regards every customer as a "tire kicker", "mooch", or "$5 valve stem parts buyer" risks alienating its customers.

What you call telephone harrassment, others may call a phone campaign, in support of the wronged customer, so it depends on your point of view.

And I don't understand the relevance of how Mercedesshop "looks" except to its sponsors, Phil and Fastlane, and to its moderators. Mercedesshop forums are for the enlightenment, entertainment and education of its participants.

The Millenimum dealer, OTOH is a for-profit making private business enterprise, and how it "looks" to MBUSA, and to prospective paying customers, as well as tire kickers, is significant to its financial prosperity.

cscmc1 · #**201** 04-11-2007, 03:16 PM

While I wouldn't have sought revenge in the same was as many in this thread have, I DID write to MBUSA regarding the matter:

"I am a Mercedes owner, and a lover of the marque -- particularly the W123 chassis diesels. I am also a regular reader of various Mercedes online technical forums, and was disappointed to read of another forum member's experiences with Millenium Auto Group (of Bridgewater, NJ) while trying to organize a joint get together for MBUSA, BenzWorld, and Mercedesshop members. After said member left numerous messages at the dealer regarding potential publicity at and support of the get together, the "Sales Manager" of Millenium left an obscene voicemail message for the member noted.

I wonder what, if anything, MBUSA will about the situation. I am certain that MBUSA is aware of the situation, as the forum member I mentioned has brought it to your attention, as others may have. I certainly hope this is not considered acceptable behavior by MBUSA, as it is an absolute embarrassment to the Mercedes Benz name.

I would consider test-driving one of the new BlueTec diesels (as stated -- I'm a diesel fan!), but would be hard-pressed to seriously consider buying one if this behavior by Millenium is left to stand.

Thank you for your time. I look forward to hearing your plans to resolve this matter."

We'll see what, if any, their response is. What a shame... the Mercedes marque is (was?) something special. I hope MBUSA sees fit to preserve it and makes amends in some way.

I won't be buying a BlueTec anytime soon -- I'm what you'd call a Schlitz-budget car buyer -- but the day will come when my ship comes in, and something like a certified BlueTec might be a serious consideration. I'd like to think that MB is still "world class" and will rightly take this transgression seriously. We'll see!

John Doe · #**202** 04-11-2007, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim B.

Not proven well or otherwise, well gee, John, what DOES it take to prove it for you? You listened to DarkOne's tape recording of the obscenity laden rant, what more possible proof do you need? You're familiar with legal scenarios, so you'd know that even in a CRIMINAL proceeding it's BEYOND a reasonable doubt, and even by this standard, listening to a tape like that would convict on that standard. (99% to 1%)

For a civil action, the burden of proof is "preponderance of the evidence" (51% to 49%, or "more likely than not").
.

You are close to getting personal here, but you said this is an egregious example of how the guy treats customers and it was well proven. Show me where it has been proven the caller was a customer of Millineum Dealership, Counselor. Or have you been to the dealership and observed how he treats actual customers?

John Doe · #**203** 04-11-2007, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A264172

Oh, you mean cu$tomer...

I have a client that calls me names I can't write on this forum.
So I treat him the same way. I get along with him better than 99% of my other clients, so it could be this guy just has a different level of 'communication'...

Anyway it's a Milenium customer service problem. The chances of anybody getting fired are next to nil. They are most likley forgetting about you guys the second they hang up the phone and hoping you forget to call back. More than a 50% chance whatever they tell you they will do is a lie.

A reasonable man weighs in. Thanks.

John Doe · #**204** 04-11-2007, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim B.

Yes this whole thing is ridiculous, but who started it? Assuming DarkOne's request was reasonably framed, (which he assures us it was), the Dealer's sales manager's response was ridiculous, and far worse, by any reasonable measure.

Therefore the gloves were off, and DarkOne's mention of this on the forum elicited responses from its members, which was reasonable, and the chips, in the form of responses, fell where they might.

Yes it might go unpunished this time, but a group like this is within its rights to support or respond to an incident of this type.

Any high line car dealer that through its personnel regards every customer as a "tire kicker", "mooch", or "$5 valve stem parts buyer" risks alienating its customers.

What you call telephone harrassment, others may call a phone campaign, in support of the wronged customer, so it depends on your point of view.

And I don't understand the relevance of how Mercedesshop "looks" except to its sponsors, Phil and Fastlane, and to its moderators. Mercedesshop forums are for the enlightenment, entertainment and education of its participants.

The Millenimum dealer, OTOH is a for-profit making private business enterprise, and how it "looks" to MBUSA, and to prospective paying customers, as well as tire kickers, is significant to its financial prosperity.

Unpunished this time? The gloves are off? And the previous, "You want blood, you got blood. Grrrrr." This guy doesn't know who he is messing with, ect......

See Marty's more realistic response.

I don't know why you won't address the part where D1 latently mentioned he said he and his pals weren't going to do business with them anymore because of the failure to respond (or because no party favors--seems the story changes a bit each time).

Take this out of the highly passionate cause of the Mercedes Benz automobile and look at it in the context of your business and maybe you will see my point. Or maybe not--doesn't matter--your opinion carries no more weight than does mine and that is a fact that doesn't require a standard of proof.

Jim B. · #**205** 04-11-2007, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Doe

You are close to getting personal here, but you said this is an egregious example of how the guy treats customers and it was well proven. Show me where it has been proven the caller was a customer of Millineum Dealership, Counselor. Or have you been to the dealership and observed how he treats actual customers?

The caller DarkOne, became a "customer" when he made his request. Not a paying customer at that moment, but it would be like a customer who stopped by the dealer asking for a brochure of the model. How would the Sales personnel know whether the person was a paying customer, a brochure collector, or a serious comparison shopper soon to buy?

No I have not seen the man in action at the dealership, Counselor (Nothing personal btw) But I have HEARD him in action, but not personally SEEN him. Do you assert that vision trumps hearing in judging or assessing human conduct?

DarkOneSK · #**206** 04-11-2007, 03:55 PM

yeah I was a customer. I bought 2 cars from them in the past and used their service department many times when I was sick an unable to work on my own cars. (I was fairly sick for 3 years until recently. Long story)
However, I chose to leave the message that he would lose me as a customer because of his failed response. Not because I didn't get favors, or because they wouldn't want to participate. All I needed was a yes or no. NOT, what I got. and I might add, I waited patiently for 2 whole weeks before I left that message. If he said "no, I'm sorry we can't help you", like many other places I called, I would have moved on. right then, right there. Otherwise, I'd be pissed at all of new Jersey, because so far, I still can't get what I need. What I did get back from him was uncalled for.

In all honesty though, the service and parts departments always treated me with respect.
Him being the General manager though, leaves the whole dealership with a bad taste in my mouth, so, indeed they have lost my business.

John Doe · #**207** 04-11-2007, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim B.

The caller DarkOne, became a "customer" when he made his request.

No he didn't, but DarkOne answered the question that you assumed the answer to.

Jim B. · #**208** 04-11-2007, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Doe

Unpunished this time? The gloves are off? And the previous, "You want blood, you got blood. Grrrrr." This guy doesn't know who he is messing with, ect......

See Marty's more realistic response.

I don't know why you won't address the part where D1 latently mentioned he said he and his pals weren't going to do business with them anymore because of the failure to respond (or because no party favors--seems the story changes a bit each time).

Take this out of the highly passionate cause of the Mercedes Benz automobile and look at it in the context of your business and maybe you will see my point. Or maybe not--doesn't matter--your opinion carries no more weight than does mine and that is a fact that doesn't require a standard of proof.

I have the impression that DarkOne was annoyedwhen his calls were ignored, (Assuming they were polite and not an unreasonable amount) and got very angry when he got cursed out on his answering machine. Human nature being what it is, that might make someone mad. Remember, DarkOne did nothing to merit that kind of response. Nothing to do with being a paying customer, a future paying customer, considering it asking for party favors (which seems like an unfair characterization of the call, at least to me)

The passion here arose from human nature when someone perceived verbal abuse IMO. The
results, as seen here, simply followed.

John Doe · #**209** 04-11-2007, 04:01 PM

DarkOne--instead of going for the 'brass ring' as far as sponsors or whatever, what about possibly more willing auto insurance companies, car wash chains or folks like that? I am unclear as to whether you just want some corporate presence or for MB to participate. Just a suggestion.

DarkOneSK · #**210** 04-11-2007, 04:04 PM

Oh I have others lined up. I have Kartronics, (an auto, audio company coming), some local non sanctioned mercedes shops coming, a body shop, and an interior guy. I still would like to have some flags and such though. I guess I'll just have to buy em.