Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

He really doesn't have the foreign policy finesse that Obama has on this, but I think Obama's hand is being forced by the election, ie he can't do anything controversial, so it may be a case of even a broken clock being correct twice a day...Anyway the best thing to do here is nothing, and let Turkey shoot it out. They won't attack Turkey in any meaningful way so our NATO obligations won't be triggered.

I should be president; but I won't do the job for $480k a year or whatever they are paid. To much BS for that kind of money, throw on a few zeroes...

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

So we went from talking about Syria to Afghanistan? Topic, stay on topic.

Actually retreating is a very good tactical strategy. Manstein used it as a flexible mobile defense to limited affect because he was bound by the higher command. But its a great way for an inferior but highly trained and mobile force to bleed a larger attacking force white if used properly.

A good modern example would be the Iraq war. The Iraq military if it was more sophisticated had the perfect terrain to employ Manstein's mobile and elastic defense strategy, but they were incompetent so they couldn't. It would have been even more affective because of the modern American public's intolerance for battlefield loses and set backs. They also lacked air superiority because their air force was poorly trained and equipped so there ability to properly supply and fight a proper desert war even if there army was up to the task went up in smoke in the first 24 hours.

The initial invasion of Iraq is an interesting case study and was watched closely by China and NK as well. For example the Iraqi army would not have needed to prevent us from reaching Baghdad, they realistically couldn't expect to anyway. But if they fought a couple of decisive battles in the desert and were able to encircle and wipe out an armored core or more, the American public might have forced the plug to be pulled on it. They could have lured an armored spearhead in with a mobile defense line, than when it had penetrated maybe 100 miles, slammed the back door shut with a pincer thrust, ie classic Manstein. The best part about such a strategy is you just have to react to your enemy, instead of having to guess as the attacker does.

I strongly suspect if we ever invaded NK such tactics would be employed.

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Actually retreating is a very good tactical strategy. Manstein used it as a flexible mobile defense to limited affect because he was bound by the higher command. But its a great way for an inferior but highly trained and mobile force to bleed a larger attacking force white if used properly.

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

AFAIK he is still following the schedule for withdraw that was set down back when we invaded Afghanistan. I blame the government over the last 10 years for being stupid enough to feed that time table to the media.

Originally Posted by engatwork

Isn't that the one the Russians used when they left Afganistan?

Originally Posted by Air&Road

It sure is, and it was a good strategy for them. The difference between the Russians and our current administration, however, is that the Russians had enough since to NOT announce their exit date ahead of time.

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

He really doesn't have the foreign policy finesse that Obama has on this, but I think Obama's hand is being forced by the election, ie he can't do anything controversial, so it may be a case of even a broken clock being correct twice a day...Anyway the best thing to do here is nothing, and let Turkey shoot it out. They won't attack Turkey in any meaningful way so our NATO obligations won't be triggered.

I should be president; but I won't do the job for $480k a year or whatever they are paid. To much BS for that kind of money, throw on a few zeroes...

Originally Posted by pj67coll

That's true. But he had the opportunity to do two things. One, become a leader and listen to his generals and do what they suggested. Two, change a stupid policy of kow-towing to an ignorant public back home and advertising our run away date to the enemy and at the very least imply and hint that we'll be staying and ramping things up.

Ignoring your generals and basing your foreign policy on the fatuous intellectual fashions of Berkely and Harvard is not finesse, it's incompetence and the result is the guaranteed waste of the lives of all who have been lost in Afghanistan when the place is handed back to a bunch of intellectual retards who will go about plunging it back into the dark ages and festering more groups like AQ. So that either O or R or whomever down the line will be stuck with having to go back in there again an finally trying to do it right.

As for Syria. There are obviously plenty of groups their trying desperately to get rid of the Assad regime. Islamonutjobs amongst them will doubtless be hostile to the US. But the one thing they all know is that the Obama administration is one they cant count on for diddly.

- Peter.

Originally Posted by Botnst

Vote for the Big Hatt!

(I think your analysis is pretty much on target)

Originally Posted by pj67coll

That's true. But he had the opportunity to do two things. One, become a leader and listen to his generals and do what they suggested. Two, change a stupid policy of kow-towing to an ignorant public back home and advertising our run away date to the enemy and at the very least imply and hint that we'll be staying and ramping things up.

Ignoring your generals and basing your foreign policy on the fatuous intellectual fashions of Berkely and Harvard is not finesse, it's incompetence and the result is the guaranteed waste of the lives of all who have been lost in Afghanistan when the place is handed back to a bunch of intellectual retards who will go about plunging it back into the dark ages and festering more groups like AQ. So that either O or R or whomever down the line will be stuck with having to go back in there again an finally trying to do it right.

As for Syria. There are obviously plenty of groups their trying desperately to get rid of the Assad regime. Islamonutjobs amongst them will doubtless be hostile to the US. But the one thing they all know is that the Obama administration is one they cant count on for diddly.

- Peter.

Originally Posted by Botnst

I had thought nobody could use the word, "fatuous" with the alacrity of Chris Hitchens, but I think you're on the right track. Nice turn of phrase!

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Couldn't agree more talking about Afghanistan, but this thread was about Syria.

My personal view on that war is that we long missed our opportunity to do it right, time to cut and run before it costs us to much more blood and treasure.

War like everything else has a timeline and tempo, once your past it, its over pack up and go home.

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Its amazing how quickly you can cut threw a situation when viewed without political blinders.