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  #736  
Old 07-21-2013, 04:23 PM
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Do ya'll think that the US would be much different if we had had all Chinese slaves versus the slaves from Africa?

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  #737  
Old 07-21-2013, 04:26 PM
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Originally Posted by engatwork View Post
Do ya'll think that the US would be much different if we had had all Chinese slaves versus the slaves from Africa?
No, just other nations would have gotten rich out of it and we would be talking about Chinese on Chinese violence now.
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  #738  
Old 07-21-2013, 04:26 PM
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Originally Posted by cmac2012 View Post
Good points but this is also a good argument for why GZ deserved some legal sanction. He did not have training or much experience that I've heard about that qualified him to identify and pursue a suspect while armed. AFAIK, there is no evidence that indicates he followed police dispatch instructions to stop following.
Then there is no role for Neighborhood Watch, because they have virtually no training and little experience.
  #739  
Old 07-21-2013, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by t walgamuth View Post
I believe that in some European countries black Africans are not discriminated against. perhaps someone has direct experience in this matter.
From what I have read that was so in France during WWI. The French treaded them as Equals.

However, General Pershing gave instructions (that were not followed by the French) that the were not to treat the Black Soldiers like that because the "needed to know their place" when they got Home.

However, it seems all European Countries; including France did not threat the Native Peoples in the Colonies as Equals (hence the Revolution in America).
So you have a in France where a Black Man had a good chance of be treated as an Equal till He returned to His respective oppressive Colony.

I think the English treated Blacks and Indian differently so I would say they were Racists at one time. More so in their Colonies.
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  #740  
Old 07-21-2013, 04:29 PM
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For those who think slavery was only beneficial to the southern slaves states up to 1861, I have an opportunity for investment in a bridge project for you.
  #741  
Old 07-21-2013, 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by engatwork View Post
Do ya'll think that the US would be much different if we had had all Chinese slaves versus the slaves from Africa?
Yes.
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  #742  
Old 07-21-2013, 04:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Botnst View Post
For those who think slavery was only beneficial to the southern slaves states up to 1861, I have an opportunity for investment in a bridge project for you.
Slavery didn't start in the South.
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  #743  
Old 07-21-2013, 04:43 PM
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Hell, slavery was a common condition of man everywhere until the Renaissance. When it became less cost effective that estate of man dwindled. It got a big boost from agriculture in the new world because agriculture was still mostly a manual labor occupation. In North America slavery was under economic assault by industrial agriculture. Horse-drawn steel harrows and plows were cheaper than slaves. It was only a matter of time.

The only reason slavery is still feasible in the Arab world is that the wealth differential between the Persian Gulf countries and other countries, particularly on the Horn of Africa, are so dramatic. Where life is cheap, slavery is a viable alternative to misery, starvation, and death.
  #744  
Old 07-21-2013, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Jorn View Post
Slavery didn't start in the South.
Please tell me how slavery benefitted my farmer ancestors here in Indiana.
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  #745  
Old 07-21-2013, 04:52 PM
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Then there is no role for Neighborhood Watch, because they have virtually no training and little experience.
Z did not follow His Neighborhood Watch Instructions to "observe and report" and He did not follow the 911 Operator Instructions.

If the Neighborhood watch follows instructions it would not be useless.

No matter how well trained a group of People is there is always a percentage of them that screws things up.

What I think is missing is that no one with a Job to Observe and Report should be allowed to carry a Gun. The Neighbor Hood Watch should not have allowed that.

Another Member suggested Pepper Spay as an alternative; I think that is reasonable.

This is a little off subject.
If training becomes so intensive it becomes reactionary you end up with a situation like where the Marines who were trained to throw a Grenade through a doorway and get out of the Door Way with the Backs against the Wall to avoid getting injured did the same thing to Huts in Vietnam and got back sides peppered with Fragments because a Hut wall is flimsy.

So it is hard to know how much training is enough and how much training is going to take hold in the Individual.
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  #746  
Old 07-21-2013, 05:03 PM
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Originally Posted by t walgamuth View Post
Please tell me how slavery benefitted my farmer ancestors here in Indiana.
Maybe not directly and depending how far they go back, slavery was common in Indiana before 1800.
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  #747  
Old 07-21-2013, 05:04 PM
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Did farmers use the RR Tom? Didn't Chinese slaves build the RR to the west.
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  #748  
Old 07-21-2013, 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by engatwork View Post
Did farmers use the RR Tom? Didn't Chinese slaves build the RR to the west.
And they lived in underground cities to protect them selfs. Many were exploited by Chinese that came before them. Little China in most cities have become tourists destinations these day but were nothing else then ghetto's in the old days.
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  #749  
Old 07-21-2013, 05:25 PM
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I think that's right.

I believe that stand-your-ground is a dangerous departure from centuries of tradition and law, but we probably don't want to make important public policy decisions based on the way these two knuckleheads handled themselves in this one unfortunate incident.
OK, lets look at SYG. That is a separate issue than this particular case, and I think you understand that.
OTOH, if there is no SYG, then is the victim of an assault legally required to show he tried to flee? Are we legislating to blame the victim?
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  #750  
Old 07-21-2013, 05:56 PM
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As I understand the typical law is that the victor (in this case zimmerman) would had to prove he did all possible to avoid the confrontation and resorted to self defense as a last resort. I believe it is assume that the "victim" would have tried to flee because jot many people want to get their as kicked or murdered.

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