New MB, New Project... Let the fun begin - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Gilly · #16 08-19-2010, 01:32 PM

The red one is for the top, both the hard top and soft top. If you study it, it sort of looks like the shape of the hard top. Pulling "back" on it removes the hard top (pops it so it is ready to be lifted off) and if the hard top is off, this is what lowers the soft top. Pushing down on the forward edge is what latches down the hard top or raises the soft top.
The roll bar switch is in the picture as well, on the right side above the ash tray door.
Gilly

Gilly · #17 08-19-2010, 01:33 PM

On the mirror switch, you are just missing the knob, i may have one I think.
Gilly

Gilly · #18 08-19-2010, 01:36 PM

On the rear view mirror, you said you are missing the front frame for the mirror, the part that snaps on the rear part?

96C220 · #19 08-19-2010, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gilly

On the rear view mirror, you said you are missing the front frame for the mirror, the part that snaps on the rear part?

Yeah, that's what I'm missing. Looks like some of the tabs on the back half are toast too, but nothing one couldn't glue back together. If you can find one that would be great, color is irrelevant, I can always spray it black.

As far as the buttons I guess I should have done a little RTM.. I assumed that the roll bar button was the top actuation button, just by the graphics it had on it. Oops.

Thanks in advance,

George

cth350 · #20 08-19-2010, 08:22 PM

For wood refinishing, you can try and do it yourself, but it's easier to get a replacement. There's a lot of time involved and the level of cleanliness, accuracy and source of materals to get the right finish is tough. It is many layers of polyester.

If you can't find a replacement piece easily enough, get it refinished by a car wood guy. If you're an MBCA member, look in the Star. I always mention my friend Drew at Heritage Woodwork down in NC as both a personal and professional (and thus biased) recommendation.

-CTH

96C220 · #21 08-19-2010, 08:28 PM

Okay,

So me and a buddy got the hard top off with no issues. It unlatched perfectly fine.

Then I go to put the soft top up. The cover opens, the tops starts to come up, and stops with the roof exactly perpandicular to the body. You hear a mechanical click when the roof stops... It will go back down and tuck under the cover fine... But wont get past the 1/2 way point....

The rollbar operates perfectly fine up and down.

Time to do some searching on that.

George

Gilly · #22 08-19-2010, 08:40 PM

A common show-stopper are the side windows. On the early 129s, there is a switch inside the door that closes when the windows are both all the way down. The windows I believe should be rolling themselves down when the top is raising. If they are not, they may be out of synchronization. But you can simply make sure they are all the way down and the top should go past that 1/2 way point. I have seen this a lot.
Are you going to be driving the car this winter?
Gilly

96C220 · #23 08-19-2010, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gilly

A common show-stopper are the side windows. On the early 129s, there is a switch inside the door that closes when the windows are both all the way down. The windows I believe should be rolling themselves down when the top is raising. If they are not, they may be out of synchronization. But you can simply make sure they are all the way down and the top should go past that 1/2 way point. I have seen this a lot.
Are you going to be driving the car this winter?
Gilly

I found the soft top diagnostic pdf and it mentions the two window limit switches preventing the top from going past 90 degrees. I know this car had both power window regulators recently done... Any idea where the soft top controller is? Pin outs for the window limit switches? (can we emulate the windows down to test if it's the switches?)

Also how do I "Synchronize" the windows??

The car rolls down the windows all the way, and drops the roll bar, the top comes up , but it doesnt go past 90 degrees.

No I'm probably not going to drive it much in the winter, but I'd still like the soft top to work for parking and other purposes.

Thanks in advance,

George

96C220 · #24 08-19-2010, 09:59 PM

So I did some research and found the diagnostic code readout procedure for the convertible top... Shorted pins 1 and 10 on the diagnostic connector and counted the flashes of the convertible top switch.

The top refuses to come up, and stops at 1/2 way because of the following code:

18.= Right window failed to lower (limit switch open).

So the car still thinks the right window is up. Is there a way to get to this wire and short it to ground either at the harness coming out of the door or at the top controller? Just to confirm that that is the problem before I go tearing into the door?

Thanks in advance

George

Gilly · #25 08-20-2010, 04:44 AM

Never done it that way, not sure if I'd recommend it. Just learn how to get the door panel off, it's pretty fascinating. once you master it, it'll be a 10 minute job, if that.
The switch is in the bottom of the door, there is a metal piece that presses down on the switch, I am sure they just forgot to adjust the metal piece, happens all the time.
Gilly

96C220 · #26 08-20-2010, 09:39 AM

So I did some searching, and these are the best door panel removal instructions I could find, I just wanted to run them by you and see if you agreed, and ask if you had any tips or tricks to add:

Door Panel Removal:

1. Remove the small piece of wood trim above your seat controls.

2. Remove the phillips head screw behind that piece and pull off that
metal piece it was holding that is hooked at the end by the door lock
switch.

3. Pull out the door lock switch

4. Pop out the seat switch piece of wood and disconnect the harness

5. Open your map pocket. You will see a small piece of plastic toward
the front with a small screw, remove that and the piece of plastic.

6. Remove the screw recessed deeply in the hole in the rear section of
same map pocket

7. Remove 3 screws holding the chrome plate on the rear top of the door

8. Pop out the door light and disconnect it (2 wire black plug)

9. Take a 10mm socket and remove the bolt from behind that first piece of wood you removed.

10. Get a BIG phillips head screwdriver and remove the large screw behind the little piece of plastic that was in the map pocket

11. Remove the triangular piece of trim parallel to the side rear view
mirror (pop the top section and pull up)

12. Pop the snap connectors along the bottom edge of the door panel.

13. Reach under and disconnect the yellow vacuum line for the door map pocket lock

14. Lift the entire door panel up to remove.

Thanks in advance,

George

96C220 · #27 08-21-2010, 06:17 PM

Tore apart the door, thoroughly tested the switch, and the top still does the same thing.... I'm wondering if it's the other door, or if the controller either isn't getting the signal... or it's bad..

When the window limit switch is closed i.e. the switch thinks the window is down (circuit open) the power windows don't roll down when the close top sequence is initiated. So that leads me to believe that the soft top controller is properly recognizing the window limit switch... Time to tear into the other door after dinner.

George

96C220 · #28 08-21-2010, 08:43 PM

I took the driver door apart, the little bar WASN'T touching the metal switch at the bottom of the door, but the top still acts the same. I wonder if the soft top controller expects an open or closed circuit for the window switch.

I'm at a loss... for now.

One thing that was odd was I couldn't get the drivers side wires to show continuity to ground. The passenger side did. Maybe I'm on to something with that. I'm tempted to try to backprobe the wires at the soft top module to test and see (basically taking the doors out of the equation).

So I figured out how to manually operate the top. One odd thing, I open it to half way, kill the key, pull the top up, get in, press close, the front and back latch electrically.

When I go to open it, the back half unlatches electrically BUT the front has to be manually released using the allen key. The car then requires a key cycle to do these "half electric" convertible top operations again.

At least now I can use the car, and close it up when I park it somewhere or if I get caught in the rain. (phew).

I really don't care about using the power top, I had an old BMW convertible and it's top was completely manual (and never had issues).

George

Gilly · #29 08-21-2010, 09:32 PM

But it's so cool to watch when it's working! Or at least back in the day it was, there is way cooler stuff now I guess.
Sounds like the front latches are either worn out, OR there is still air in the lines.
Usually it's the rear latches that are bastages.
In normal operation, the control unit has no "idea" if the window switches are open or closed. It just needs the signal. If the switch is bad it won't set a fault code. It just knows the signal is not there yet. I think it closes with the windows down. I had an operating schematic somewhere here. Might be a bit of digging.
Gilly

96C220 · #30 08-22-2010, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gilly

But it's so cool to watch when it's working! Or at least back in the day it was, there is way cooler stuff now I guess.
Sounds like the front latches are either worn out, OR there is still air in the lines.
Usually it's the rear latches that are bastages.
In normal operation, the control unit has no "idea" if the window switches are open or closed. It just needs the signal. If the switch is bad it won't set a fault code. It just knows the signal is not there yet. I think it closes with the windows down. I had an operating schematic somewhere here. Might be a bit of digging.
Gilly

Gilly,

I respectfully disagree with you in that the window limit down switches do not play a role in preventing the top from proper operation in the 90-93 cars. I found this document I'm going to attach, and it clearly states that the cause of the top stopping at 90 degrees is the window down limit switches. - Why would the car drop the windows to raise the top if it didn't care about the window position anyway...

Take a quick read here. I have all the wiring diagrams as well.