How Does WVO Affect My 616 Engine? - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

WD8CDH · #1 03-23-2009, 04:57 PM

In general, with properly de-watered and de-contaminated WVO when used with a proper two-tank system, WVO will PROLONG the life of your engine. Cut corners on either and you will cut life from the engine. This is from over 30 years of WVO experience.

cmbdiesel · #2 03-23-2009, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WD8CDH

In general, with properly de-watered and de-contaminated WVO when used with a proper two-tank system, WVO will PROLONG the life of your engine. Cut corners on either and you will cut life from the engine. This is from over 30 years of WVO experience.

Could you post a link to thread(s) that describes the proper de-watering and de-contaminating process? Or bump them to the top?
I envisioned running WVO when I got my 300SD, but just don't want to destroy such a fine vehicle. The parts car I have access to, became a parts car because of poorly treated WVO. (low compression and N/G IP)

LAbioCars.com · #3 03-23-2009, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WD8CDH

In general, with properly de-watered and de-contaminated WVO when used with a proper two-tank system, WVO will PROLONG the life of your engine. Cut corners on either and you will cut life from the engine. This is from over 30 years of WVO experience.

i second that

JEBalles · #4 03-23-2009, 05:29 PM

Alright, negative nancy, so is properly refined WVO still "junky nasty" fuel? And seeing as I don't have a secure income, mineral diesel is still expensive now and it's gonna shoot right back up to 5 bucks a gallon this summer. I also don't fancy to see what little money I have going into the pockets of those damn oil sheiks.

oldsinner111 · #5 03-23-2009, 05:47 PM

I burn it,no problems two years.Compression all in 400s with 305,000 miles.
However 2 tank,heaters,and 70% with diesel added.

moon161 · #6 03-23-2009, 06:26 PM

There's a few well known settling methods out there for removing emulsified water, well defined on the frybrid.com and infopop biodiesel forums. The composition of your feedstock (moderate PHO and up) may commit you to heated methods. Look up these:

The Frybrid Still (Prefilter, heat to 140F in a modified water heater, 4-8 hr settle, decant the lower wet layer, final filter & store). Frybrid admin cgoodwin would be your expert on this.

Heated Upflow Settling- a FIFO queu for yer grease. Prefiltered VO is injected into the bottom of a barrel, dry VO is pushed out the top thru a final filter. The barrel is heated to keep PHO liquid and increase the sedimentation velocity of microscopic water droplets. Mercedesshop / frybrid member WD8CDH would be your expert on this. A picture is worth a thousand words here.

Cold Upflow settling: As above, but at ambient temperature. Fat, PHO, crud and water all settle to the bottom of the barrel. Eventually you end up cleaning this out of the barrel. You need to be picky with your feedstock on this, as PHO drops out and you do not burn it. Frybrid / infopop member John_Galt would be your expert on this. A picture helps with this too.

A uniform or top down stratified temperature distribution is key here. Convection eddies will transport water to the top as the cirulation velocity can exceed the sedimentation velocity.

How do you know it's dry: Hot Pan test.

Biodiesel people also bubble or mist wash.

Bubble wash:Tank with VO on top, water on bottom. Air stone in the bottom, leave it on, VO gets clean and dry.

Mist wash: Tank with VO. Spray mist on it. Crud goes down, water does too.

Your goal: Filter down to 1-5 micron (depends who you ask), dry down to 200-700 PPM (depends who you ask).

mplafleur · #7 03-23-2009, 05:53 PM

I've run three summers primarily 100% filtered to 1 micron WVO. No problems.

ah-kay · #8 03-23-2009, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mplafleur

I've run three summers primarily 100% filtered to 1 micron WVO. No problems.

Cannot agree with you more.

The car runs quieter, environmentally friendly, save money and no degradation on performance. I doubt WVO will cause engine damage.

WD8CDH · #9 03-25-2009, 08:49 AM

A few more data points.

'80 Audi 4000D bought new. Converted to run on LARD before it was 1 year old. Ran it for at least 75K miles with only 2 waste grease filters. Retired due to an accident when someone else was driving it.

'83 ISUZU Pup bought new. Converted to LARD at about 5K miles. Drove it until frame rust made it unsafe to drive. Engine still ran like new when I sold it to someone that put it in a Trooper.

'86 Golf bought in late 80's. Converted to WVO 1 week later. Drove it until the body/ suspension was shot.

'83 Mercedes 240D bought used about 6 years ago. Converted to WVO and sold it about a year later. Current owner still running WVO.

'85 300 Turbo Diesel and '83 300 Turbo Diesel bought used 4-5 years ago and immediately converted. Both had Diesel Purge right after I got them, before conversion with a lot of black crud. Both given Diesel Purge late last year. Hardly any black crud. Both vehicles current daily drivers.

All running waste grease very well de-watered but without removing PHO or fat. In fact, when I started, I had to get my fuel with a shovel even in the hottest part of the summer.

At various times, I either ran most of the vehicles on B100 or ran B100 in the purge tanks, but eventually stopped making biodiesel because it was more time consuming than de-watering and filtering oil.

So far, I have NEVER had to replace a waste oil filter but I have had to replace quite a few diesel filters due to plugging.

ah-kay · #10 03-25-2009, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WD8CDH

All running waste grease very well de-watered but without removing PHO or fat. In fact, when I started, I had to get my fuel with a shovel even in the hottest part of the summer.

It is nice to hear success story like this. This vindicates what I believe all along. WVO/SVO can be used as a fuel. Keep up the good work.

#11 03-25-2009, 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ah-kay

WVO/SVO can be used as a fuel.

Can and should are two completely different things.

CarlG · #12 03-23-2009, 06:35 PM

I've been running wvo in my 616 for about a year now with no major problems. (it did recently eat up the seals in my bosch upgrade primer pump) However, I have invested in an Elsbett conversion kit. Here's the website if you're interested: http://www.elsbett.com/us/online-shop.html

I like to let my oil dry first by gravity. I pick up my oil from an oil drum located in an underground parking garage. I know when the restaurant throws out the oil, so after about a day or so I stop by to pick it up. I use a hand crank rotary pump, and I pump all my oil right off the top. I never go deeper than about 2/3 of the way down the barrel. That way, all the water and all the crap sinks to the bottom, and I'm left with fairly pure oil. Then it goes to my filtration system at home where it is first heated using a water heater element suspended inside an oil drum. If the oil has water in it, you can hear it crackle. I bring my oil up to 250 degrees fahrenheit. If the temperature hovers around 212 degrees fahrenheit (the boiling point of water) for a long time, then you know that the oil has too much water in it.

As for particulate matter, I pressure-filter my oil in a 5 micron whole house water filter. I actually wouldn't really worry about this too much, since whatever particles you don't catch yourself will just get caught by the fuel filters in your car. It's just that whole house filters are much cheaper, much bigger, much longer lasting, and much easier to change than the fuel filters in your car.

Another thing that many say is important is to do a titration test, although I have never attempted this myself.

Whatever you do, it is probably a good idea to check out this website: http://www.journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html
It was an excellent resource for me when I began vegetable oiling.

good luck!

JEBalles · #13 03-23-2009, 08:50 PM

Well, since I don't live in the city, other than the school bus, which I use most of the time as well as my bicycle, public transportation is pretty much out of the question, otherwise I would primarily use that. And I guess what you define as Diesel's first engine is in question here. The engine presented at the Paris Exhibition in 1900 ran wholly on peanut oil. As for the fats and acids and other contaminants, aren't the fats also burnt, and the acids not significant if the oil's dry?

#14 03-23-2009, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JEBalles

The engine presented at the Paris Exhibition in 1900 ran wholly on peanut oil.

No matter what engine you consider his "first", it has no correlation to the engine Mercedes designed for your car.

Quote:

As for the fats and acids and other contaminants, aren't the fats also burnt

Not completely. Thats part of what leads to combustion deposits like this.

Quote:

and the acids not significant if the oil's dry

Acid is acid, its a harmful contaminant that will eat at the fuel system.

pawoSD · #15 03-23-2009, 09:13 PM

I have run (and would if it was cost effective) commercial biodiesel.....I have no issue with that, I just won't run the slimy WVO stuff. Its not worth it. So much work and hassle....it would never pay off. I only drive about 150-200 miles a week in my car tops.....and with diesel at $2....cheap.

Oh, and I highly highly doubt diesel will reach $5 this summer....I doubt it will even reach $3 again for quite a while....demand is way down, there's a huge glut of fuel available....so its nice and cheap.