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#1
03-15-2006, 06:13 PM
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The Jetta Tdi spanks the Prius Hybrid
Read this article on how the Jetta beats the MPG and other things when in competition with the Toyota Prius.
http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2004-06-10-diesel-vs-hybrid_x.htm
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1981 300D 147k 1998 VW Jetta Tdi 320k 2001 Dodge Ram 2500 141k 1979 300D 234k (sold) 1984 300D "Astor" 262k(sold) Mercedes How-To and Repair Pictorials I love the smell of diesel smoke in my hair 
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#2
03-15-2006, 06:25 PM
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He runs the test in opposite directions using different routes.
He runs the Prius in stop and go traffic.......no mention of this for the Jetta. A very well controlled experiment and real good data. 
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#3
03-15-2006, 06:30 PM
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Well how about this for a comparision. Actual mpg on highway for a prius is 35mpg while a jetta VE tdi gets 50mpg highway. Now thats spanking the prius.
also read this from TDIclub.com http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=128393
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Current: 05 E320 CDI 07 GL320 CDI 08 Sprinter 05 Dodge Cummins 01 Dodge Cummins Previous 2004 E55 AMG 2002 C32 AMG (#2) 1995 E300 1978 300D 1987 300D 2002 C32 AMG(blown motor :[ 1981 300SD 1983 300SD 1987 300SDL 2002 Jetta TDI 1996 S420 1995 S500 1993 190E 2.6 1992 190E 2.3 1985 190E 2.3 5-Speed
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#4
03-15-2006, 06:40 PM
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Quote:
Did you adjust the Jetta tdi for "real world" fuel economy or did you simply post the Prius "real world" fuel economy?
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#5
03-15-2006, 06:50 PM
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Ask anyone on the TDIclub their actual REAL WORLD mileage on a VE TDI and they will tell you 50+mpg highway. REAL WORLD driving. We get 50mpgs on the highway in the passat TDI and thats a newer PD TDI!
There is real world proof, my mom's passat tdi that got 50mpg on the highway in REAL WORLD.
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Current: 05 E320 CDI 07 GL320 CDI 08 Sprinter 05 Dodge Cummins 01 Dodge Cummins Previous 2004 E55 AMG 2002 C32 AMG (#2) 1995 E300 1978 300D 1987 300D 2002 C32 AMG(blown motor :[ 1981 300SD 1983 300SD 1987 300SDL 2002 Jetta TDI 1996 S420 1995 S500 1993 190E 2.6 1992 190E 2.3 1985 190E 2.3 5-Speed
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#6
03-15-2006, 06:55 PM
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Quote:
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#8
03-15-2006, 07:00 PM
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50+ any day
Our Passat (may it RIP) got 50 mpg in the combo of highway and city.
When we took it for long highway trips it got 56. Now I don't have any clue about what the hybrids get, but I'd be surprised if they got this. AND the VWs actually have ROOM to get people in them. Ginny in Denver
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#9
03-15-2006, 06:38 PM
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According to the Prius PR people the Prius gets better mileage in stop and go traffic. They even go as far as to recommend not to do rolling stops to save fuel. This flies in the face of thermodynamics, but I can't blame a reporter for not knowing this and conducting his test in the most favorable manner he was informed.
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green 85 300SD 200K miles "Das Schlepper Frog" With a OM603 TBO360 turbo ( To be intercooled someday )(  Kalifornistani emissons  )white 79 300SD 200K'ish miles "Farfegnugen" (RIP - cracked crank) desert storm primer 63 T-bird "The Undead" (long term hibernation) http://ecomodder.com/forum/fe-graphs/sig692a.png
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#10
03-16-2006, 09:27 AM
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Quote:
doesn't surprise me at all.. I'd rather own the Jetta than the Prius
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Proud owner of .... 1971 280SE W108 1979 300SD W116 1983 300D W123 1975 Ironhead Sportster chopper 1987 GMC 3/4 ton 4X4 Diesel 1989 Honda Civic (Heavily modified) --------------------- Section 609 MVAC Certified --------------------- "He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche
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#11
03-17-2006, 12:54 AM
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I think we're all missing the point of the hybrid.
Yeah, the TDI gets better milage than the Prius, but whole point of the hybrid is to help us learn to give up oil consumption. The hybrids (inluding the flexfuel cars and trucks) are out there as a start to getting away from using the dino resource. Little by little we will find better technology, better ways to make fuel and better engines to run on the new fuel. The whole 'go yellow' camp is crap right now because of the amount of energy it takes to make ethanol. It costs more in energy to make than the amount of energy that ethanol can give. So in the future we learn to make it cheaper and faster and we make engines that run more efficient on ethanol than they do gas, diesel or electricity. The Prius, not an ethanol vehicle I know, is just the start of a new road. It doesn't beat the TDI but it does run partly on electric power, so it does other things that are better, like less emissions. I'm not a big fan of the small hybrids. I've got 4 kids to taxi around and no one is making a nice safe hybrid suburban yet. But at least it's a start, right?
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#12
03-17-2006, 08:29 AM
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How does this make sense? Sure the Prius runs on electricity.... Electricity that is generated by a gasoline engine! Yes it does have regenerative braking and lesser emissions but diesel technology is on the cusp of producing similar emissions through things like MB's Bluetec. They both fill up on petroleum but the TDI usually goes farther on a gallon so which is helping to kick the oil habit more? Ethanol is not the answer. There is approximately HALF the btu's in Ethanol than Gasoline and Diesel. This means the E85 vehicles that GM is trying to sell us on actually get LESS mpg's than the current fleet. I suppose the arguement is that they are cleaner emissions-wise. So what? Todays gasoline engines are something like 98.5% clean. How much are we going to pay to glean that extra 1.5%? Doesn't make sense, the law of diminishing returns comes into effect. We should be working on vehicles that get more MPG's at this time not cleaner emissions. It makes far more sense to reduce the demand for oil in the short term. There are many reasons I don't care for the Prius. Technologically its a fine product, its the reasoning that is screwed up. Honda used to make a Civic HF. It was a high mpg commuter car with a slightly smaller engine and tall gearing. This car was able to do just as well or better than the Prius' mpg's. Side by side the Civic will be a better choice than the Prius just like the TDI will be a better choice than the Prius for most driving. What Americans need to be weened off is not oil, its high HP vehicles. For the average car there is simply no reason to have any more than 150hp. Our highways are clogged with SUV's and V6 Accords, Camrys, etc. etc. that are simply unnecessary for daily use. If everyone chose to drive a fairly fuel efficient vehicle (read 4 cylinders) or a diesel, etc. then oil demand would be cut in half. Its about responsibility at this point and we are sorely lacking in that department. RT
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When all else fails, vote from the rooftops! 84' Mercedes Benz 300D Anthracite/black, 171K 03' Volkswagen Jetta TDI blue/black, 93K 93' Chevrolet C2500HD ExCab 6.5TD, Two-tone blue, 252K
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#13
03-17-2006, 05:54 PM
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I had one of those CRX HF models, boy did I love that little two-seater. Listed at 50 City and 56 highway. Now that was in the old days of 55 mph speedlimits, but I always got excellent mileage, best was 67mpg on a trip out into Western Nebraska and back. Those are real figures. I put 50 psi in the tires, turned it off at long stoplights and could turn it off on big hills and let it coast (did not have power brakes or steering) it would seemingly roll forever. It was ungodly slow, tall gearing does not even begin to tell the story, down shift for hills, turn off the AC etc.
1.5L with 62 hp and 90 ft/lbs of torque. Bought at $8,700 sold at $5,700 and had put 80,000 miles on it. I just do not understand why we can't get these numbers today. The thing road like a roller skate, I could stay in the drivers seat and open the fuel cap, weighed like 1700 pounds. Now the cars have to be bigger, few hundred pounds of safety stuff, plus all the extra features etc. Emissions should be divided by the miles driven per gallon, that's the real world. The other test I would like to see is chaining a TDI up to Prius (back to back), once the battery gave up the TDI could drag it across the country. (Not bashing the Prius, but simply different rigs, driven one, very nice, thought of buying, but not big enough, just don't see the need for all the gizmo's when I did better 20 years ago! Where is the Technology improvement? I don't see it.)
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raMBow 1999 E300DT Obsydian Black Metallic, Heated Full Leather Parchment options, E2, K2, 136,000+, best 36.5 mpg - GP's 12-04 & 11-12 Zero Stuck 2010 Honda Odyssey - The BrideMobile - best 26.5 (2) 2005 Honday Accord- (1 -Corporate 1 - Personal) - 110,000 4-cyl 30mpg 2000 VW Golf GLS TDI, Upsolute Chip (sold to Brother, now 300+k on it) 48.5 mpg like clock work 1987 Honda CRX HF - Sold 87,000 always over 50 mpg Max 67 mpg
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#14
03-17-2006, 06:02 PM
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#15
03-17-2006, 09:45 PM
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We DO need to be weened off oil. The ethanol car TODAY isn't the best technology, but IN THE FUTURE we may be able to make it more efficient. Give it a little time. In the future, the future without oil, it won't matter if those cars get better milage than today's cars. We'll (or they) will be driving alternative energy cars and what they get is what they get. As for diesel, IT'S still a petrol product and if there is no oil, or a shortage, there won't be diesel fuel either! A car that runs on renewable fuels is what we should be worrying about today.
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