How to Set IP Timing via the Drip Tube Method - Pictorial - Page 4 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

75Sv1 · #46 11-11-2008, 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannym

You don't really need a drip tube.
What your looking for is the point where the piston rises in the bore and starts the high pressure fuel delivery to the injector. The transition from full flow to dripping happens very quickly.
Personally I just look down into the bore and look for the point where the fuel just starts to rise up (Start of Delivery).

Another way to set timing is by using the Factory Timing Tool, part #601 589 05 21 00 .
You set the timing at 15 degrees ATDC. Then you remove the bolt from the side of the IP and insert the tool. You move the pump back and forth until it locks in. Then you bolt down the IP in place. Perfect timing every time!

Danny

I was wondering if you had a picture of what bolt to remove? I have the tool, but have never seen any instruction for its use.
Tom

Scott98 · #47 11-11-2008, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 75Sv1

I was wondering if you had a picture of what bolt to remove? I have the tool, but have never seen any instruction for its use.
Tom

http://www.peachparts.com/Wikka/OM615OM616InjPumpTiming

Scott

winmutt · #48 11-11-2008, 09:20 AM

The bubble method is wholly innaccurate, PARTICULARLY on 84 cali and 85 engines. It was off by over 10 degrees. Get the drip tube and do it right. Looking at the welling at the delivery valve says nothing about the drip pattern.

Stevo · #49 11-11-2008, 12:07 PM

[QUOTE=ForcedInduction;2017043]The bubble method, its inaccurate and shouldn't be used by anyone.

Please excuse my crappy OCR program but here is what the late Marshall Booth had to say about the bubble method.

at~ Ved 03 Jul 2002 12:36:38 -0400 ~- rom Marshall Booth
Subject Re [DIESEL] IP Timing

Mike, Here are several ways to time the pump (its almost NEVER out of time except by about 1/2 the amount of chain stretch you have and that usually isn’t any problem until the chain needs to be replaced). The bubble method is the easiest!

I’ll include all 3 WAYS that I know of to do it.

> Bubble method!

> On the subject of diesel timing. If you are replacing the pump or rebuilding the engine. The simplest and most accurate way of setting the
> pump is. Disconnect_the fuel line going into the pump from the filter.
> Take the spring and plunger out of #1 delivery valve, put the delivery
> valve back in and snug it down, hold the the pump linkage in the full
> open position. If you have the drip tube install it on the delivery
> valve, if not use the injector line in such a way that it is pointing
> away from the engine. It you don’t mind the taste of diesel you can blow
> through the fuel line or use low air pressure. Put the open end of the
> injector line in a glass of water and watch the bubbles. Turn the engine slowly until the bubbles stop and check the timing mark. After
> tightening the pump recheck. This method is really more precise than it
> needs to be and although it may sound complicated it is very easy. Bob

#50 11-11-2008, 05:55 PM

Marshall Booth wasn't always right. He thought you could get more horsepower out of the engine by turning up the ALDA!

Stevo · #51 11-12-2008, 12:16 AM

the fellow that showed me the bubble method was an old retired German MB mechanic that had owned a large shop in Palo Alto Ca for many years. He also made the comment that is "was more precise than it needs to be" but I spoz both he and Marshall Booth could both be wrong and you folks that have never tried it or made lame attempts at it, know better. If you have a spare IP lying around you can do the timing on the bench, give it a try, you may like it

jt20 · #52 11-12-2008, 12:59 AM

I am afraid I don't understand the difference b/w the drip and bubble methods. One displaces fuel, the other displaces air by pushing fuel, the volumes should be the same.

Stevo, what happens when your line runs out of air b/c you suck at timing (like me) and are now pushing fuel into your bubble cup?

ImBroke · #53 11-12-2008, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott98

http://www.peachparts.com/Wikka/OM615OM616InjPumpTiming

Scott

Scott, I think he was referring to the use of this tool. I'd like to get my IP book in, so I might be able to figure it out too.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trksid=p3907.m32&_trkparms=tab%3DWatching&item=120310495566&viewitem=

winmutt · #54 11-12-2008, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stevo

I spoz both he and Marshall Booth could both be wrong and you folks that have never tried it or made lame attempts at it, know better.

Show me where Marshall actively supported it.

Stevo · #55 11-12-2008, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jt20

I am afraid I don't understand the difference b/w the drip and bubble methods. One displaces fuel, the other displaces air by pushing fuel, the volumes should be the same.

Stevo, what happens when your line runs out of air b/c you suck at timing (like me) and are now pushing fuel into your bubble cup?

The idea is to gently blow through the hose which produces bubbles while slowly turning the engine (I use the P/S bolt). When the bubbles stop, your there, check out the marks and adjust accordingly. Fuel is not sucked into the bubble cup (or pushed) WARNING doing this backwards my cause ingestion of diesel fuel, no sucking

.

Like I said, check out the method on the work bench if you have spare IP lying around, you'll throw rocks at the drip tube method

Stevo · #56 11-12-2008, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by winmutt

Show me where Marshall actively supported it.

Did you miss post 49? I can send you the entire post if you like. It matters little to me how you time your IP, what ever method works for you but you need to know other methods work also.

winmutt · #57 11-12-2008, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stevo

Did you miss post 49? I can send you the entire post if you like. It matters little to me how you time your IP, what ever method works for you but you need to know other methods work also.

It was poorly quoted and I misread it....

I am at a total loss as how this works, you have a bit of tube hooked to the ip and the other end in the water filled cup. Your pushing out air followed by fuel, wouldn't the timing then be based on the volume of the tube? No where does it say adjusting the ip, just turning the engine? *scratches head* This sounds just as improbable as the well method.

jt20 · #58 11-12-2008, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by winmutt

It was poorly quoted and I misread it....

I would also like to see the full procedure from Doctor Booth.

Stevo · #59 11-12-2008, 03:24 PM

OK, your not the only one that couldn't see this procedure, the old guy with the shop in Palo Alto had to show me. Same as "drip tube method as far as setting up the drip tube. Disconnect vacuum, wire open rack, etc.. Now put a hose over tube spout and put the other end in a glass of water. Now disconnect the return banjo fitting on the inboard side of the IP. Thats where the check valve lives, take out the spring and ball. Hook up the air line on there. (I have a banjo and hose stashed away for this) Air in, air out into glass, beer can, what ever(bubbles) at the other end while you turn the engine slowly. I am not able to send a pic. Try it on your spare. There no spilling fuel all over the place either

Hope this helps

winmutt · #60 11-12-2008, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stevo

OK, your not the only one that couldn't see this procedure, the old guy with the shop in Palo Alto had to show me. Same as "drip tube method as far as setting up the drip tube. Disconnect vacuum, wire open rack, etc.. Now put a hose over tube spout and put the other end in a glass of water. Now disconnect the return banjo fitting on the inboard side of the IP. Thats where the check valve lives, take out the spring and ball. Hook up the air line on there. (I have a banjo and hose stashed away for this) Air in, air out into glass, beer can, what ever(bubbles) at the other end while you turn the engine slowly. I am not able to send a pic. Try it on your spare. There no spilling fuel all over the place either

Hope this helps

Still confused. Marshall says turn the engine, did he mean turn the IP? Does the engine have to be at TDC?