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Front brakes won't bleed, even with vac!
So, you may remember that I needed a new master cylinder back in Sept or so.
I had some trouble getting the front brakes to bleed. Took everything off and tried again. The back bled easy. The front still nothing. I bought and tried a mightyvac and while I can draw some brake fluid out of the left front, when the brake is pressed, no fluid comes out on it;s own. The right front has brake fluid coming out, but not shooting out like the back does. I had a vac leak, but I used black gasket stuff and that is solved. So, What the H3LL am I to do now? Even the mighty vac doesn't seem to help. And my hand hurts from trying. Is ther a way to get the vac to blow instead? I can feel the air sucking and blowing on my finger if I hold it over the screw. YES there is a full front chamber on the res, I pumped it up with the little pump on the top of the res. If I can feel the air sucking and blowing, see a small bit of fluid blow out of the screw, then there is not a blockage. I am loath to take it all off again, I'd lose the gasket I made. What can I do, please help! Thanks to all! Ginny 78 300SD
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Ginny in Denver-ish 78 300SD, 265K (mine) |
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check your pm. I sent you good instructions!
or give me a call... vacuum is a horrible way to bleed brakes!
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John HAUL AWAY, OR CRUSHED CARS!!! HELP ME keep the cars out of the crusher! A/C Thread "as I ride with my a/c on... I have fond memories of sweaty oily saturdays and spewing R12 into the air. THANKS for all you do! My drivers: 1987 190D 2.5Turbo 1987 190D 2.5Turbo 1987 190D 2.5-5SPEED!!! 1987 300TD 1987 300TD 1994GMC 2500 6.5Turbo truck... I had to put the ladder somewhere! |
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Thank You, AMEN !!!
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1980 240d , chain elongation, cam marks reference: http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/10414-help-i-need-check-stretch.html http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/305365-9-degrees-chain-stretch.html evap fin cleaning: http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/156207-photo-step-step-post-showing-w123-evaporator-removal-1983-240d-1982-300td.html?highlight=evaporator A/C thread http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/297462-c-recommendations-mb-vehicles.html |
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X2!
I tried that a few times and gave up in frustration. For me, the only way to go is with a pressure bleeder. You can build one for 25 bucks or less that will work great.
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Joe ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 1980 300SD - 495k miles - 'The Ambassador' ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Former Family Members 95 C280 73 280SEL 90 300D 87 300SDL (X2) 86 560SEL 84 300D 80 300SD |
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You need pressure.. .it can be from a pressure bleeder.... or from the master cylinder.. but you need pressure to count on doing a good job on all types of systems...
My problem with pressure bleeders is that I suspect the fluid not used when the can is opened and put into it... is used later... stored in the bleeder ... having absorbed moisture... that problem could be overcome by pressurizing it with Nitrogen or Argon or some other dry gas...instead of AIR or just get rid of what is not pumped into the system at the end of the bleeding process.
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1980 240d , chain elongation, cam marks reference: http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?threadid=10414 http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/305365-9-degrees-chain-stretch.html evap fin cleaning: http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/156207-photo-step-step-post-showing-w123-evaporator-removal-1983-240d-1982-300td.html?highlight=evaporator A/C thread http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/297462-c-recommendations-mb-vehicles.html |
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Answer
Some Facts About Brake Hoses:
#1. The the industry standard average safety life of a brake hose is six years. FYI data SAE: J1401, J1703, J1705, J1873, J1406, J1288, J1403, J1833, J1402. #2. Brake hoses deteriorate from the inside as well as the outside. #3. Moisture is absorbed into brake fluid systems through brake hoses. #4. Contaminants in brake fluid act abrasively on the inner wall of brake hoses. #5. The brake hose reinforcing fabric deteriorates through expansion and moisture. #6. High operating temperatures contribute to the deterioration of hoses. #7. Brake hoses swell with age and restrict flow. #8. Generally all brake hoses on a vehicle deteriorate at the same rate, So all hoses should be replaced if one is found to be faulty! Brake hose failure mode: #A. Rupture (burst hose) = age, exercise (too many miles) or impact are the typical cause. *B. Partial internal collapse = the inner ply becomes damaged/detached acting as a partial restriction and/or one way valve. #C. Full internal Blockage = the inner ply becomes damaged/detached acting as a plug = brake pedal still feels good but there is no brake application. Brake bleeder recommendation http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/tech-help/72839-brake-bleeder-recommendation.html#post455818 Power Bleeder or what? http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/103226-power-bleeder-what.html#post707359 Brake bleeder - power bleeder Homemade Brake bleeder - power bleeder Homemade Brake system bleeding, master cylinder bleeding http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/general-information/149045-brake-system-bleeding-master-cylinder-bleeding-damage-warning.html#post1127978 .
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ASE Master Mechanic asemastermechanic@juno.com Prototype R&D/testing: Thermal & Aerodynamic System Engineering (TASE) Senior vehicle instrumentation technician. Noise Vibration and Harshness (NVH). Dynamometer. Heat exchanger durability. HV-A/C Climate Control. Vehicle build. Fleet Durability Technical Quality Auditor. Automotive Technical Writer 1985 300SD 1983 300D 1984 190D 2003 Volvo V70 2002 Honda Civic https://www.boldegoist.com/ |
#7
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I use a jelly jar and a clear rubber tube. put one end of the tube in the jar and the other on the open bleeder. as you pump it will push out the air and suck fluid in. make shure the res is full and pump until all air is out. works well for me. I was thinking the rear res was for the front?
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#8
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Quote:
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Joe ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 1980 300SD - 495k miles - 'The Ambassador' ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Former Family Members 95 C280 73 280SEL 90 300D 87 300SDL (X2) 86 560SEL 84 300D 80 300SD |
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I got great instructions from vtech.
Seems I was trying to bleed the brakes the american car way. I will try the German car way and report back. She's been sitting since Oct and I really want to drive her again now that winter is about gone and Spring is in the air. She needs a bath. . .
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Ginny in Denver-ish 78 300SD, 265K (mine) |
#10
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... american and german hydrolic brakes are all the same... ya needs pressure, not vacuum... and you have to close the bleeders before you release the pedal!
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John HAUL AWAY, OR CRUSHED CARS!!! HELP ME keep the cars out of the crusher! A/C Thread "as I ride with my a/c on... I have fond memories of sweaty oily saturdays and spewing R12 into the air. THANKS for all you do! My drivers: 1987 190D 2.5Turbo 1987 190D 2.5Turbo 1987 190D 2.5-5SPEED!!! 1987 300TD 1987 300TD 1994GMC 2500 6.5Turbo truck... I had to put the ladder somewhere! |
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Quote:
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Quote:
but it is not good advice for bleeding brakes...and we have no way of knowing how well it really worked for you... specifically whether it left some old brake fluid in your system....this is also the reason you bleed the longest line first... so that when the others are bled you know that NEW fluid it being run into them.... You need a secure one way function.. new fluid in at the top, air and old fluid and junk pushed out at the bottom with force. Not ' some ( unknown amount ) out at the bottom and sucking back in'... There is also the matter of the threads of the bleeder potentially letting air back in on the suck as that flows easier than the new ( and lower situated ) new fluid... The regular system is easy and fool proof. Don't try to get tricky or lazy on Brake items... And do not think I do not know how much trouble it is to get help for this procedure done right if you do not have a bleeder....as I do not... and train the helper.... 40 years of being a one man operation on mechanicing...
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1980 240d , chain elongation, cam marks reference: http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?threadid=10414 http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/305365-9-degrees-chain-stretch.html evap fin cleaning: http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/156207-photo-step-step-post-showing-w123-evaporator-removal-1983-240d-1982-300td.html?highlight=evaporator A/C thread http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/297462-c-recommendations-mb-vehicles.html |
#13
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replace the brake hoses. if they are original, they probably need replacing anyway. they are fairly inexpensive and it's cheap insurance (especially since these are front brakes)
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Ben 1987 190d 2.5Turbo |
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Quote:
Very few people understand how short the actual safe life of those lines is. I know that reads funny but the ' is' refers to ' life' ... As Whunter's post shows... they can look good on the outside and delaminate on the inside.. which can cause one side to LOCK in the clamped position... I and others have had this happen in the past... discussion in the archives... They are cheap ....and just for the record.. NEVER HANG YOUR BRAKE CALIPERS BY THE BRAKE LINES... make a wire hanger to hold them.
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1980 240d , chain elongation, cam marks reference: http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?threadid=10414 http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/305365-9-degrees-chain-stretch.html evap fin cleaning: http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/156207-photo-step-step-post-showing-w123-evaporator-removal-1983-240d-1982-300td.html?highlight=evaporator A/C thread http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/297462-c-recommendations-mb-vehicles.html |
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Front brake lines are about 6-7 years old. Done by PO about a year before we bought it. Found a receipt for that when going through the stuff after purchase. I'm confident those are in goos shape.
Will be nice to get her moving again, I think she's felt left out over the winter.
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Ginny in Denver-ish 78 300SD, 265K (mine) |
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