Well I think you are wrong, but it is your money you are spending. W123, both 300D or wagon TD, all use the same transmission as far as I know. If you start cutting drive shafts because of transmission length, I think you will be out in left field and in trouble - lots of trouble. So follow the old rule your mother taught you. "Measure twice, cut once"

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Junqueyardjim
Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important. C.S. Lewis



1983 Mercedes W123 240D 4 Speed 285,000 on the road with a 617 turbo, beautiful butter yellow, license plate # 83 240D INDIANA

2003 Jaguar Type X, AWD. beautiful, good mileage,
Mom's car, but I won't let her drive it!

Markp, this is the page I use a lot to very parts and crossovers and everything. It is called the "Russian" EPC. It is fast and so easy to use.

Mercedes Benz EPC Type W123 123 Information | Everything Benz

This page lists all W123 models. Just scroll down to the model you want. click on it and you will have the model and you can find about any part you need, but not all of them. So in quickly checking, both the 300D and the 300TD use 722.2 722.3 or 722.4 transmission. That is all the same trans with some interior modification or gearing.

__________________
Junqueyardjim
Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important. C.S. Lewis



1983 Mercedes W123 240D 4 Speed 285,000 on the road with a 617 turbo, beautiful butter yellow, license plate # 83 240D INDIANA

2003 Jaguar Type X, AWD. beautiful, good mileage,
Mom's car, but I won't let her drive it!

Sorry if i was not clear, what I am saying is the Auto box is 6 1/4" longer then the 240D manual box I am installing. I am positive the manual box is shorter. I will add the difference to my TD front DS.

OK, it is your job. You will find out the hard way, I am sure of that.

__________________
Junqueyardjim
Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important. C.S. Lewis



1983 Mercedes W123 240D 4 Speed 285,000 on the road with a 617 turbo, beautiful butter yellow, license plate # 83 240D INDIANA

2003 Jaguar Type X, AWD. beautiful, good mileage,
Mom's car, but I won't let her drive it!

http://www.teamunemployment.com/gavin/mercedes/DSC00293x.JPG

OK, so I am off 1/8"

I did some measurments on the Iron box 4 spd and the all aliminum box.

Iron Box = 16 3/4"

Alum Box = 17"

I have 4 different Dtive Shafts:

81 300D 4-spd Euro = 20 1/2"
617NA

80 280TD 4-spd Euro = 20 3/4"
280 6 cylinder gasser engine

240D = 25 1/8"
Not sure if this is from a auto or manual trans.

85 300D auto = 14 1/2"

I measured from the front edge of the Tri-Flange to the end of the shaft at the splines to get these measurements.

Tomarrow I`ll get under our 240 with the 4-spd to see what the length of the shaft is.

When we did the swap in the 85, I couldn`t get the DL mounted because not enough was taken off, so had to take it back and have it redone.
I`ll measure this one too to see exactly what the length is.

When I cut the shift rods to length, I remember cutting 4" off two, and 3 1/2" off the 3rd one.

Once I figured out what rod wnet where, I mounted them in the transmission end. then checked how far each one was screwed into the aluminum end piece that attaches to the shifter. unscrewed each one, stuck it on the shifter, held it horizontaly, and laid the rod on top and made my mark where to cut.

Then threaded the ends. the threads will be a bit smaller that the original.
the other thing I guess is cut out of the middle and weld them back together.
It worked ok, and nothing came apart.

Hope this helps.


The 81 300D Euro had the 617 Fly Wheel I had been looking for. In a couple days the engine is coming out for this FW swap, and a few other enhancements.


Charlie

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there were three HP ratings on the OM616...

1) Not much power
2) Even less power
3) Not nearly enough power!! 240D w/auto

Anyone that thinks a 240D is slow drives too fast.

80 240D Naturally Exasperated, 4-Spd 388k DD 150mph spedo 3:58 Diff

We are advised to NOT judge ALL Muslims by the actions of a few lunatics, but we are encouraged to judge ALL gun owners by the actions of a few lunatics. Funny how that works

I think in that thread where you got this picture, Gavin shows the length of the cut Drive Line.

Charlie

__________________
there were three HP ratings on the OM616...

1) Not much power
2) Even less power
3) Not nearly enough power!! 240D w/auto

Anyone that thinks a 240D is slow drives too fast.

80 240D Naturally Exasperated, 4-Spd 388k DD 150mph spedo 3:58 Diff

We are advised to NOT judge ALL Muslims by the actions of a few lunatics, but we are encouraged to judge ALL gun owners by the actions of a few lunatics. Funny how that works

Next picture down from the one you posted shows the new cut length.




Charlie

__________________
there were three HP ratings on the OM616...

1) Not much power
2) Even less power
3) Not nearly enough power!! 240D w/auto

Anyone that thinks a 240D is slow drives too fast.

80 240D Naturally Exasperated, 4-Spd 388k DD 150mph spedo 3:58 Diff

We are advised to NOT judge ALL Muslims by the actions of a few lunatics, but we are encouraged to judge ALL gun owners by the actions of a few lunatics. Funny how that works

Thanks,

I decided to bring a 240D front shaft to shop to have it shortened to 20.5" The actual measurement was closer to 20.75, but I decided to allow another 1/4" just in case. This corresponds to the 300NA euro MT DS measurement you posted.

The DS I am cutting down has that damper/balancer thing on the front side, figured i might as well use it (which is why I opted not to lengthen the TD fr shaft)
I will have the whole asm balanced, will have new U joint and support asm.

My measurements of transmissions were pretty much identical to those in the pic.

The CD wheelbase is about 3.5" shorter then 300D/TD. maybe both shafts are different on that car, or maybe it is all in the front shaft, not sure.

Regardless, it is just a simple calculation of the difference in trans length added to the Length of TD front shaft so I should be good to go.

I found a 240D Auto crossmember right in town for free! The car is sitting in a field, sunk to the pan, probalbly full of critters, but I'll get that cross member no matter what!

I am also using all new mounts (incl. a TD trans mount) so I think I have a handle on it. The FW and DS are at the shops, plenty of other things to do in the mean time.

Thanks again

The engine/trans swap almost done. I have not had much time to work on it, but I should be driving it this weekend.

I had a b1tch of a time bleeding the clutch, turned out that the master I installed with my pedal asm had some gunk in it, plugging it. I had another one so i took it apart and cleaned it up, seems in good shape so i will run it for now. Its all bled and functioning best I can tell. I do regret not replacing both slave and master but will leave it alone for now. PITA to change those!

The DS is 20 3/4" long and fits perfect. I used a shaft with a balancer/damper thing on the front. I did not get it balanced, the shop that did it is very good but does not balance. I wanted to test fit it before balancing and decided i might as well try it as is.

Shift rods are shortened and installed. I ended up shortening/sleeving them and did not mess with cutting threads. Came out nice, shifts good, new bushings etc.

Work done:

Fr main seal

check vacuum pump, seemed like new, bearing good so just reinstalled it with new gasket

turbo drain seals

oil filter housing gaskets

new oil cooler lines

valve adj

check T chain stretch (none)

rebuilt lift pump

all new hoses, t stat, reseal t stat housing

new belts

New clutch - decided not to install the used one since this car will be pretty hard on clutch w/2:88 R (?)

Carrier bearing/rubber

New engine mounts, shocks were fine

240D auto Xmember, 300TD mount

New exhaust front to back

Chilled the pilot bearing for a week and tapped it into 85 crank (went right in Junyarddog!)

Cleaned/popped injectors w/bosio's form other engine

New GP's

new water pump

cleaned engine. trans, under hood, still needs more but looking good enough for the work horse that it is.

return lines new


I still need to do the following:

Rr sls links

install exhaust

redo some fuel system related stuff

wire reverse lights to switch and wire starter safety to clutch pedal (since my kids tend to play with keys in the ign).

Steering box!!!


car has rebuilt front end, SD vented brakes, 2:88R. Should be nice if I do not get vibrations from engine/driveline! Should run it this weekend, no time to look at it until Sat AM. I'll post some pics soon.

Hey Markp, this is junkyarddog and hey it sounds good. Man you are moving along. Great job! Let that pilot bearing shrink up for a week, I bet you didn't hardly have to tap it in. We are happy that your job is moving along so well.

__________________
Junqueyardjim
Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important. C.S. Lewis



1983 Mercedes W123 240D 4 Speed 285,000 on the road with a 617 turbo, beautiful butter yellow, license plate # 83 240D INDIANA

2003 Jaguar Type X, AWD. beautiful, good mileage,
Mom's car, but I won't let her drive it!

Thanks man,

yep it popped right in, 3 medium hits. I had it in freezer for a week.

I underestimated how long it would take to get the 'new' engine cleaned up and resealed, adjusted, etc.

All is going fine, but I know I will eat up another weekend on this thing.

I spent like 6hrs fighting the clutch bleed, I installed that other master and it seems fine. Pain in ze butt RnR'n those.

Hard to find the time to work on my junk: kids, kitchen reno, 12hr work days this week, and to top it all off Wife hit a dear in her car (and we just took collision off it 6 wks ago)
Time for a family vaca soon, losing my marbles.

I am expecting the worst in terms of vibrations, but hoping for the best.

__________________
82 MB 300TD, 87 Audi 4000TQ, 05 Audi A4 avant 1.8T 6spd (Wifes), 63 356C, Samurai VW 1.6TD, 71 NSU 1200C, 71 Toyota Hilux, tractors and junk

The 617 euro flywheels are either too expensive over here or too scarce used. They may not be a dime a dozen in europe but it might be worth while to try to aquire one used from there and have it shipped over.

This is only safe if indeed they where neutrally balanced from the factory. I do not know if any member knows this but perhaps the mercedes classic center may have that information.

If they were going to be otherwise than neutrally balanced. One would have thought the flywheel bolt holes would have been specifically drilled to mount them only one way.

The troubling issue is some people have reported faint marks existing I thought.

I have only done swaps with 616s but IF theres a mark there, you will see it using emery cloth around the center hole. Its stamped in, about a half inch long. I wish I had taken the time to see if there were marks on the crank and f/w when I recently put a clutch in my TD. On the 616s most had no marks.

__________________


1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"

Hi everyone. I got it all done and it works great. No vibrations that I can notice, from FW or DS. I only had the car up to 60 today on a back road, but it seems totally smooth. I do notice the very minor buzz when lugging 3rd, but no big deal at all.

Clutch works great, shifting is good, engine runs very smooth/quiet, sounds great. All seems well EXCEPT!:

The engine i installed was under my bench for like 5 yrs, I pulled it from a good running 85 TD that I drove 250miles to its final resting place. The engine ran well, had good power, little to no blow by, which is why i pulled it.

Anyway, after I installed it it would not start, tried for hours.

Fuel system was definitely primed, GP's all new and working.

I decided to inspect the shut off valve and it seemed to work fine, then i decided to remove the top cover off R section of pump to see what the shut off valve actuates (please note that I have experience with VE pumps, but virtually no experience with these inline pumps)

The thing that the shut off valve contacts was stuck in the off position. I free'd it up, put it back together and then it started right up.

Then after checking everything out, finally took it on a drive. What a dog!

I knew it may feel slow after driving my Audi for a few weeks, but this was way to slow.

It is slow to build boost, max boost like 8psi but needs alot more time then the old engine. The ALDA is fine, banjo clean, etc.

I have not messed with it too much today, but what I am seeing is that the throttle lever does very little until it is 1/2 open. I adjusted the throttle stop a bit and that helped. Is this related to a sticking "rack" or could it somehow be out of adjustment?

Has anyone every seen a problem where the throttle lever does very little until 1/2 throttle? after that is where it revs right up. So it seems the first 1/2 of lever travel does next to nothing. It idles pretty low too. All physical/external adjustments are correct, throttle lever definitely opens all the way, etc.


I did not adjust ALDA yet (is where it was and ran strong like this) also did not check waste gate yet since it does build some boost, I am focusing on the odd problem of throttle lever doing nothing until 1/2 way, seem like car is running at like 1/2 throttle as a result.

I have no desire to hot rod this car, just want decent performance for daily driving with minimal smoke. Whatever the problem is, I sure hope i don't have to remove IP. I have been reading up on pump adjustments, but don't see how mine has come out of adjustment just from sitting. If the rack is moved by a spring, maybe it is sticking. I don't know, I'll need to do more research on these pumps, trying to find a nice diagram or exploded view.

Oh, also I am flushing cooling system for third time, finally rusty water becoming clear.

Wife took my camera so no pics till tomorrow.

Thanks,

Mark

__________________
82 MB 300TD, 87 Audi 4000TQ, 05 Audi A4 avant 1.8T 6spd (Wifes), 63 356C, Samurai VW 1.6TD, 71 NSU 1200C, 71 Toyota Hilux, tractors and junk