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  #151  
Old 01-19-2018, 12:40 PM
iwrock's Avatar
roflmonster
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Hella NorCal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markg612 View Post
Sooo--the DPF is the linch pin in the 229.51 oil specification. The oil "additive package" as they say is formulated specifically to work with the DPF. If the xW30 oils are still 229.51, I'd bet the 0W30/5W30 requirement may have come along with later iterations of the OM642s due to improved manufacturing techniques that resulted in tighter tolerances? Viscosity (xWxx) would be about clearances, Additives (229.xx)would be about exhaust treatment. (EGR, DPF, Catalyst).

My two cents.
I'm far from an expert, but I've done tons of reading and chatted with a few guys who work at MB and the general consensus is that MB learned a few things with the earlier OM642 and remedied them as time went on. The switch from a xw-40 to an xw-30 was to increase fuel mileage and to up resistance to oxidative thickening/improve resistance against spontaneous sludging. I dunno about tighter tolerance, but I suppose that could have also been a factor. 229.51/229.52 are actually low SAPS (sulphur, ash, phosphorus) as they're detrimental to the DPF. I'm not sure of any additional additives, but suspect they're on par with 229.5 oils.

Something worth noting is that 2009/2010 and newer OM642s seem to suffer from timing chain issues (chain rattle then failure). I haven't been able to verify this, but an MB tech told me the bearing and chain tensioner setup on the earlier 642 are more durable than the later 642... So you may be onto something with the manufacturing process changing at some point necessitating 229.52 oils.
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07 MB ML320 CDI
12 Trek 2.1 Triple
16 Nike Free 4.0

it's automatic.
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  #152  
Old 01-19-2018, 06:05 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Bay Area via Phoenix, Chicago and Minnesota.
Posts: 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by iwrock View Post

Something worth noting is that 2009/2010 and newer OM642s seem to suffer from timing chain issues (chain rattle then failure). I haven't been able to verify this, but an MB tech told me the bearing and chain tensioner setup on the earlier 642 are more durable than the later 642... So you may be onto something with the manufacturing process changing at some point necessitating 229.52 oils.
I was pre-pruchase inspecting a 2012 GL350 with about 90,000 turns and RAN away from it because of the timing chain. I could hear it slap like crazy on startup, and I stethoscoped it while it was running and it sounded like it was about to come apart. GRRRR.

My 07 is at 140K and tight as a dumb.
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Mark
========
THE WHITE FLEET
2012 S350 Bluetec==81k WHITE
2007 ML320 CDI==145K WHITE
2005 E320 CDI--138K--WHITE
1995 E300-Diesel-329K--THE CAR IS BLUE. (For Sale!)

Under new management:
1986 300SL--97.5K (European) AND WHITE.
1991 190E 2.3-73K California Perfect.--WHITE
1995 E320-Wagon-159K--WHITE (recently scrapped)
1987 300D Turbo-213K--WHITE
1987 190D 2.5 Turbo-288K--WHITE
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  #153  
Old 02-16-2018, 09:46 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 16
Is there no recall or lawsuit to force a recall for the OM642 oil cooler seal leak? My '08 ML320 CDI just started leaking at 109000 miles. I don't know if it has the original orange seals or the updated purple seals. Is there a way to find out if has been changed or not?
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  #154  
Old 02-16-2018, 10:58 AM
ROLLGUY's Avatar
ROLLGUY
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 5,880
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diamlerman View Post
Is there no recall or lawsuit to force a recall for the OM642 oil cooler seal leak? My '08 ML320 CDI just started leaking at 109000 miles. I don't know if it has the original orange seals or the updated purple seals. Is there a way to find out if has been changed or not?
There may be dealer service records or Carfax that should show if the seals were replaced. I think any dealer can access the service records with a VIN. That assumes that an oil cooler seal replacement was done at a dealer, and not at an independent. It is possible that your seals have NOT been replaced yet, as that mileage is within the window of mileage/time that the seals last. I have heard as little as 70K (my '07), and as many as 120K miles till they start to leak. Also, the extreme heat these engines generate may have an effect on the longevity of the seals depending on what chassis the engine is in. The larger ML may have more room around the engine for air/heat to escape than an E class has (just a theory of mine). I have not done any research into how many miles before the seals start to leak on each chassis, but it would be very telling if it turns out that a Sprinter can go longer than an E before the seals leak. Again, just a theory.....Rich
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  #155  
Old 02-16-2018, 01:59 PM
Control Freak
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 3,183
My ML seals went at around 125 k

It had been dripping for a while, when the swirl flap motor died I decided it was time to go ahead and fix the whole mess.


16 months later, leak free and loving it...
__________________
2014 ML350 Bluetec (wife's DD)
2008 E320 Bluetec (my DD)
2008 ML320 CDI (Older son's college DD)
1998 E300DT (Younger son's college DD)
1987 300TD sold to vstech
----------
gone but living on
1983 240D (body to greazzer, engine to t walgamuth)
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  #156  
Old 02-16-2018, 06:58 PM
iwrock's Avatar
roflmonster
 
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Have you checked to see if the orange seal from the CCV is swollen or broken?

Mine broke and made a mess very similar to an oil cooler leak...
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07 MB ML320 CDI
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16 Nike Free 4.0

it's automatic.
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  #157  
Old 02-16-2018, 07:46 PM
ROLLGUY's Avatar
ROLLGUY
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iwrock View Post
Have you checked to see if the orange seal from the CCV is swollen or broken?

Mine broke and made a mess very similar to an oil cooler leak...
Yes this is a common leak, as well as the seal around the turbo inlet. Both these leaks are responsible for taking out the swirl flap motor.
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  #158  
Old 02-16-2018, 08:39 PM
Control Freak
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 3,183
Mine was leaking from the cooler seals as well as the breather.

It killed the swirl flap motor.

I replaced oil cooler seals, swirl flap motor, breather puck and new y-pipe aka bat wing, all good now.
__________________
2014 ML350 Bluetec (wife's DD)
2008 E320 Bluetec (my DD)
2008 ML320 CDI (Older son's college DD)
1998 E300DT (Younger son's college DD)
1987 300TD sold to vstech
----------
gone but living on
1983 240D (body to greazzer, engine to t walgamuth)
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  #159  
Old 02-18-2018, 10:50 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: The Bay Area via Phoenix, Chicago and Minnesota.
Posts: 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diamlerman View Post
Is there no recall or lawsuit to force a recall for the OM642 oil cooler seal leak?
Really? Lawsuit on a nearly 10 year old car with a defect that shows more often than not after 100K miles?

This IS what Mercedes Benz is about as they age, they're highly engineered and they are prone to failures over time. The only recourse with the dealer seems to be safety items, OTHER than the for instance, the trap oxidizer disaster.

201s and Early 124s EVERYTHING broke, the 603 motors cracked heads like eggshells. Between the trap oxidizer and the poorly engineered cooling system, it was like a train wreck looking for a crossing, not to mentored the evaporator failures, the spring perch failures, the rear suspension link failures, blah blah blah, albeit, my 201s were far better cars than my 87 124, which was a total POS compared to my 1995 124s. It took them 10 model years to get it right. I forgot the head gasket oil seals on the M104s the shot oil out the front corner of the engine like a cow pissing on a flat rock.

The 210s disintegrate in the salt, worse than most chevy Vegas, the power-steering pump reservoir seal lets loose and pisses fluid everywhere, the V6 front case seal pisses oil everywhere. The spring perches rip out of these too, as well as the 124/201 legacy suspension sags.

The early 211s had more electrical issues than I can count, along with the fabled electric brakes.

We won't even begin to get into the W220s. UGH!

On and on and on--where are the suits to cover these disasters?

While the durability and reliability of MB has vastly improved in my lifetime, the underlying issue of an overly engineered expensive product still exudes inherent risks of ownership outside of dealer warranty.

Buyer beware is my take, and good luck on the lawsuit bit.
__________________
Mark
========
THE WHITE FLEET
2012 S350 Bluetec==81k WHITE
2007 ML320 CDI==145K WHITE
2005 E320 CDI--138K--WHITE
1995 E300-Diesel-329K--THE CAR IS BLUE. (For Sale!)

Under new management:
1986 300SL--97.5K (European) AND WHITE.
1991 190E 2.3-73K California Perfect.--WHITE
1995 E320-Wagon-159K--WHITE (recently scrapped)
1987 300D Turbo-213K--WHITE
1987 190D 2.5 Turbo-288K--WHITE
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  #160  
Old 02-18-2018, 11:29 AM
ROLLGUY's Avatar
ROLLGUY
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 5,880
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg612 View Post
Really? Lawsuit on a nearly 10 year old car with a defect that shows more often than not after 100K miles?

This IS what Mercedes Benz is about as they age, they're highly engineered and they are prone to failures over time. The only recourse with the dealer seems to be safety items, OTHER than the for instance, the trap oxidizer disaster.

201s and Early 124s EVERYTHING broke, the 603 motors cracked heads like eggshells. Between the trap oxidizer and the poorly engineered cooling system, it was like a train wreck looking for a crossing, not to mentored the evaporator failures, the spring perch failures, the rear suspension link failures, blah blah blah, albeit, my 201s were far better cars than my 87 124, which was a total POS compared to my 1995 124s. It took them 10 model years to get it right. I forgot the head gasket oil seals on the M104s the shot oil out the front corner of the engine like a cow pissing on a flat rock.

The 210s disintegrate in the salt, worse than most chevy Vegas, the power-steering pump reservoir seal lets loose and pisses fluid everywhere, the V6 front case seal pisses oil everywhere. The spring perches rip out of these too, as well as the 124/201 legacy suspension sags.

The early 211s had more electrical issues than I can count, along with the fabled electric brakes.

We won't even begin to get into the W220s. UGH!

On and on and on--where are the suits to cover these disasters?

While the durability and reliability of MB has vastly improved in my lifetime, the underlying issue of an overly engineered expensive product still exudes inherent risks of ownership outside of dealer warranty.

Buyer beware is my take, and good luck on the lawsuit bit.
Well said. However, none of the above will keep me from fixing/buying/owning/driving/fixing/enjoying/fixing/(did I mention fixing?) these fine well engineered automobiles. With 150+ register-able vehicles I have had in my lifetime, and probably 40+ of them having a three pointed star, I am not kept from having several in my driveway or elsewhere on my property because of their myriad of known problems and failure points. Example: My most recent dealings with the SBC system (rebuilding of SBC module) on my '05 CDI is a small price to pay for the enjoyment I receive from this car. For some, this would be the end of their ownership of a car with the need for this repair. From my first 'Benz ('82 300CD Red/Black) to my latest ('07 E320 Bluetec), and everything in-between, the entire Mercedes-Benz experience has been fun, rewarding, and enjoyable...........Rich
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  #161  
Old 02-18-2018, 11:41 AM
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Location: The Bay Area via Phoenix, Chicago and Minnesota.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROLLGUY View Post
rewarding, and enjoyable...........Rich
Rich, same for me, I know what I'm buying and choosing to do so for all of the same reasons you mentioned.

Although, motor mounts on the ML were an unenjoyable PITA the other day, 2 bolt bottom mount, with an 18" extension and swivel socket, as opposed to the one down, one up in the cars, PLUS the DPF and exhaust shielding on the right side. left side was about 20 minutes, the right side was 3 flip'n hours. GRRRR.

It's nice and smooth again now!!
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  #162  
Old 02-18-2018, 11:52 AM
ROLLGUY's Avatar
ROLLGUY
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 5,880
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg612 View Post
Rich, same for me, I know what I'm buying and choosing to do so for all of the same reasons you mentioned.

Although, motor mounts on the ML were an unenjoyable PITA the other day, 2 bolt bottom mount, with an 18" extension and swivel socket, as opposed to the one down, one up in the cars, PLUS the DPF and exhaust shielding on the right side. left side was about 20 minutes, the right side was 3 flip'n hours. GRRRR.

It's nice and smooth again now!!
Challenging-yes, nerve-racking-yes, time consuming-yes, expensive for most people that don't do their own work-very much so, but for many if not most of us here on this forum, there is no more satisfying AND affordable conveyance on the planet.
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  #163  
Old 05-17-2018, 10:26 AM
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Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 2
Chiming-in, here... I believe the 2010's and later have the newer purple seals but maybe not since my 2010 is leaking. I had the timing chain and tensioner replaced (parts from IDParts.com) by the dealer a few months back. I haven't driven it because now the oil cooler seals are leaking. I'm having those replaced, doing the swirl flap delete, dpf delete, JR Autotune loaded to it, etc. All will be done for off-road use only. Love the vehicle, but not what it costs to fix it. I'm doing the rest of the non-dealer tweaks/fixes in-house to save on money. It only has 111K on it, new tires, brakes, chain/tensioner, and some other stuff, so to me it makes sense to drive it... It routinely brings back about 29-32mpg/hwy, so I'd like to find out what it would get without all of the emission crap, but I won't be driving it on the hwy anytime soon. Strictly an off-roader now.
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  #164  
Old 09-06-2018, 12:12 PM
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Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by InfoSec View Post
Chiming-in, here... I believe the 2010's and later have the newer purple seals but maybe not since my 2010 is leaking. I had the timing chain and tensioner replaced (parts from IDParts.com) by the dealer a few months back. I haven't driven it because now the oil cooler seals are leaking. I'm having those replaced, doing the swirl flap delete, dpf delete, JR Autotune loaded to it, etc. All will be done for off-road use only. Love the vehicle, but not what it costs to fix it. I'm doing the rest of the non-dealer tweaks/fixes in-house to save on money. It only has 111K on it, new tires, brakes, chain/tensioner, and some other stuff, so to me it makes sense to drive it... It routinely brings back about 29-32mpg/hwy, so I'd like to find out what it would get without all of the emission crap, but I won't be driving it on the hwy anytime soon. Strictly an off-roader now.

Update: About 2 months ago, I did the cooler seals, loaded a "MALONE" tune, deleted everything, added a Buzzken pipe, and couldn't be happier. Probably about 270hp, 480tq.


It's funny, most of the things I've read, the 2010 should have the purple seals. Mine didn't... it had the orange ones. Cleaned the intakes, swirl flaps are just disabled but in the open position. All of the egr nonsense has been blocked-off and subsequently, the parts recycled. Now it gets close to 34.5mpg on the hwy, mixed driving in the last 2k miles has returned about 28.9mpg. Glad I'm keeping it.


Now to find a coolant heater for it.


Mike in Michigan
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  #165  
Old 09-06-2018, 09:20 PM
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ROLLGUY
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 5,880
Quote:
Originally Posted by InfoSec View Post
Update: About 2 months ago, I did the cooler seals, loaded a "MALONE" tune, deleted everything, added a Buzzken pipe, and couldn't be happier. Probably about 270hp, 480tq.


It's funny, most of the things I've read, the 2010 should have the purple seals. Mine didn't... it had the orange ones. Cleaned the intakes, swirl flaps are just disabled but in the open position. All of the egr nonsense has been blocked-off and subsequently, the parts recycled. Now it gets close to 34.5mpg on the hwy, mixed driving in the last 2k miles has returned about 28.9mpg. Glad I'm keeping it.


Now to find a coolant heater for it.


Mike in Michigan
You are obviously in a state/county that does not have smog inspections. I would not be able to even think about doing something like that here in So. Cal..........Rich
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