Iron box business - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Shern · #16 11-07-2018, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by barry12345

In neutral with the clutch engaged or not. There is not signifigant engine loading involved. Not even enough to change the idle rpms other than a very small drop as the clutch plate mass accelerates. Probably undetectable or I have never noticed it on any car. So it should not make anything else vibrate.

I could see a noise transfer with a mechanically activated clutch but not with the hydralic clutch. It tends to eliminate the connection mechanically from the pedal to the throw out system.

A second set of ears may locate the sound source better with two people involved.

Barry -did some reading in the archives and found a post where ForcedInduction suggested that pressing the clutch places pressure on the throwout bearing. I was thinking about that as a concept and wondering what else is compressed and thus hindered from shaking.

Shern · #17 11-07-2018, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by barry12345

Bell housing to engine bolts are not loose? Certainly if the problem started as soon as you changed the mounts would be signifigent to me.

Generally I find coincidence a poor second. Especially if I have done something and there now is an issue right after.

The issue you describe in neutral sounds like a clutch issue. I mentioned the bell housing bolts. As about the only relationship I might suspect. The alignment to the flywheel to your clutch may nave changed if those bolts where loose. Perhaps a long shot but easy to check.

That's an interesting thought... I'll climb under and check that immediately.

Stretch · #18 11-07-2018, 01:55 PM

I personally see value in doing simple things such as checking bolt tightness / considering the condition of parts and making a few measurements if you happen to have the equipment.

I don't see any benefit in over thinking things at this stage.

The way I read the thread is that the potential to shake was always there but it wasn't so noticeable with the old mounts - now you have new mounts you recognise a problem. If you're not careful you'll be just like me with boxes of bits instead of operational vehicles.

[For the record I don't mind boxes of bits - in fact more often than not I get more enjoyment from fixing cars than having them done - most people aren't like that apparently]

If you are likely to be grumbling about "money pits" and "endless trouble" when talking about this car in the future, my advice is to continue to work through the silly simple and gear up to making some measurements if you run out of things to do.

In the mean time drive the car as much as you can - things like new mounts could improve with a bit of use

Shern · #19 11-07-2018, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stretch

If you are likely to be grumbling about "money pits" and "endless trouble" when talking about this car in the future, my advice is to continue to work through the silly simple and gear up to making some measurements if you run out of things to do.

Honestly, this has never been my MO. Even though I drive it daily, this car has been a wonderful hobby for me. I'd only changed oil before buying it.
Meanwhile, I've been through quite a few of your DIYs -most recently the vacuum pump teardown. I know how my future looks. I'm trying to embrace it =)

Stretch · #20 11-07-2018, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shern

Honestly, this has never been my MO. Even though I drive it daily, this car has been a wonderful hobby for me. I'd only changed oil before buying it.
Meanwhile, I've been through quite a few of your DIYs -most recently the vacuum pump teardown. I know how my future looks. I'm trying to embrace it =)

So long as you're prepared for it!

Embrace

Chant

Sing

Hug

What ever gets you through the night - its alright - its alright

The one thing that you might notice is that many people here have more than one vehicle. It might seem like greed (as in my case) but for many it is a simple case of redundancy - when one breaks you need another to go get parts so you can fix the first one or the third or the sixth...

97 SL320 · #21 11-07-2018, 06:16 PM

Lightly press the clutch peddle but not so the clutch disengages. If the noise goes away you could have a crank thrust bearing issue. With engine off, pry and pull the front pulley to check for excessive end play. You can use the factory spec for a measurement.

However, given the roughness of the engine you may be getting gear rattle from the transmission. This is where backlash of non loaded gears bouncing back and forth leads to noise.

In another thread some say to overfill the trans, while this may be a solution to more or less harmless noise, it might lead to lubrication issues. ( aeration. ) https://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/391894-717-400-getrag-5-speed-idle-noise.html

Regardless, if the engine is shaking that badly, fix that first.

Also, the title of this thread isn't very descriptive.

Shern · #22 11-08-2018, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 97 SL320

Lightly press the clutch peddle but not so the clutch disengages. If the noise goes away you could have a crank thrust bearing issue. With engine off, pry and pull the front pulley to check for excessive end play. You can use the factory spec for a measurement.

However, given the roughness of the engine you may be getting gear rattle from the transmission. This is where backlash of non loaded gears bouncing back and forth leads to noise.

In another thread some say to overfill the trans, while this may be a solution to more or less harmless noise, it might lead to lubrication issues. ( aeration. ) https://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/391894-717-400-getrag-5-speed-idle-noise.html

Regardless, if the engine is shaking that badly, fix that first.

Also, the title of this thread isn't very descriptive.

This is good.

After some more poking around, and even more importantly the passage of time, it seems everything has settled down a bit. The engine shake is gone (or my perception of it has been muted), I think I'm looking pretty good.

So I did the clutch test. Now that everything is a bit quieter and easier to assess, depressing the clutch is not actually affecting vibration. It's purely the sound.
And now that I think about it, I replaced the transmission fluid about 4 months ago. It was a little awkward down there and I was unable to replace as much fluid as I drained -I'd say by a difference of 15-20%. I'm going to attempt the over fill method by placing the right side of the car on ramps. Should be able to get a bit more in that way.

I think the obvious is that once you've replaced your mounts you start hearing things you previously couldn't.

Thank you for the wonderful ideas everyone!

97 SL320 · #23 11-08-2018, 06:06 PM

For filling trans and rear ends, I use a top from a gear lube container ( like a mustard nozzle ) and a 6" piece of hose. This way as long at the bottle is facing downwards, you can squeeze it forcing oil upwards into the fill plug.

These tops fit most rectangular oil bottles giving one another option when space is restricted.

Also, make sure the hose does not come off the tapered top.

Shern · #24 11-09-2018, 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 97 SL320

For filling trans and rear ends, I use a top from a gear lube container ( like a mustard nozzle ) and a 6" piece of hose. This way as long at the bottle is facing downwards, you can squeeze it forcing oil upwards into the fill plug.

These tops fit most rectangular oil bottles giving one another option when space is restricted.

Also, make sure the hose does not come off the tapered top.

That is an excellent tip -thank you kindly

vwnate1 · #25 11-09-2018, 10:24 AM

Is there a thread on how to properly adjust these ? .

TIA,

Shern · #26 11-09-2018, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vwnate1

Is there a thread on how to properly adjust these ? .

TIA,

Been looking for this myself —figure it can’t hurt to install one
They don’t seem to come with the mounting bolt that goes through the crossmember. Be nice to know what size that is too

Shern · #27 11-22-2018, 06:27 PM

Finally got half the car on ramps (right front, right rear) and with a large hospital syringe, shot another 600ml into the transmission. Mobil one synthetic ATF. Felt like injecting red blood into the heart of an iron beast. Anyway, it worked. Totally quieted down the transmission rattle. Incredible tip, thank you all.

vwnate1 · #28 11-22-2018, 08:30 PM

FWIW, keep an eye out on trash days ~ I got all four of my older, heavier than currently available steel ramps FREE off the curb .

I don't see how anyone drives up on them though ~ no matter how fast or slow
I drive on them, one always skitters away from the wheel .

I like to occasionally wash the underside of my cars, putting them up on four ramps makes for a relaxed and SAFE job......

Shern · #29 11-22-2018, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vwnate1

FWIW, keep an eye out on trash days ~ I got all four of my older, heavier than currently available steel ramps FREE off the curb .

I don't see how anyone drives up on them though ~ no matter how fast or slow
I drive on them, one always skitters away from the wheel .

I like to occasionally wash the underside of my cars, putting them up on four ramps makes for a relaxed and SAFE job......

I actually jack the car up and slide the ramps under the tires. Absurd, I know, but I feel safer knowing the tire placement was intentional.

vwnate1 · #30 11-22-2018, 10:10 PM

NOT 'absurd' ! .

This is how I do it too .

Once you've seen what happens when a vehicle falls on a Human head, you get really serious about safety all of a sudden ~ ignore your dufus buddies and passer byes who deride any safe practice .