Thanks B, I guess that explains why my local Corn Furnace shop is sold out until next year. Rising prices created a rush to buy a cheaper technology the only problem is inedible corn silage prices here have doubled because of tripled use of rotten or over-dried corn. So are the farmers gouging?

Even at triple prices corn is $7.50 per 1,000,000 btu while Propane is touching $30.

We have technology that can get us 50 MPG all day, everyday. And have had it for a few years now. It is called TDI -- read up on the VW Golf TDI and similar.

But the govt. plays the sulfur BS game to keep the oil companies rich (think lobby groups).

If companies want to make more money, good for them. I would do the exact same thing, but to talk to the public like we are *all* stupid is a different thing. Truth is the prices going up had ZERO to do with hurricanes and EVERYTHING to do with profit. End of story there.

If you think government control is the answer you are REALLY lost! End of story there too.

What's a whine-o-matic? I hope you don't think I drive an automatic like the masses do! My benz is an auto, and that's because I couldn't get it in a stick (and if you read my previous posts you'd know it is the only thing I don't like about the car!), my other two cars are sticks (Jeep and VW). But I can't imagine somebody as bright as you who can talk about Marx, etc. would make an assumption like that. You seem to bright for that. Right? Riiiiiiiiiiight? Anyway.

In the end, if the companies want to make money because they can, that's fine. But don't lie. Simple. Just because most of the American public is stupid doesn't mean we ALL are.

I think part of owning a diesel is that we can get energy locally from restaurants. There are now wood burning boilers that are 85 to 87% efficient (European technology)

I, for one, am trying to get set up to get my energy locally. I would love to see the day that between photovoltaics, wood, and WVO, I can largely tell the oil companies, the utilities, and the oil cartels to go f__k themselves. They have had us by the balls for way too long, and they will continue to squash measures at energy efficiency until the last drop of oil is gone.

Oh, and by the way, a gallon of diesel in the Netherlands is now about $4.70 per gallon. So we don't have it so bad.

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Doug

1987 300TD x 3
2005 E320CDI

Actually that's just what has happened. Three dollar gas began to slow demand quite a bit.
There's a lot to this and I know it looks bad, but to some extent it's the price we pay for having an open market, and since we do perception can account for large over runs in price action. We did get over done and since industry can not expand (or contract - it works both ways if you were around in the mid-eighties) as rapidly as price. Sometimes you have big profits because price runs ahead of expenses.
Also the biggest part of this whole thing is the fall in the dollar. It's hard to get because we earn, and spend dollars, but oil is a world commodity and reflects the dollars fall very much faster than something that is totally domestic. Just as the dollar bottomed early in the year China's demand picked up and traders quickly realized that they could drive up oil just as they've done everything else. They have moved very quickly into developing coal gasification and their growth in demand has begun to fall. So now we're getting the current break in price, but these two months are seasonally lower driving periods, and not yet cold enough for the heating season, so our domestic demand will pick up in late Nov.
Reduce profits by the fall in the dollar and your not looking at anything spectacular. Bad news is the dollar is starting to look weak again, and from a still very low level. To early to say, but further weakness could really get ugly and is already moving the LT % rates up. Hopefully this whole fuel thing will moderate at around $2.75/3.00 for a year or so, but this is still only act one IMO

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89 300E
79 240D
72 Westy
63 Bug sunroof
85 Jeep CJ7
86 Chevy 6.2l diesel PU

"The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane."
Marcus Aurelius

That is EXACTLY what companies are suppsoed to do.

Here's a choice for you to make as an investor of your retirement 401K.

There are two companies (A&B) that produce exactly the same product. Exact in every way. Company A is in business to raise money to save baby harp seals from being beaten to death and so, produces no profit to distribute to investors. Company B sells teh product to maximize profits for investors.

Which one will you invest in?

Bot

The dollar's fall vs the Yuan makes Chinese products less competitive vs American products. And so, the world markets have a moving target of prices to choose from. Worse (for predictability) is that the world economy is not a zero-sum game. A loss here does not drive a gain elsewhere and a gain here does not necessitate a loss elsewhere. As long as consumers are fickle and wealth can be created (through innovation, creativity, raw material extraction, etc), there will not be a zero-sum game.

This is why NOBODY can predict with certainty what will happen with the market. There are too many variables and it is an open system. But that's also why you can make money playing the system if you know a lot about some portion of it.

B

Bot

I don't mind corporations making legal profits . . . but I do mind when they come to Congress, with sachels of lobbying cash, crying their beady eyes out about what a tough time they're having and that they're going to need more than a few credits, subsidies, incentives and other forms of "corporate welfare." Meanwhile, they're spending more on buying back their own stock than they are on investment in infrastructure or exploration.

You guys can talk about supply and demand, damaged oil rigs and what ahave you all you want. My problem is that we are not talking about a item that would be nice to have like a diamond ring or a E55. We are talking about a resource that we as a nation are dependent on to get to and from work, food, etc. I can afford $3 a gallon (barely) but those on a fixed income or who are near the poverty level cannot. Heating prices are going to go through the roof this winter and people might die because of the greed of the american oil companies. That is were it crosses the line for me. I live in DFW. I live 12 miles from work. There is no bus/train or anything thing here. Now by "no" I do not meant that I would have to transfer 3 times and it would be inconvenient. I mean that there is NO public transportation where I live. I do not have a choice. There are no bike lanes, no trails between my house and work. Even if there were, during the summer it can get into the high 90's low 100's and I don’t think my colleges would appreciate me coming into work after I rode for 12 miles in that heat. The point I guess I am making is that for things that are a requirement for life there need to be restrictions on how much that product can be sold for. As far as I am concerned there is no reason that a company could be able to make $10 billion dollars in one quarter in exchange for some people not being able to put food on the table or get little Johnny a warm winter coat because they had to spend an extra $20 a tank to fill up. If we had public transportation, hell they can charge $50 a gallon for all I care because they can choke on it, but we don’t and they should not.

~ steps off soap box ~

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Sent from an agnostic abacus

2014 C250 21,XXX my new DD ** 2013 GLK 350 18,000 Wife's new DD**

- With out god, life is everything.
- God is an ever receding pocket of scientific ignorance that's getting smaller and smaller as time moves on..." Neil DeGrasse Tyson
- You can pray for me, I'll think for you.
- When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.

I don't want to pay for your priorities, sorry. I tell my Congressmen NOT to fund public transportation. Instead, it should be put on equal footing with highways. That is, the highways should pay their own way rather than being subsidized by taxpayers. Or, just remove the taxes that local gov charges rails. Local govs don't tax interstate highways, equilibrate the systems and let them compete from level ground.

It just seems dumb that we have to subsidize BOTH highways and railways. As much as they are traveled by the public and by industry, they should pay their own way.

Bot

I dont care who pays for it all I know is it is not there. As a result, those who can least aford the price hike are being screwed over because there is no alternate.

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Sent from an agnostic abacus

2014 C250 21,XXX my new DD ** 2013 GLK 350 18,000 Wife's new DD**

- With out god, life is everything.
- God is an ever receding pocket of scientific ignorance that's getting smaller and smaller as time moves on..." Neil DeGrasse Tyson
- You can pray for me, I'll think for you.
- When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.

If it is not there, then there are two explanations.

1. Nobody has thought of a way to make money off of a service that everybody needs.

2. Everybody has thought about it and realized it's a turkey and no possibility of profit.

If #1, it's your lucky day. Go forth and create wealth.

If #2, you'll have to extort money from taxpayers to pay for a service that the majority of people think is too much of a turkey to risk as a business venture. In other words, you will saddle every generation with paying for something nobody especially wants to pay for.

Bot

We in this country have made a huge mistake and as the price of oil gets more and more expensive this mistake will become more apparent. The entire infrastructure of this nation is built on premise that there will always be cheap oil, this premise is wrong. We are beginning to pay the price for this mistake and its only going to get worse.

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I'm sick of .sig files

I honestly think that almost the entire forum is well educated on TDi and CDi, why do you think that you are the only one who knows the most elementary ideas?

I agree. I think every individual and every business should be taxed by the same criteria, no deductions, no incentives, nada. That takes all the possibility of bribery (in whatever guise) off the table.

Bot

Because it baffles me that TDI Engine vehicles account for such a small amount of vehicles sold. Oh wait, no it doesn't. The car companies aren't allowed to make anymore because of the Sulfur/Diesel laws. Isn't that right?

I mean why on earth would a person pay for a battery operated car with almost zero performance and that needs have their batteries replaced every three/four years when they can have a TDI?

Explain please.