37 Cord Indiana State Police car - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Txjake · #16 01-27-2013, 01:37 AM

I want it. Saw a sedan in Houston years ago, 70 s. I love these cars. Wasn't the Franklin engine later used in a guppy looking airplane?

Air&Road · #17 01-27-2013, 09:19 AM

Tx, I missed the Franklin engine reference. There was a Franklin engine used in small planes in the postwar years. It was also used in the Bell 47 helicopter and the Tucker automobile. There are still quite a few of these in the air in spite of very limited parts availability.

nate300d · #18 01-27-2013, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Air&Road

Tx, I missed the Franklin engine reference. There was a Franklin engine used in small planes in the postwar years. It was also used in the Bell 47 helicopter and the Tucker automobile. There are still quite a few of these in the air in spite of very limited parts availability.

And the Tucker used a modified version of the Cord 810/812 transmission with the preselect shift. It is interesting in automobile history how parts of defunct car companies have reappeared to be used in another.

One make of automobile that I believe in its day make one of the best and most advanced was Premier Motor Manufacturing Company of Indianapolis, IN. Premier was completely gone by 1926. I could gone on all day about the 1916 Premier at the museum. Towards the end George A. Weidely, one of Premier's two founders) was attempting to market an overhead valve 6 to other car companies. In 1925 his engine was an optional engine offered by Auburn Automobile. The sad thing is E.L. Cord came to power and snuffed out the Weidely engine. Instead Cord wanted the option to be a flat head 8......thing is the flat head 8 was much heavier, less efficient, and not as powerful as the Weidely engine. Yet, the public liked the 8 cylinder better....why? Isn't "bigger always better".......

Txjake · #19 01-27-2013, 10:26 PM

The Republic RC 3 Seabee is what I was thinking of.

nate300d · #20 01-28-2013, 09:56 PM

Gentlemen,
I apologize for the delay. I took dozens of pictures yesterday and I have many Cord pictures to post, but I see there is a size limit for pictures and I am at a loss as to how to show these pictures.

t walgamuth · #21 01-28-2013, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nate300d

Gentlemen,
I apologize for the delay. I took dozens of pictures yesterday and I have many Cord pictures to post, but I see there is a size limit for pictures and I am at a loss as to how to show these pictures.

You can resize them. I am no expert but sometimes you can right click on them and shrink them then save them again with the smaller sizes.

Good luck!

nate300d · #22 01-29-2013, 11:51 AM

I want to answer the question at hand and deal with the pictures later. First off before I discuss the transmission for 810/812 Cord I want to tell a bit of its predecessor which is the L29 Cord and the little known E1 Cord.

The L29 Cord is powered by a flat head 4.9L 8 cylinder 125HP engine that was derived from an Auburn 8 design. The 3 speed transmission was mounted in front of the engine. The linkage to shift the engine involved a long rod that ran along the top of the engine with a jog to clear around the distributor. In the coach the rod passed through the dash, bent up 90 degrees with a very short length and ended with a shift knob. At the transmission the rod bent down a bit at 90 degrees and interfaced a rather long shifter with a ball joint connection. The shifting the 'H' pattern was a pivoting motion left to right and then engaging the gear by drawing the knob back or pushing it forward. The L29's wear heavy and with only 125HP they were not know for speed. Production started in 1929 and ended just before 1932. The depression killed it, but Cord did achieve what he wanted which was a car with his own name on it.

Just prior to the end of the line for the L29 Cord wanted a car with is his own name on it that was bigger than a Duesenberg Model J. (E.L. Cord was a very short man and he obviously had issues with it). The plan for the prototype was a sedan with a V16 engine. Fred Duesenberg was in charge of engineering the power plant. Now realize that the Duesenberg Model J was already out there with 265HP from an 8 cylinder with only a 5:1 compression ratio......why to you need more cylinders? Fred convinced Erret that a V12 would be sufficient. The V12 was basically the current Auburn V12 with a redesigned block to adapt to the front drive transmission. The result was a monster car where the driver's location his just over half of the length of the car from the front. I have sat in this car and you pretty much just see the hood and sky. By the time the E1 was completed Cord realized that selling the E1 at a time when Model J chassis was not a good idea. Erret instructed Fred to destroy the E1. Fred could not bring himself to do it so he had the car dismantled and stored. The recovery and reconstruction of the E1 is another story. It does exist and is part of the collection at Auburn.

I digress for a moment (hell, when am I going to get to the 810/812 transmission?) You will see examples of Duesenberg Model J's from 1929 to 1937. The truth is the chassis were all built in 1929. The plan was to build and sell 500 a year, however, with the depression selling a high end chassis that starts at $8,000 and then needs a body was a tough sell. Only 485 were built. Duesenberg as a part of Auburn Automobile did remain for a while for modifications and engine rebuilds.

Moving ahead......what we know of as the 810/812 Cord was originally intended as a 'Baby Duesenberg', but it was later changed to be marketed as a Cord. The 810/812 was developed at the coffin lid was beginning to close on Auburn Automobile. Its flathead 4.7L V8 was designed by Fred Duesenberg. The design of the body was by Gordon Buehrig. It was a car of many firsts: all steel roof, concealed headlights, concealed fuel cap, flush tail lights. There was no frame as it was a unit body construction. There was so little money to develop the car that a significant change was made to the body, yet this change in my opinion gives it part of its great style. To save money the car was shortened in order that for the sedans the outside sheet metal blanks for the front doors were also used for the back doors. Just an additional cut for the rear wheel area was required. This gives the style an attribute of symmetry and balance between the front and back doors. The company did not have the capital for a press and tooling to make the all steel roof. The solution was to make the roof in seven panels and weld them together. In all of the Cord sedans that I have seen I cannot find a hint of seam.....very well blended.

As with the L29 the 810/812 had a transmission that was mounted in front of the engine. For the design and style the shifter type of the L29 would not work with the 810/812. Along with Bosch the solution was a 4 speed transmission that used vacuum power to shift which was control by electrically operated valves. The shifter consisted of a fixed bar on the steering column that appears to be a shift lever, but at the end of the bar is a tiny shifter for reverse and 4 forward gears. The shifting worked by 'pre selecting' the gear and then when the clutch was disengaged the transmission would shift into the gear selected. For example...you get into your 810 Cord for a ride here is how it goes:
1. Turn the key to 'ON' and close the choke
2. Disengage the clutch and press the gas pedal all the way down to start the engine
3. Once started you can begin to open the choke.
4. shift the selector to 1st gear and let out on the clutch
5. as you accelerate immediately shift to 2nd gear
6. cycle clutch pedal to shift to second.
7. as you accelerate immediately shift to 3rd gear, repeat for 4th gear
The problem that was primarily with the 810's was failure in the shift control and it would come out of gear. I do not know the detail of where the common failure came from. One thing that I learn in December from John Bills who is an 810 owner as well as the archivist at the museum is that both 3rd AND 4th gears were overdrive. Although the 810's suffered from many quality issues they were great for highway traveling at high speeds. Last year during festival time I saw a Cord cabriolet heading towards Auburn in I-69 in Indiana and he was passing cars.

OK, the question was about the transmission....just let me know if there is more that you want to know....it took me a while to get there. I love telling the story of Auburn Automobile and other makes from Indiana.......once where the greatest cars in the world were made.

nate300d · #23 01-29-2013, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

My dad told me he got pulled over by a state policeman in a cord one time when he was a young man. I believe that was when dad was drviing a 36 Chevy.

I always was a little dubious about a Cord as a state police vehicle but am glad to see this picture confirming there was one.

Over on the Studebaker forum someone posted this pic:

I stand corrected. That could be a 1936 810 as it is not supercharged. I had to zoom my eyes in. I have seen pictures of Cord state patrol cars, but all of them were supercharged meaning they would be 1937 812's