Hello all,
I'm trying to get my mind around this.
I have a 2001 subaru, so that means at 150k it needs new head gaskets. I am in the process of pulling the engine out, heads off, and installing everything new.
since the engine got a little overheated once, I am wary of head warpage - I have an old bathroom mirror and feeler gauges, but I found a local machine shop that will grind both heads flat (and clean) for $125.
only problem - When I brought the heads in, the guy specified "cash only, no reciept".

Now this machine shop is attached to a larger (KOI) auto parts store, and had a bunch of V8 and V6 heads laying around when I walked in - so I'm sure they have the necessary tools to do the job. No website that I can find, but their phone # is published and they came recommended by 3 different locals in parts and repair shops.

I'm just suspicious of why a machine shop owner needs to go all under-the-table on something as straightforward is this. Is he just trying to get the numbers down on his books for tax purposes ?

-John

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How does one use an old bathroom mirror to check for flatness? Just curious.Are you sure that you are dealing with the shop owner? Maybe he's an employee looking to use the boss's machine tools to make some money on the side. If he is the shop owner, then he is either trying to avoid paying taxes on the $125 or he just likes to keep things simple. If it's an employee ripping off his boss, then he is to be avoided, IMHO. If it's his shop and he has a good reputation with mechanics, then I would be less worried.

Such a transaction method makes it difficult for him to keep track of certain elements of his income that he should report to the IRS. Naturally you cannot know for certain if he will or will not report this transaction income to the IRS, so your hands are clean. However, if he does the work and there's a problem later, you don't have much recourse except to rely on his honor. Caveat emptor...

There's a few places in my neck of the woods which conducts business this way. Almost all of their business is word of mouth from what I can tell. They do great work, however. It is unusual, and the reality is that most likely they are avoiding taxes. Personally, it's on them and I don't have a dog in the fight. Now, it could be an employee skimming money off the top. That I do have a problem with since the employee is taking no risk in the enterprise, but he's getting the reward. It's a crapshoot unless you have a relationship with the company. Many companies follow the traditional route of receipt, et cet., and do crappy service and you generally have no recourse since who is going to sue over $100 bucks or so ?

It's a toss up-some of the best guys are cash&carry deals, but if they're making a big deal over the receipt then that sounds a little fishy. I would give them the head, let them machine it, and then hold off on payment until they showed me how flat it was.

Also, cheap glass isn't guaranteed to be flat, the thin stuff can flex. An old granite slap from a lab would be great for checking.

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How about a metal straight edge designed for the purpose?

x3 on the reciept stuff.

There are plenty of these under the table types around here as well, but the idea of not giving someone who is paying you money a receipt is ridiculous, even the under the table guys around here will give you a non specific receipt.
I don't like dealing with them as a business, as it creates a tax headache for me, but they at least are willing to demonstrate that I paid them money with a written record. There are plenty of good machine shops that are on the up and up, id go there.

If this guy is trying to misreport income to the point of not giving you any record that you spent money with him, even if its not specific, how do you think he will react if the head wasn't done properly, and you take it back? there is a chance he never saw you before.

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Out of curiosity, what does someone in the area charge when they provide a receipt?

I’d ask the owner asking for cash what happens if there is a problem?

Many times as an individual I specify that I do not need a bill as a negotiation ploy. Saves me money and the business owner is safe from entrapment because I suggested it.

If the employee is skimming or not is really not our concern. The work preformed is the same. Usually I know I am dealing with the owner before mentioning that I do not need a receipt. Probably works the majority of times I ask with smaller business owners.

The sales tax alone is 15 percent here alone remember though. For the mechanics using their service they have to issue bills as they reflect a business cost to the mechanic. That's for cost reasons for his business he needs to claim. Having a receipt is really no guarantee they would rectify a situation anyways. Basically that is more a matter of their integrity.

The only way a bill might help is if you pursed court action. After the frustration of some botched situation and we cool down a little. The cost of a court action usually is not engaged because of the great cost and no assurance we will win. We instead absorb the loss of a bad situation if we have to. The machine shop is recommended so there should be no real issue. You can demand a bill as well but your cost will probably escalate for the job then. Or he will turn it down. Kind of your choice in my mind.

Simplified if having a bill is of no use for tax purposes to you or real protection. I will usually go that way if possible when available. Now once we go above a certain value and there is government backed protection in a transaction or manufactures warranty where you need a bill as proof of purchase is another story.

Technically your position may be even better with no receipt. Nobody wants the information that they are doing this out there. The tax people can really cause issues and the owners are pretty cognizant of that.

Nobody in their right mind wants the tax people on their backside. Audit unclean in one tax area. They call in their counterparts in other tax divisions to the party. Not wanted or risked. So just fix the problem unless you are crazy.

In high tax areas of the world. If you want a written bill for the job in many cases the job will not get done. It is my understanding that in Germany for example. If you do not go along with tradesmen on these so called under the counter or under the table deals you may have a hard time getting a job done. Unless you want to pay a small fortune for it. Just the way the world rotates but more so in countries that have really punative taxation setups.

I will finish with a true story. A local business owner was audited. He accidentally gave them the wrong books. It turned into a real financial bloodbath for him but the misteak was somewhat humourus at the same time. Not to him unfortunately.

I'd want a receipt.

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..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

Excellent point.

I will not buy liberated goods or services for example at any price though. For example I am offered from time to time building supplies that the seller did not actually buy or are just stolden goods.

Under the Canadian somewhat punative taxation system. I think many small businesses could not survive if everything was on the books.

I even think there is a small allowance by the taxation people for this fact. Small business here are really hit hard in Canada with so many fees and taxes it is an almost constant issue and subject. It seems to them that everybody in any official capacity wants an ever growing piece of their action.

For example a retail establishment must have a paper trail. Everything they buy must be accounted for as sold or in stock. They can claim theft or pilferage or damage as a loss item but that escape would be examined if abused.

For a long time I have been well aware that the 9 to 5 employee pretty well is totally taxed with few if any legal or other loopholes. So his only way to save a little on taxation really is these under the table deals and other astute buying practices. In this individuals case on leveling two engine heads if needed I would take the risk . That others may not is okay as well. Like a true professional gambler I run with the odds probably. If stuck it would mean nothing as by and large it happens infrequently enough to still have my position far ahead of where it would be otherwise. At the same time I also pay plenty of taxes and fees that amount to being taxes as well in general.

Cash, local and a hand shake, that's how I like to do business.

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Ditto.