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  #16  
Old 07-12-2002, 07:14 PM
David C Klasse's Avatar
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Location: Mission Hills in the City of San Diego
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Re: It started in 1992

Quote:
Originally posted by Keith Lucy

Ever wonder what the "C" in "C" class stood for?

To me, it means CRAP.

Alright, and to me, it means CHAMP... because it's been nothing but. Do you own a C-class? Alright, then your opinion holds little worth, IMO.
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2006 E350 w/ 155k miles (Daily Driver)

Previous:
1993 300E 3.2L Sedan w/ close to about 300k miles
2003 E500 Brilliant Silver (Had 217k miles when totalled!)
1989 300E with 289,000 miles (had for <1 yr while in HI)
03 CLK 500 cabrio (Mom's)
2006 C230k (Dad's)
1999 S420 (Mom's/Dad's)
2000 C230k Sport sedans
2001 CLK320 Cabrio (Mom's)
1995 C280 My First Mercedes-Benz... (155k miles. EXCEPTIONAL AUTOMOBILE. Was Very hard to let go of!)
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  #17  
Old 07-12-2002, 08:26 PM
Keith Lucy
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Talk to me when it's 11 years old with 150,000 miles
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  #18  
Old 07-12-2002, 08:35 PM
David C Klasse's Avatar
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Location: Mission Hills in the City of San Diego
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Well then that's not long off.

It's already 8 years old (purchased 10/94) and has 130,000 miles... not to offend you, but you're statement is FAR from valid, let alone factual.
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2006 E350 w/ 155k miles (Daily Driver)

Previous:
1993 300E 3.2L Sedan w/ close to about 300k miles
2003 E500 Brilliant Silver (Had 217k miles when totalled!)
1989 300E with 289,000 miles (had for <1 yr while in HI)
03 CLK 500 cabrio (Mom's)
2006 C230k (Dad's)
1999 S420 (Mom's/Dad's)
2000 C230k Sport sedans
2001 CLK320 Cabrio (Mom's)
1995 C280 My First Mercedes-Benz... (155k miles. EXCEPTIONAL AUTOMOBILE. Was Very hard to let go of!)
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  #19  
Old 07-13-2002, 01:09 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 326
Quote:
My friend was told that he dealerships gave coupons to the customers for free services, dinners, and merchandise if they would a) complete the survey b) answer with total satisfaction c) contact the dealership if for any reason they could not do a) or b).


This sounds a bit like bribery to me. This is the reason that I have never put much stock in J.D Powers survey. Tainted results. Answer this question; If Lexus is so great how come my local dealer nearly doulbed the size of its service department?

Anyway if anyone has noticed MB seems to have problems with new models. Just as the chasiss is coming to the end of its production life they finally almost get it just right.
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  #20  
Old 07-15-2002, 12:04 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Northern Calif. (Fairfield Area)
Posts: 2,225
I think the 108,123, and 126 series were some of MBs best work.The 124 was a decent car for those who didn't want a big S class. I was saddened to see the day MB came out with the entry level models starting with the 201 chassis. Mercedes found a way to sell more cars to the masses In my pinion MB should have stayed with only the E and S classes.

Peter
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  #21  
Old 07-15-2002, 01:31 PM
LarryBible
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I guess JD Powers hasn't driven my '01 car. It has been very good with no quality gigs. As long as my cars continue to work I don't really care if theirs do or not.

Have a great day,
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  #22  
Old 07-15-2002, 03:01 PM
Keith Lucy
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This audience may be a little biased

This audience may be a little biased. Most of the readers of this board know how to maintain a car, and will probably get a long life out of any model. It's the common user that will have trouble. Creating an "entry level" car which is targeted at 20-somethings, that most likely don't even know where the dipstick is, is a formula for failure.

David, you will probably have little trouble with YOUR C class, but I will bet that that is due, in no small part, to YOU, and not the car.
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  #23  
Old 07-15-2002, 06:00 PM
agupta
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As I recently posted in the ML forum, I went to buy an ML (I am/was quite a die hard mercedes fanatic!), then went to Acura after that, and bought an MDX! The MDX was simply superior to the ML in every single respect, I just couldn't justify paying more for an inferior vehicle.

I have had a 190E for 11 years, and its been quite a trouble.

The mercedes brand is certainly going down. After all, how long can you keep making bad vehicles and expect people to pay more for them? Amongst my numerous friends, who have bought 30K-50K range cars in the last 5 years (and I can recall at least 15 of them rightaway), NONE of them bought a mercedes - most of them bought Audi, BMW, Acura, and lexus. Not one went for mercedes. What does that say - they can't all be wrong and stupid!!

Its just a matter of time, if they don't pull up their socks pretty darn soon!
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  #24  
Old 07-16-2002, 07:19 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Raleigh, NC currently residing in KL, Malaysia
Posts: 460
Hello everyone,
I have been browsing this forum for two years now and have decided to register so that i could respond to this thread.
My father bought a Mercedes 170Va in 1950 and replaced it with a 170DS in 1954. This car ran everyday until 1980 (with a few exceptions) and ran up 800,000 miles. I have considerable experience with cars like W120,121,108, 115, 116, 123, 124, 126 and now a 2000 W163. Mercedes Benz has undergone many changes thru these generations of cars BUT the fundamentals are still there. It is a car that feels like an engineer designed it and then test drove it before releasing the product for sale. Lets not forget, the primary goal of the company is to make money nowadays, so we may never see technological tour de force (and a loss leader) like the W100 again, but the company has survived and continues to make well thought out products.
I have experience of the JD Power surveys, where the dealer shoves a prepared survey sheet to the customer (Mitsubishi did it to my niece after every service) so how can it be an indication of *quality*?
Have a good day.
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  #25  
Old 07-16-2002, 07:42 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Chicago,IL
Posts: 230
You know what, when the smoke clears, I don't know what to believe anymore. I can only tell you that my year old Civic has been flawless with only an SRS light coming on.

I defintely feel that Mercedes is no longer what it used to be, simply because their interior and exterior no longer seems to exude the luxury and elegance that it did in previous years. Does this mean that I would buy an old Benz instead? Possibly, but at one point I would become fed up with constantly paying a lot of attention to the vehicle just to keep it running. Don't get me wrong, I am a car freak, however my mechanical skills are not all there plus I don't have anywhere to perform labor anyway.

It would be great to drive one brand of vehicle throughout my whole life but I feel that I couldn't do that. Besides being too expensive for me, Mercedes doesn't measure up to Lexus.
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  #26  
Old 07-16-2002, 11:34 PM
David C Klasse's Avatar
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Location: Mission Hills in the City of San Diego
Posts: 2,352
Quote:
Originally posted by nachi11744
apart from the fact that it demolished a GMC Silverado PU in an offset front crash last year (no frame damage to ML, GMC written off).

Now that is what owning a Mercedes is about! What a cool story. NO frame damage to the Benz!
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2006 E350 w/ 155k miles (Daily Driver)

Previous:
1993 300E 3.2L Sedan w/ close to about 300k miles
2003 E500 Brilliant Silver (Had 217k miles when totalled!)
1989 300E with 289,000 miles (had for <1 yr while in HI)
03 CLK 500 cabrio (Mom's)
2006 C230k (Dad's)
1999 S420 (Mom's/Dad's)
2000 C230k Sport sedans
2001 CLK320 Cabrio (Mom's)
1995 C280 My First Mercedes-Benz... (155k miles. EXCEPTIONAL AUTOMOBILE. Was Very hard to let go of!)
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  #27  
Old 07-17-2002, 12:22 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Raleigh, NC currently residing in KL, Malaysia
Posts: 460
Hello,
IIRC, the *older* (pre-80s) cars can be described as *rugged* and *tough*, I certainly never thought of MB tex as luxury or elegance ! My point is that each generation of vehicles has been an improvement (safety, strength, performance, fuel efficiency and luxury etc.). Heck, they offer more than just five colors now. The 1989 W124 I drive has had one power window motor, valve stem seals, timing cover reseal, trans reseal and new shocks(which it did not really need) and has clocked up 145,000 miles. It will still sustain 125mph and run to 134. Perhaps I got a *good one*.
The choice is yours, but I would still put my money on a Mercedes.
Unfortunately, many of the really ground breaking models will never make it to the US, the ML270CDI or the E220CDI for example.
I hate to rub it in, but Lexus is just a badge engineered Toyota, the RX300 is a Toyota Harrier and the LS430 is a Celsior.
BTW, my two year old ML has had no problems at all, apart from the fact that it demolished a GMC Silverado PU in an offset front crash last year (no frame damage to ML, GMC written off).
Take care
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  #28  
Old 07-17-2002, 12:58 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: St. Albert, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 3,492
With 120,000 kilometers on my C230, it's been more reliable and trouble free than ANY Japanese car we've owned.

And the interior quality and materials are similar to the W140.
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1998 C230 "Black Betty" 240K

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  #29  
Old 07-17-2002, 01:53 PM
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Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: SW Colorado USA
Posts: 296
My new lemon????

Lots of views being expressed here. The one regarding other manufacturers "bribing" people or pressuring them to fill out "excellent" surveys is not foriegn to MB. On the day we bought our new '01 S600 the salesman spent more time worried about his survey score than our ability to work the controls of the car. This was followed up by more than one call regarding the survey. IMO MB is fudging surveys as much as anybody out there.

Now for my MB horror story. The first repair the car required was on the way home from the dealership. The oil level sensor on the car had failed, giving a low oil warning. What kills me is that MB omitted a dipstick on this car so that I can not even check the oil manually anymore. That is STUPID. Next we leave the dealer from having the sensor checked out and once on the highway the car starts shudderring very badly. Turns out that my size 12 bumped the e-brake pedal on the way in. The parking brake light did not illuminate, but it was enough to engage it. Now the rear rotors are warped and I need to check the release every time I get in the car to avoid this problem. The trunk lid is mis-aligned, about a 1/4 inch off on a $130,000 car. The latest and greatest issue is a serious drivability problem for which it is in the shop for the second time as we speak. When making a pass at highway speeds the engine falters above 5000 rpm. For some reason there is un-burned fuel getting through as evidenced by a bad sulfer smell from the exhaust. If I let the car run up to 5-6000 rpm in third gear it will not go any faster, it will not shift to fourth. The top speed of my top of the line V12 powered Mercedes is 105 mph.

At this point I am praying that they are NOT able to fix this car so I can force them to buy it back. It has under 6000 miles on it. It is a spectacular machine, I love it, when it runs. Seems to me that JD Powers is right on the money.

Problem now is what would I replace it with? Lexus is way to staid for my tastes and the new BMW is way to ugly for the road. Sure would be nice if MB would get its act together and build them like my last two G-Wagens. Those are indestructable.
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  #30  
Old 07-17-2002, 02:38 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 463
It is very angering.

MB's decision to chase volume in my opinion is a stupid one.

Why does every business constantly chase sales growth???

I believe that "prestige" brands should not even consider that.

Why not focus on personnel and purchasing and operations savings to improve "the buttom line" which is all these nob gobblers care about.

These are publicly traded companies here we are talking about.
Managing directors receive a bigger bonus (usually more than their salary) if they improve the net profit of the company.

This is a discusting trend we have all seen for some time in business.

Which company does this the most? Ford's "PAG"

How do I know? I am not at liberty to say but I can say trust me here.

Mark Fields is in the helm of PAG now, he believes he can increase net income in the company 9 FOLD by the end of 2006. This is what he said in a recent interview with Time Magazine.

He did this with Mazda but, look at their junk past and present. Cheap materials can be a considered a complement to describing how that scrap is built.

There is a big reason PAG will fail. Wolfgang Reitzle is gone.

Read the August issue of Automobile Magazine. That is the tip of the ice berg.
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