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  #1  
Old 03-18-2003, 01:28 AM
azhari
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190e 1.8 tapping???

As I drove off this morning from a cold startup, I noticed a faint tapping sound (sewing-machine like) with the accelerator pushed.

It gets fainter and disappears when I release the accelerator (with car moving).

While stationary, with the accelerator pushed, it's not there. When I drive off, it's there again on acceleration.

After about 5-10mins of driving, it's gone.

Today, however, the tapping wasn't apparent in the morning. In the afternoon, after 45 minutes of driving, I heard it on the highway for about 3 mins before it disappeared.

What gives?

Doesn't seem like the timing chain to me coz it's not apparent at all times. Besides, there are double row timing chains on my 1.8 so I guess I need'nt worry about them, right?

Lifters?The tapping is driving me crazy...

Anyone?

Azhari
Babybenz 1991 190e 1.8
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  #2  
Old 03-18-2003, 01:31 AM
azhari
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Double row timing chain

Incidentally, I'd also be interested if anyone can tell me how to check on my timing chains' integrity eg should I look for slack, etc.

Thanks.

Azhari
Babybenz 1991 190e 1.8
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  #3  
Old 03-18-2003, 11:38 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Madison, Wis.
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Hi there:

Regarding the checking of the timing chain. I have been told by several people that the timing chain on the 190e (I have a '93 190e 2.6) doesn't really ever need adjusting because it's a "single row" chain versus the bigger engines that have multiple row chains. So you should be Ok there...

Hope this is somewhat helpful.

Take care-
Michael.
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  #4  
Old 03-18-2003, 11:56 AM
yal's Avatar
yal yal is offline
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Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: New York, Long Island
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I beg to differ. On earlier 190e's the timing chain was the single row chain and it did have to be replaced specifically in the 2.3 and lower engines. Look under the oil cap and see if you can spot the chain. If it is a single row chain it need to be changed, I forget the schedule. It would not suprise me one bit that the 1.8 motor has a single row chain.
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  #5  
Old 03-18-2003, 12:06 PM
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That's interesting that you say that, yal. I've read several posts on here that 190e owners have never had to change their timing chains. But you could very well be right ... that's just what I was told... I'm wondering if the 2.3 16v might be in a different class because of its design.

-Michael.
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  #6  
Old 03-18-2003, 04:16 PM
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azhari,

my car is a 1993-1.8 litre spec car-i disagree with the other posters who state that 190e cars have single row timing chain-mine has the dual row chain.

i know that some of the the earlier 190e models had a single row of chain associated with breakage with its resultant damage to the pistons/head,hence the need to replace the chain at about 100k miles.

the dual chains do last a longer time with regular oil/filter changes as per the maintenance schedule.

as a matter of co-incidence ,my car taps intemittently on cold starts and sometimes when warmed up.

it used to be a lot worse when my cooling fan was not working and the car used to run hot in traffic-the switch was replaced,the fan started working,car no longer ran extra hot in traffic and the tapping sound is less pronounced.

you could peep through the oil filler cap to diagnose whether you have a single or dual row chain

hope this helps.
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  #7  
Old 03-18-2003, 06:17 PM
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yal yal is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by sunil190e-1.8
.....i disagree with the other posters who state that 190e cars have single row timing chain-mine has the dual row chain.....

i know that some of the the earlier 190e models had a single row of chain ......

You contradicted yourself in your post
Very amusing.
If you read my post I did say that some of the earlier 190es had single row chains and it was abandoned later on.
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  #8  
Old 03-18-2003, 09:21 PM
azhari
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It's a double row timing chain on my 1.8.

The tapping sound seems to come and go.

When it comes, it is more apparent at higher revs (2000rpm) and seems to fade away as the revs go down.

It sounds faster and slightly louder when the accelerator is pushed.

Could it be drivetrain related, coz the tapping is not there when I rev in P.

It is only there when in Drive.



Azhari
Babybenz 1991 190e 1.8
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  #9  
Old 03-19-2003, 03:23 AM
sunil190e-1.8's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally posted by yal
I beg to differ. On earlier 190e's the timing chain was the single row chain and it did have to be replaced specifically in the 2.3 and lower engines. Look under the oil cap and see if you can spot the chain. If it is a single row chain it need to be changed, I forget the schedule. It would not suprise me one bit that the 1.8 motor has a single row chain.
your last sentence above is a contradiction as well.
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  #10  
Old 03-20-2003, 10:48 PM
azhari
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Coincidence?

I don't know if it's a coincidence, but the intermittent tapping started a day after I started driving in S mode (fulltime).This was about a week ago.

Two days back, I put the transmission back to E mode. Although the tapping was still there initially, it seems to have disappeared.

Coincidence?

Btw, the tapping seems to come from the engine bay near the passenger side firewall.

Of course it can only be heard from inside while accelerating.

With the bonnet open in P or N, there is no tapping.

Tapping seems to correspond with engine speed when it comes.



Anyone?

Azhari
Babybenz 1991 190e 1.8
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  #11  
Old 03-21-2003, 06:10 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 80
Talking Merc problems

Hi azhari! I have fixed most of my car problems and the latest was the sagging spring on the front driver's side. My techie replaced the top and bottom spring pads on that side and has made the front exactly level now. Was looking a bit awkward at Christmas time with a sagging right side. I'm not that fat and heavy....blame the previous owner! The auto box has been tweaked with the vacc modulator and the gearchange has been improved so that the early morning 2 to 3 kick in the back has been defeated, it doesn't hang for a few minutes like before. It even feels like its starting on 1 and quickly changes to 2, but 3 and 4 change normally. I also had to replace the kickdown switch which was "broken" by some earlier leadfoot. Thats why it refused to change down when I tried to activate it going uphill. All other remaining problems are minor like the centre airflow roller was glued on so won't move, the driver's side door panel has an elbow dent and the boot lock is damaged but working. Cheers! How's your brother's Merc?
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  #12  
Old 03-23-2003, 01:07 AM
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Location: Niantic,Ct. Attawan
Posts: 143
Have you checked oil press. gauge? How many miles on oil? My Miata likes 25k oil changes, less ticking (tapping) when mild out-thinner oil getting circulated better?
Wish you luck! Keep us posted.
-M
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  #13  
Old 03-23-2003, 01:44 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: visalia ca
Posts: 368
might try using mobil 1 15-50 oil. has been helping with this
noise.
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  #14  
Old 03-23-2003, 02:22 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Finland
Posts: 160
From what you describe, azari, it sound like you got a valve lifter that doesn't do its job very well. The sound is because it looses oil pressure and a clearance between valve and lifter occur. If this is the case you have got hydralic "selfadjusting" lifters.

16 valve engines came with mechanical adjusted lifters

One thing you could try is to change oil if not done recently, and make sure you use one that is within specs for the engine. You will find this information in your manual.

If one/several lifters gone bad you got to options:
1. Have a trained mech to look at it. He can determine if it need to be adjusted or replaced (this is said to be a non-DIY)
2. Change the bad one...
__________________
'87 MBenz 190E 2,3 8vlv
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  #15  
Old 03-23-2003, 09:52 PM
azhari
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Btw, oil change just done a month ago.Have done 3000km since then.

Oil pressure gauge shows 2.5 after warmup and 3 during accelleration.

Current mileage is 298,000km.

Don't know if mine has hydraulic self-adjusting lifters coz it's a 1991 1.8.

If it is the lifters, would I hear it regardless whether in D while driving or revving in P?

When the tapping is heard, it is usually while I am driving. If I stop in N or P and rev, it is not heard.When I shift to D and drive again, the sound is there.Then it goes away as mysteriously as it came.

Used to think it only happens in the mornings.But looks like sometimes it comes even though the engine is warm.

However, for the past 2 days, I haven't heard it.

Wierd.

The lifters can be inspected by lifting off the valve cover, right?



Azhari
Babybenz 1991 190e 1.8
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