Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 02-08-2014, 01:05 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: The slums of Beverly Hills
Posts: 8,057
Picked up a 1997 E300

Yesterday I bought our 4th MB and second diesel in the family. The only things I've been able to find wrong with it so far is the ignition key seems to get stuck (it takes 2 or 3 tries to remove it some times), the light in the climate control unit light bulb is burned out, it needs a new plastic knob for the mirror switch, the center console arm rest/cover is worn out and it pulls to the right a little bit. I'm going to get it up on a lift next week to inspect the suspension and maybe get an alignment. Also planning to pull the intake manifold to clean out the EGR crap, delete EGR, rebuild injectors and if I'm feeling really adventurous maybe glow plugs too.
I paid $3500 which seemed a bit steep to me for the mileage but the previous owner took meticulous care of it and it has new tires so I guess thats a fair price, I'm not really sure. The PO's wife thought it was too slow and wanted to get rid of it but it doesn't seem nearly as slow as I would have expected for a non turbo. Definitely slower than my 87 by a wide margin. My dad likes this particular model year because its the first year with the 5 speed auto and the last year of no diesel smog check in CA. Whatever floats his boat I guess. It should make a descent daily driver for him for a couple of years.











Also I'm suddenly a huge fan of LA's metro rail system. $1.50 to go from Culver City to downtown Long Beach in 90 minutes, BARGAIN! Much cheaper and cleaner than the Bay Area's BART system which I'm far too familiar with.

__________________
CENSORED due to not family friendly words

Last edited by tjts1; 02-18-2014 at 01:36 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 02-08-2014, 02:32 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 7,534
Check the shifter bushings.

If the trans isn't fully in park, the ignition lock won't release the key. Any, the foot brake pedal must be UP to complete the release. There is a cable that runs from the trans to a lever on the brake pedal then to the ignition lock.

You might have other issues but that is a start.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 02-08-2014, 03:57 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Newport News, VA
Posts: 368
I have the exact same car. The only way I can tell it is not mine is that I have a few pixels out on my temp. display.

I just had my EGR apart recently. Many have said that fooling with the '97 EGR will bring on the check engine light due to the sensor on top of the valve. One poster provided filtered air instead of exhaust to the EGR, but that mod will flunk the inspection where I live because the emission stuff must appear unmodified. It appears to me that the sensor measures the opening of the valve and not the flow of exhaust gas. I believe one could block the flow using a plate in place of the gasket between the valve and the intake. I would also remove the butterfly plate from the flapper in the intake where the exhaust enters the intake. This should free up the breathing. The EGR system would appear to be unmodified and I do not think it will bring on a check engine light. I did not modify mine as I was trying to get rid of a check engine light. Now that I have solved that problem, I plan to disable the EGR when the weather improves. If you try the above, let us know if your CEL stays off.
__________________
'97 E 300 D
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 02-08-2014, 04:07 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: The slums of Beverly Hills
Posts: 8,057
Quote:
Originally Posted by 97 SL320 View Post
Check the shifter bushings.

If the trans isn't fully in park, the ignition lock won't release the key. Any, the foot brake pedal must be UP to complete the release. There is a cable that runs from the trans to a lever on the brake pedal then to the ignition lock.

You might have other issues but that is a start.
I think the problem us definitely in the tumbler. If I wiggle it around enough it comes out. If I only cycle the key without cranking the engine it will pop right out. If I start the engine, turn it off without moving the shifter out of P it still wont come out without some effort. If I try to remove it with the shifter in any gear other than P it won't come out no matter what. As far as I can tell the shifter has no pay in it. I'll remove the tumbler and take a look at it. Maybe try some dry lubricant.
__________________
CENSORED due to not family friendly words

Last edited by tjts1; 02-08-2014 at 04:50 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 02-08-2014, 04:07 PM
jake12tech's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 2,881
There is an adjustment you can make to the latch to the armrest to most likely rectify it. These ignition tumblers fail similar to the w124s. If this is the issue why it is sticking, you can decide to make it a cheap purchase or $600.00, your choice. You'll need radio removal keys which can be made or bought to remove the CC unit.
__________________
Only diesels in this driveway.
2005 E320 CDI 243k Black/Black
2008 Chevy 3500HD Duramax 340k
2004 Chevy 2500HD Duramax 220k
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 02-08-2014, 05:17 PM
Skid Row Joe's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,489
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjts1 View Post
Yesterday I bought our 4th MB and second diesel in the family. The only things I've been able to find wrong with it so far is the ignition key seems to get stuck (it takes 2 or 3 tries to remove it some times), the light in the climate control unit light bulb is burned out, it needs a new plastic knob for the mirror switch, the center console arm rest/cover is worn out and it pulls to the right a little bit. I'm going to get it up on a lift next week to inspect the suspension and maybe get an alignment. Also planning to pull the intake manifold to clean out the EGR crap, delete EGR, rebuild injectors and if I'm feeling really adventurous maybe glow plugs too.
I paid $3500 which seemed a bit steep to me for the mileage but the previous owner took meticulous care of it and it has new tires so I guess thats a fair price, I'm not really sure. The PO's wife thought it was too slow and wanted to get rid of it but it doesn't seem nearly as slow as I would have expected for a non turbo. Definitely slower than my 87 by a wide margin. My dad likes this particular model year because its the first year with the 5 speed auto and the last year of no diesel smog check in CA. Whatever floats his boat I guess. It should make a descent daily driver for him for a couple of years.





Also I'm suddenly a huge fan of LA's metro rail system. $1.50 to go from Culver City to downtown Long Beach in 90 minutes, BARGAIN! Much cheaper and cleaner than the Bay Area's BART system which I'm far too familiar with.
That's a hell of a good price for that car. Nice looking except for the gangsta' window tint. The 1st year of the 5-speed AT may have started with the 96 E300, not the 97.
__________________
'06 E320 CDI
'17 Corvette Stingray Vert
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 02-08-2014, 10:46 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: The slums of Beverly Hills
Posts: 8,057
I fixed the ignition. Removed the tumbler, cleaned it and regressed it, works fine now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nelbur View Post
I just had my EGR apart recently. Many have said that fooling with the '97 EGR will bring on the check engine light due to the sensor on top of the valve. One poster provided filtered air instead of exhaust to the EGR, but that mod will flunk the inspection where I live because the emission stuff must appear unmodified. It appears to me that the sensor measures the opening of the valve and not the flow of exhaust gas. I believe one could block the flow using a plate in place of the gasket between the valve and the intake. I would also remove the butterfly plate from the flapper in the intake where the exhaust enters the intake. This should free up the breathing. If you try the above, let us know if your CEL stays off.
I wired open the throttle plate ahead of the EGR valve (didn't touch the EGR valve itself) and within 5 miles it triggered the CEL with a P0400 code (low EGR flow). It must be measuring flow rate some how.

EDIT:
Looking at this:
http://bayhas.com/mercedes/w210/contents/engine606__enginecomb.htm
The engine has B28/3 (EGR valve) and B28 (pressure sensor). Since this is a naturally aspirated engine the pressure sensor must only measure vacuum caused by altitude or the pressure control valve (102) which I wired open, hence the CEL. I guess the trick would be to feed the pressure sensor a variable vacuum source that way it will think 102 is still functioning. Since the pressure control valve is disabled I could use the variable vaccum source that was running to 102 and instead send it to 28.
Tomorrow I'm going to drive it as is with the the pressure control valve wired open to see if it triggers the CEL again then I'll reset the cell and route a vacuum hose from the Y31/2 vacuum transducer to the pressure sensor and see if the CEL is triggered again. If I figure out how to defeat the vacuum control valve I'll move on to deleting the EGR.

The EGR valve is a lift sensor, can't measure flow.
http://bayhas.com/mercedes/w210/contents/images/techtrain/030bottom.gif

EDIT 2:
__________________
CENSORED due to not family friendly words

Last edited by tjts1; 02-09-2014 at 03:55 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 02-09-2014, 10:08 AM
VW1300's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Just west of Baltimore
Posts: 465
Congratulations! I think you did fine on price. Somewhere on this forum is a thread that describes modifying the EGR on the NA OM606 engine, it leaves the EGR itself as-is but cuts the tube that goes from the exhaust up to the EGR, and inserts a small air filter.

I was having the P0400 EGR code issues, as well as some drivability problems, and this mostly solved the problem although every few weeks I still get P0200/P0400, so this can take time to sort out.
__________________
Charlie

---------------------------
'66 VW 1300 96K miles
'97 E300D 239K miles
'85 300D 203K miles (sold Sep 2012)


Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 02-09-2014, 02:47 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Newport News, VA
Posts: 368
Good work tjts1. I was not even aware of the pressure sensor for the EGR. So if I understand what is going on during the test sequence, the butterfly valve strangles the engine briefly and the pressure sensor measures the vacuum, then the EGR valve is opened and the pressure sensor measures the reduction in vacuum due to the exhaust inflow. That explains why the filtered air approach works, and why my suggestion would not work. Thanks, now figure out how to fool it, please. :-)
__________________
'97 E 300 D
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 02-09-2014, 05:03 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: The slums of Beverly Hills
Posts: 8,057
Quote:
Originally Posted by nelbur View Post
Good work tjts1. I was not even aware of the pressure sensor for the EGR. So if I understand what is going on during the test sequence, the butterfly valve strangles the engine briefly and the pressure sensor measures the vacuum, then the EGR valve is opened and the pressure sensor measures the reduction in vacuum due to the exhaust inflow. That explains why the filtered air approach works, and why my suggestion would not work. Thanks, now figure out how to fool it, please. :-)
Exactly!
I tried feeding the pressure sensor a false vacuum source without any luck. I don't think I can defeat the throttle valve without some electronic trickery. The diagnostic system is way too aggressive. The EGR valve itself should be simple enough to defeat with a small air filter as previously mentioned.

We went over to Malibu today and ran across my sort of twin for sale.
98 274k miles, $7900 I'm sure the turbo is nice but not that nice.
__________________
CENSORED due to not family friendly words

Last edited by tjts1; 02-18-2014 at 01:37 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 02-09-2014, 05:11 PM
Skid Row Joe's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,489
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjts1 View Post

We went over to Malibu today and ran across my sort of twin for sale.
98 274k miles, $7900 I'm sure the turbo is nice but not that nice.
That's a nucking futz price!
__________________
'06 E320 CDI
'17 Corvette Stingray Vert
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 02-09-2014, 05:31 PM
RunningTooHot's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Here
Posts: 898
Yeah, that nuking futz priced car has been for sale for a LONG time, and the owner hasn't dropped the price at all since I first contacted him. I don't remember specifically, but IIRC there was something amiss on the carfax when I ran it. I don't remember if it was an accident, or if the car originated in the rust belt or something. But don't hold me to it - I ran *dozens* of reports while I was on the hunt.
__________________
Current rolling stock:
2001 E55 183,000+ Newest member of the fleet.
2002 E320 83,000 - The "cream-puff"!
1992 500E 217,000+
1995 E300D 412,000+
1998 E300D 155,000+
2001 E320 227,000+
2001 E320 Wagon, 177,000+

Prior MBZ’s:
1952 220 Cab A
1966 300SE
1971 280SE
1973 350SLC (euro)
1980 450SLC
1980 450SLC (#2)
1978 450SLC 5.0
1984 300D ~243,000 & fondly remembered
1993 500E - sorely missed.
1975 VW Scirocco w/ slightly de-tuned Super-Vee engine - Sold after 30+ years.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 02-09-2014, 07:01 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: The slums of Beverly Hills
Posts: 8,057
HA good to know I'm not the only one crazy enough to spot these things on the side of the road.
__________________
CENSORED due to not family friendly words

Last edited by tjts1; 02-09-2014 at 08:01 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 02-09-2014, 07:54 PM
RunningTooHot's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Here
Posts: 898
Oh - jeez! I forgot to say congrats on the purchase tjts1...
__________________
Current rolling stock:
2001 E55 183,000+ Newest member of the fleet.
2002 E320 83,000 - The "cream-puff"!
1992 500E 217,000+
1995 E300D 412,000+
1998 E300D 155,000+
2001 E320 227,000+
2001 E320 Wagon, 177,000+

Prior MBZ’s:
1952 220 Cab A
1966 300SE
1971 280SE
1973 350SLC (euro)
1980 450SLC
1980 450SLC (#2)
1978 450SLC 5.0
1984 300D ~243,000 & fondly remembered
1993 500E - sorely missed.
1975 VW Scirocco w/ slightly de-tuned Super-Vee engine - Sold after 30+ years.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 02-09-2014, 08:31 PM
jay_bob's Avatar
Control Freak
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 3,942
Nice looking car for $4k, you got a good deal.

Back to a couple items on your punch list:
- Climate bulb, get a set of DIN radio removal keys. You will see a couple slots in the bottom of the AUTO buttons. Insert the keys (mind the L and R) and pop the unit out. There is a single grain of rice bulb in the bottom.
- Mirror switch, you will have to get a whole new switch assembly from eBay or a yard. It is all one integrated assembly that puts all the switch operations (windows, mirror, trunk pop, air bag off light) on 4 wires on CAN bus. Not at all like a 124.
- EGR delete, Jememy5848 has a 96 like that and I think he figured out how to beat the system and he is in CA. Do an advanced search for 606 EGR delete and Jeremy5848.
- Shifter/key interlock - not sure on the 97 but on the 98 (that has the egg shaped key, with no blade) there is no cable between key and shifter, it is all electrically interlocked.

And once you get it running be sure to check out my analog cell phone replacement mod over in the audio forum.

__________________
The OM 642/722.9 powered family
Still going strong
2014 ML350 Bluetec (wife's DD)
2013 E350 Bluetec (my DD)

both my kids cars went to junkyard in 2023
2008 ML320 CDI (Older son’s DD) fatal transmission failure, water soaked/fried rear SAM, numerous other issues, just too far gone to save (165k miles)
2008 E320 Bluetec (Younger son's DD) injector failed open and diluted oil with diesel, spun main bearings (240k miles)

1998 E300DT sold to TimFreeh
1987 300TD sold to vstech
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:38 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2026, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2024 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page